Oil system mods for more pressure and flow.

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by solidsnake11

The cavatation marks are behind the actual pump on mine at about 2 and 11 oclock. This is where the liquid would go from a low pressure to high and the bubbles implode.

did it look like this?

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by solidsnake11

Here is a Nissan pump in the front cover. If only I had a 3mm spacer. This 15mm pump should be 25% more flow it has the same number of chambers.

How do you intend to address the cavitation? All this downstream modification has zero effect on the upstream starvation. A bigger pump will just get you more cavitation.

[ermax]

Here is a good comparison of OEM vs the Killer B.



I spun my number 3 and studied the oiling for weeks but wasn’t comfortable trying to do anything dramatic about it. Number 2 and 3 sharing one feed on the crank seemed like a bad design to me. The only thing I did on mine was smooth out all the casting imperfections in the pump on the timing cover. Mine was a mess. Relocating the thermometer seems like an easy mod too. I also found it odd how one head seems to get more priority. The holes in the rocker pivots are not the same between bank 1 and 2 either. This changed in 2014 though. They now use the same pivots on both banks and they are more restrictive then either bank on the old design. Not sure if this was to bias more flow to the bottom end or create more lift for the rocker or both.

I’m wishing I got the Killer B when I did my rebuild. Couldn’t hurt.

[ermax]

Originally Posted by solidsnake11

It wouldn't be that hard to pull the pan and install the killer b. I thought about drilling the crank bigger on the feed to the rods. Only straight through the main since it is the same size as the other two mains that only feed one.

I saw a photo of the crank where the main feed for 2 and 3 looked bigger but my crank sure as hell didn’t look bigger. It makes no since for it not to be a tad bigger. It was tempting to drill it but I figured there must be some reason they did it this way that isn’t obvious to me.

[remhex]

On the topic of oil stuff, I just tried a mod to my sandwich plate that helped out. I had a pressure drop after my oil cooler install. The manufacturer assured me the loss was normal and they have way more experience than me. Anyways, I drilled a hole through the sandwich plate. I started small and kept increasing the size of the hole until my redline oil pressure was close to where it was prior to the oil cooler install. I don't know a thing about thermodynamical stuff but the idea was that at all rpm's, some oil could bypass the cooler to increase flow but not enough to reduce cooling significantly. Max temps are 10° hotter but I gained 8psi even with the slightly higher temperatures. I started with a 3/16 hole and ended up with 5/16. Oil lines are an10.

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by solidsnake11

By porting the 90 degree bend in the pickup and making a pickup tube with a bigger screen at the bottom well below oil level.

Would you have a intake like this? NO! But this is how the pickup is designed in the 1st oil pan

I notice on mine that no matter how high the initial oil pressure, the profile of pressure-vs-engine speed is always exactly the same. After about 5000 RPM it just sharply says "Nope. That's it." I've guessed that it was cavitation but opted instead for carefully controlling oil temp to keep pressure above 75 PSI.

Others may know but, to me it feels like Fuji is just now learning how to build a higher speed engine. It's pretty interesting to see them working around the err of their ways.

I'm excited for your changes. Thanks for digging up those pics.


Edit: Interesting that the cavity in the pump gears is still increasing in that arc segment where the supply cavity rapidly decreases on both sides. What purpose does that serve? Could the answer be as simple as opening up the channel to allow the pump to breathe more? Or would that introduce some sort of instability?

[Trust86]

This has been the most educational thread in quite some time on this forum.

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by solidsnake11

This is where it closes the pump gear off to carry the oil and squeeze it out into the high pressure(red arrows). Counter clockwise. The oil actually starts building pressure before it goes across as you can see where the cavatation blasted the aluminum away. Oil gets pulled creating a low pressure this causes the gases to start escaping the oil , making small bubbles as the oil goes from the low to high pressure these bubbles implode and create small jets of oil that strike the metal and erodes the metal along with making heat.

I see now. So this is actually the region where some recovery takes place in the void between the gear before it sends that chunk across to the high-pressure side. I don't know all the proper terms but I think I get what you're saying.

Do you agree that the restriction is further upstream?

That over-driven, the whole cavity between the critical restriction and the pump gears is foam?

In this context, the bubbles collapsing in that region does make sense. I wonder if the taper isn't a feature just to stabilize that activity.

[scion fr-s]

Originally Posted by solidsnake11

It wouldn't be that hard to pull the pan and install the killer b. I thought about drilling the crank bigger on the feed to the rods. Only straight through the main since it is the same size as the other two mains that only feed one.

Greddy makes one or is the Killer B better?

http://www.ft86speedfactory.com/gred...l#.W_oeWehKiUk

[ermax]

Originally Posted by solidsnake11

I would really like to see other front covers because my pick up screen was pretty blocked to see if it was just caused by the blockage or it happened before the rods spun.

I went through my photos from when I rebuilt mine and I didn’t get any good photos of my front cover and I don’t recall seeing any odd wear on it. If only you started this thread 6 months ago I may have know what to keep an eye out for. My pickup screen was crystal clear with the exception of about 3 flakes from the bearing. It all seemed to stay in the bottom the pan.

This is the best photo I have. I zoomed/cropped in on the pump. Looks like maybe there are some signs of cavitation on mine.

[Ultramaroon]

Oooo! Very nice!

[Ultramaroon]

If what you say is reproducible, that's a game changer. I've also written somewhere here that, in my professional opinion, the use of countersunk heads in this application is utterly negligent.

[ermax]

Originally Posted by solidsnake11

I plugged all the ports and applied 70lbs of air pressure and .0015 slides in. There is other places that the plates leak and the pump cover, I just can not get the feeler gauge to them.

Funny how they slap FIPG all over this engine but then aren’t bothered by these leaky plates.

[ermax]

Originally Posted by Ultramaroon

If what you say is reproducible, that's a game changer. I've also written somewhere here that, in my professional opinion, the use of countersunk heads in this application is utterly negligent.

Seriously and no way to torque them or anything. I just banged that crap out of my impact drive and crossed my fingers.