Supercharge the 86 or get a Supra 2.0

[TommyW]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

$6k for supercharger
$1k for oilcooler of users choice
1 weekend of labor; call that $1k = $8k
What piece of the puzzle am I missing in your $10k figure?

You'll need a tune and headers. Depending on desired power there are things like updated clutch, injectors, extra cooling over and above the oil cooler. You can easily hit 10K. If you're on stock tires, wheels and brakes those also may need to be upgraded to be more compatible with the extra power.

[WildCard600]

Originally Posted by HKz

ok that's for the 6 cyl, we're talking about the 4 cyl here, only roughly a 300 pound weight disadvantage compared to the twins so the torque & power from the b48 is plenty...

without a stick I wouldn't consider the supra at all so it wouldn't be in my personal list for best cars to upgrade to from the twins but for a brand new automatic only coupe, the 2.0 MKV comes closest to a boosted twin. It is the lightest boosted FR coupe on the market. 230i, Ecoboost Stang, Q60, TT, F-Type, RC, etc...they are all heavier. Pretty much the only lighter choices were the 4c and now the 718 which is only about 100 lbs lighter..

Toyota says the 3.0 weighs 3,400, the 2.0 3,181 and the eight six 2,776.

So 624 and 405 respectively. Power to weight ratio of the eight six is 13.5, where as the 2.0 supra is 12.47. The three oh is 8.89. Not much of an upgrade IMO.

https://www.toyota.com/gr-supra/feat...2370/2372/2374

[TommyW]

Yes 400 lbs difference in a 4 banger is a lot. Not just power to weight but mostly in handling. Go to the gym and lift (or try to lift 400 lbs.). That is a LOT of weight. Huge influence on the car

[HKz]

Originally Posted by WildCard600

Toyota says the 3.0 weighs 3,400, the 2.0 3,181 and the eight six 2,776.

So 624 and 405 respectively. Power to weight ratio of the eight six is 13.5, where as the 2.0 supra is 12.47. The three oh is 8.89. Not much of an upgrade IMO.

https://www.toyota.com/gr-supra/feat...2370/2372/2374

2,776 is the lightest twin configuration with a stick. OP has an automatic, so throw on another 50 pounds over a manual trans IIRC and he has a refreshed 86 which I'm pretty sure are all a touch heavier than most of the FRS which have less equipment like the simpler hvac vs dual zone..then finally throw in the supercharger, so yes the difference isn't as big as 405 as ya think.

Plus, we're talking about torque here. Yes, on paper the twin's 200-205 HP ain't shabby especially if you look at the ratio but please, with the twin's 130 lb ft of torque to the wheels, the 2.0 supra is definitely an upgrade lol. still, no other new boosted FR car comes close.

[WildCard600]

Originally Posted by HKz

2,776 is the lightest twin configuration with a stick. OP has an automatic, so throw on another 50 pounds over a manual trans IIRC and he has a refreshed 86 which I'm pretty sure are all a touch heavier than most of the FRS which have less equipment like the simpler hvac vs dual zone..then finally throw in the supercharger, so yes the difference isn't as big as 405 as ya think.

Plus, we're talking about torque here. Yes, on paper the twin's 200-205 HP ain't shabby especially if you look at the ratio but please, with the twin's 130 ft lbs of torque to the wheels, the 2.0 supra is definitely an upgrade lol. still, no other new boosted FR car comes close.

The auto i'll concede, but my 2020 doesn't have any dual climate thingy jiggers. The fatty eight six auto gt is 2835. Still 300+ lbs difference.

From my perspective by the time OP gets hit with the depreciated value of a 2017 car to buy a $40,000 supra 2.0 to get hit AGAIN with unknown instant depreciation driving it off the lot, better be a much bigger upgrade than 50 hp and 140 ft lbs.

[mrg666]

Originally Posted by HKz

2,776 is the lightest twin configuration with a stick. OP has an automatic, so throw on another 50 pounds over a manual trans IIRC and he has a refreshed 86 which I'm pretty sure are all a touch heavier than most of the FRS which have less equipment like the simpler hvac vs dual zone..then finally throw in the supercharger, so yes the difference isn't as big as 405 as ya think.

Plus, we're talking about torque here. Yes, on paper the twin's 200-205 HP ain't shabby especially if you look at the ratio but please, with the twin's 130 lb ft of torque to the wheels, the 2.0 supra is definitely an upgrade lol. still, no other new boosted FR car comes close.

JRSC adds only about 30 lbs. I have saved more than 60 lbs with wheels, exhaust, and battery already.

[HKz]

Originally Posted by WildCard600

The auto i'll concede, but my 2020 doesn't have any dual climate thingy jiggers. The fatty eight six auto gt is 2835. Still 300+ lbs difference.

From my perspective by the time OP gets hit with the depreciated value of a 2017 car to buy a $40,000 supra 2.0 to get hit AGAIN with unknown instant depreciation driving it off the lot, better be a much bigger upgrade than 50 hp and 140 ft lbs.

OK, well by the looks of it, it appears OP's 86 has the GT trim, so it would have those things like the dual hvac, plus more leather, the wing, etc...plus the supercharger equipment, wider wheels & tires..and still gonna be probably slower than the 2.0 Supra.

Considering the money and time to upgrade the twins (and extra money in case the FA20 goes kaput) it seems much smarter to just trade in the 86 for the Supra which has a warranty. Sure, there is depreciation but Toyota ain't selling many of these, probably could get a great deal off the lot and resale prices could stay relatively high for being uncommon.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by TommyW

You'll need a tune and headers. Depending on desired power there are things like updated clutch, injectors, extra cooling over and above the oil cooler. You can easily hit 10K. If you're on stock tires, wheels and brakes those also may need to be upgraded to be more compatible with the extra power.

I want my car to be street legal, so no headers, $6k includes ECUtek and street legal tune. The ~240whp on said street legal tune is fine for the powertrain.

What cooling is needed above the right sized oil cooler easily obtained for <$1k? Vents? I'm not endurance racing so as long as I can pound on it for a 20-30 minute track session without major loss of power I'm content.

I'll bite on wheels and tires, on a totally stock car they should at least upgrade to 8" wide wheels with nice summer tires, which is another $1.5k+, brake pads and fluid brings you up to $2k (assuming you're tracking the thing, OE pads or similar cheap replacement that falls under standard consumable costs would be fine for street use).

Of course you can spend more, I could put together an NA header, tune, wheel and tire package that costs more then what I want to spend getting FI ready (I already have good wheels, tires, and brake pads).

Originally Posted by HKz

2,776 is the lightest twin configuration with a stick.

On 3/8ths of a tank and no junk in the trunk mine weighs ~2630 lbs, full tank is less then 2675 lbs iirc. I'll add some weight back with the factory header and supercharger, but it should be under 2750 lbs in 'race trim'. Definitely a >400# difference is easily achievable and they make very close to the same whp given BMW's penchent for their rated horsepower to be measured at the wheels.

[HKz]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

On 3/8ths of a tank and no junk in the trunk mine weighs ~2630 lbs, full tank is less then 2675 lbs iirc. I'll add some weight back with the factory header and supercharger, but it should be under 2750 lbs in 'race trim'. Definitely a >400# difference is easily achievable and they make very close to the same whp given BMW's penchent for their rated horsepower to be measured at the wheels.

of course it is achievable, but I'm just going off stock here as considering OP has a GT trim, maybe he doesn't want to remove backseats, spare tire & tools, etc..

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by HKz

of course it is achievable, but I'm just going off stock here as considering OP has a GT trim, maybe he doesn't want to remove backseats, spare tire & tools, etc..

During any performance driving event the spare tools and tire are to be removed for safety. I fully have my backseats and all the OE interior at that weight, also the stock catback and brakes which is an easy 40-50# more to save.

Supra doesn't have a spare tire iirc.

[HKz]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

During any performance driving event the spare tools and tire are to be removed for safety. I fully have my backseats and all the OE interior at that weight, also the stock catback and brakes which is an easy 40-50# more to save.

Supra doesn't have a spare tire iirc.

the majority of us don't autox/track our twins so first point is probably moot (plus if you do this for your daily, pain in the ass to have things in the trunk without the cover and stuff beneath it to keep it propped up)..and if OP was concerned about getting the lightest and cheapest twin to modify, he wouldn't have gotten a refreshed automatic with the GT trim.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by HKz

the majority of us don't autox/track our twins so first point is probably moot

your loss

[HaXx]

something worth noting

it is absolutely feasible to supercharge the 86 for $6,000 dead
the jrsc c30 is 4k
the shop install is 1k
the dynotune is 500
the ecutek and its license is 500

ask me how i know. this is exactly what my car has

i will repeat, my car was supercharger for six thoudand dollars. its 100% reliable as a street car, which is what mine is: a street car.

. you simply no not need an oil cooler for daily driving, ask me how i know. i dont hvae an oil cooler and you plainly dont need one for daily. but for the 500 dollars the jrsc one is that mates to their kit perfectly you might as well. install will likely fall under the 1k kit install

[HKz]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

your loss

indeed, but kinda tough to fit another hobby like that in my life, I have enough things going on that I'm barely mediocre at occupying most of my time before my gf + son lol. plus besides real backroads, oculus + g27 scratches the itch enough for me