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GR86 General Topics (2nd Gen 2022+ Toyota 86) General topics for the GR86 second-gen 86


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Old 02-15-2022, 01:54 PM   #141
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You may have hit on the actual solution here, its a generational thing, which I never thought of.

My recollection is exactly as yours. In high school and college I owned at least a half dozen cars, some manual some auto, some fast some slow. Never did the discussion of the transmission come up. What mattered were the results.
That is a big part of it. And many of the older guys just never had a good AT or have managed to forget just how bad some MTs were when every memory is shaded by nostalgia.
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Old 02-15-2022, 01:59 PM   #142
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You may have hit on the actual solution here, its a generational thing, which I never thought of.

My recollection is exactly as yours. In high school and college I owned at least a half dozen cars, some manual some auto, some fast some slow. Never did the discussion of the transmission come up. What mattered were the results.
It's the "dying of the MT's" that brings the "hardcore MT guys" out to make such statements. Back in the day, the options were quite unlimited and everyone got their pickings. Now we're at a point where the world is moving on and these "MT guys" are just not ready to accept it. It is what it is and I'm sure we'll hear more and more speak out about it as time goes by and the last MT's are around.
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Old 02-15-2022, 02:11 PM   #143
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It's the "dying of the MT's" that brings the "hardcore MT guys" out to make such statements. Back in the day, the options were quite unlimited and everyone got their pickings. Now we're at a point where the world is moving on and these "MT guys" are just not ready to accept it. It is what it is and I'm sure we'll hear more and more speak out about it as time goes by and the last MT's are around.
Yep
My mother drove MTs all the time.
My Grandmother drove MTs almost exclusively.
My Great Grandmother drove nothing but MTs since that is all that existed.
They didn't give two shits about "the feels" or being "engaged" in fact they didn't think anything at all about it since it was just the way it was.
Now if you want to feel like some sort of hardcore "enthusiast" you have to demean anybody that doesn't drive manual as some sort of loser that just doesn't "get it".
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Old 02-15-2022, 02:34 PM   #144
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Yep
My mother drove MTs all the time.
My Grandmother drove MTs almost exclusively.
My Great Grandmother drove nothing but MTs since that is all that existed.
They didn't give two shits about "the feels" or being "engaged" in fact they didn't think anything at all about it since it was just the way it was.
Now if you want to feel like some sort of hardcore "enthusiast" you have to demean anybody that doesn't drive manual as some sort of loser that just doesn't "get it".
And they were all rwd without traction control too..

My Grandmother, to my knowledge only ever had one car that wasn't RWD/Manual until her last car that was a Buick Regal in the '90s.

Oh wait, she did own a rear engine 6 cylinder for about 8 years. A yellow 1968 Corvair. She tore up the country roads in that thing. She was a bit of a racer girl.
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Old 02-15-2022, 02:49 PM   #145
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She was a bit of a racer girl.
Haven`t they evolved and multiplied nowadays.
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Old 02-15-2022, 02:59 PM   #146
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Question for those who think they are superior Manual only driving gods/snobs :
Does your dash show a warning light on permanently that suggest you have the hill holding option on and available?

Which leads my thoughts to my other gripe about new driver oriented cars offering a manual only but has a push button parking brake.(such as a Civic SI)
I need a true emergency hand brake with my 3rd pedal for my winter driving adventures. And I dislike ABS in the winter...

I hate getting old. I find myself reactionary towards the new car tech being forced on to me.
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Old 02-15-2022, 03:09 PM   #147
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And they were all rwd without traction control too..

My Grandmother, to my knowledge only ever had one car that wasn't RWD/Manual until her last car that was a Buick Regal in the '90s.

Oh wait, she did own a rear engine 6 cylinder for about 8 years. A yellow 1968 Corvair. She tore up the country roads in that thing. She was a bit of a racer girl.
My Grandmother drove her 64 Galaxy 500 390, 4 speed for about 20 years. It was even modded by my uncle and had an upgraded carb and cam. She shut down many a young guy that thought she was a joke when driving that car. Unfortunately there was not enough of it left to save when she finally gave it up and it went to scrap or I would still have it today.
She was a huge NASCAR fan, traveled to the Daytona 500 almost every year from the late 60s to the early 80s, and we have many pictures of her partying with Richard Petty. She still watched every single race, knew all the drivers and the specs on what they drove when she was well into her 90s.
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Old 02-15-2022, 03:12 PM   #148
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Literally the post I quoted of yours that you are quoting of me.

Postception

Uhh did you even read the post? Did you read the threads? Did you read Ernest72s comments? I'm not the one who said this AT (or any AT or any PDK) is "good" or "bad" - the people that are saying that are the people that are the people defending the AT in the twins or the PDK or an AT in general.

I don't understand why they are doing it because they don't need defending from me - I've never once offered an opinion about how "good" or "bad" any non-manual transmission is. I don't have an opinion there because I don't care - it is not a car that I would consider buying regardless of how "good" or "bad" the non-manual transmission is.

I am not arguing about the general merits of AT vs. MT or that one is good and one is bad. I don't understand how this is so hard for you (and others) to understand.

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Old 02-15-2022, 03:21 PM   #149
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I have owned around 30 cars over my life.
If I remember correctly 26 of them were standards and 4 were automatics.
Of the 4 automatics two were the fastest drag cars I ever had. It took some work and a shift kit to make each of those autos effective but they were better at doing the job than a manual every would have been.
Of the 26 standards maybe 10 of them were really great. The others ranged from just OK to "oh my good this sucks and should be an auto".
The point being there are some really nice ATs and some MTs that are horrid and saying simply "I am a MT guy" has zero meaning in the big picture.
This whole mystic and passion for MTs is a relatively new thing. I do not recall a single person back in the 70s looking down upon others for having an AT. In fact at the drag strips the AT crowd did (and probably still do) hand the MTs their asses on a regular basis.
But see - that's the point. I'm not a drag racer and I'm not an autocrosser. I don't track. It doesn't matter to me whether or not a particular transmission is .2 seconds faster at the track/dragstrip or .2 seconds slower. I will take the manual every time ...

And for all the guys that are getting butthurt about this - I am not saying anything pejorative about someone who, depending on the circumstances, would pick the AT over the manual. I am interested in who, besides myself, would pick the manual EVERY TIME.
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Old 02-15-2022, 03:27 PM   #150
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Question for those who think they are superior Manual only driving gods/snobs :
Does your dash show a warning light on permanently that suggest you have the hill holding option on and available?

Which leads my thoughts to my other gripe about new driver oriented cars offering a manual only but has a push button parking brake.(such as a Civic SI)
I need a true emergency hand brake with my 3rd pedal for my winter driving adventures. And I dislike ABS in the winter...

I hate getting old. I find myself reactionary towards the new car tech being forced on to me.
This may be directed at me. I don't feel like a god or a snob because I would pick a manual over an AT every single time. I do feel like I am in a group that is getting smaller everyday and I do like to identify others in that group.

In any event, earlier in the thread I specifically mentioned that I dislike the hill-holding intervention for pretty much all of the reasons I like driving the manual in the first place.

BTW - if anyone wants to pile on me as an allegedly elitist snob/manual god (which is unnecessary because I just admitted that I am not a racer, track driver or particularly good driver and I am SURE that a bunch of people on here with autos could drive CIRCLES around me) - you could take this out to the brakes and ask me whether I immediately turn off all of the traction control everytime I get in the car and see where that goes.
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Old 02-15-2022, 03:33 PM   #151
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Now if you want to feel like some sort of hardcore "enthusiast" you have to demean anybody that doesn't drive manual as some sort of loser that just doesn't "get it".
I've readily admitted that you can be a hardcore car guy without being "a manual above everything else" guy. I've never once said anything bad or in any way qualitative about people who drive autos - I really haven't. And I am happy to admit many AT drivers on this forum could drive circles around me.

I will say this, though, you either are a manual above all else guy or you aren't. And if you pick an auto when you could have a manual, you are not. And if you feel "less than" for me saying that you aren't in that group, that's on you - not me.
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Old 02-15-2022, 03:45 PM   #152
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Originally Posted by Tcoat View Post
Yep
My mother drove MTs all the time.
My Grandmother drove MTs almost exclusively.
My Great Grandmother drove nothing but MTs since that is all that existed.
They didn't give two shits about "the feels" or being "engaged" in fact they didn't think anything at all about it since it was just the way it was.
Now if you want to feel like some sort of hardcore "enthusiast" you have to demean anybody that doesn't drive manual as some sort of loser that just doesn't "get it".
The older cars were very engaging. You were always on the side of the road fixing them! Didn't matter what Transmission they had...
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Old 02-15-2022, 03:53 PM   #153
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Originally Posted by CincyJohn View Post
Uhh did you even read the post? Did you read the threads? Did you read Ernest72s comments? I'm not the one who said this AT (or any AT or any PDK) is "good" or "bad" - the people that are saying that are the people that are the people defending the AT in the twins or the PDK or an AT in general.

I don't understand why they are doing it because they don't need defending from me - I've never once offered an opinion about how "good" or "bad" any non-manual transmission is. I don't have an opinion there because I don't care - it is not a car that I would consider buying regardless of how "good" or "bad" the non-manual transmission is.

I am not arguing about the general merits of AT vs. MT or that one is good and one is bad. I don't understand how this is so hard for you (and others) to understand.
Dude, settle down. I am not going to go through and quote or mention everyone that has. Yours was the first post I saw so I quoted it. Have a beer, or a pancake or something. Whatever calms you down.
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Old 02-15-2022, 04:00 PM   #154
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This may be directed at me. I don't feel like a god or a snob because I would pick a manual over an AT every single time. I do feel like I am in a group that is getting smaller everyday and I do like to identify others in that group.



MT snob Was NOT directed at you but if the shoe fits…

I Have been buying only manual cars because I like the interaction they provide. Not because I want to be part of a group!

Can I drive an Auto trans one after all those years? Yes and I can.
Would I have kept my old slow ass car 15 yrs and counting if it would have been an auto: No way! Im still getting enjoyment out of it due to the MT.

We will be very unhappy with NO real MT choice once the Electric revolution is complete. Dam the new tech and Greta.
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