Failure After J02 Recall - Discussion Threads

[venturaII]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

Or one of a hundred other things that could have caused an underhood fire....

Correct...more to the point of the fire itself precipitating from the recent underhood work, not specifically mechanical engine failure due to the recall itself being performed sloppily...but still, sloppy work.

[ermax]

Originally Posted by venturaII

I disagree. With a catastrophic engine failure, the first hint at trouble would have been a whole lot of bad noise, followed by the rest of his symptoms, not the other way around. The FRS owner describes the event as the first time he'd taken the car on an extended drive (3+ hours) since the recall work had been done. A slow leak might not get hot enough to the point of ignition on a daily highway commute, but certainly could on a spirited extended ride through canyon country.

It had 2000 miles on it and had driven it to work for 2 weeks. Let's say his 3 hour outing was at 60mph.. that is 180 miles out of the 2000. So 2 weeks of driving to work would be 130 miles per day. Plenty of time to shake a fuel leak.

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

If indeed the engine went first I don't think that the recall being the cause is debatable at all. It would almost certainly be the cause. He was pretty specific with his chain of events though.

That is what I am struggling with, taking the chain of events as accurate it's hard for me to jump to a recall issue.

Originally Posted by Tcoat

The downshift may have been the last straw for the engine. All the other reported failures were far less dramatic with just spun bearings. None of them were lifting hoods. If he spun a bearing at the beginning of the events and then down shifted he could very well have thrown a rod and caused the engine to blow, spew oil and burn. THAT I have seen happen at the strip more than once.

Spot on as usual. Even a thrown rod though doesn't guarantee an engine fire. I had one go out the side of a chevy vortec V6 leaving a hole you could stick your hand through, but it didn't catch fire. Left quite a mess on the highway though.

[venturaII]

You're still forgetting the fact that this was the first time his driving conditions were notably different than the past 2 weeks of travel. The fact that they changed to even more extreme conditions points could easily cause an otherwise just-barely benign leak to turn into a genuine fire source. Vehicles have leaks all the time that go unnoticed until some new event causes their presence to be discovered. Sometimes discovered with extreme prejudice. Lol.

[venturaII]

Not that it'll ever be done, but I bet that motor was torn down, it'd be completely fine internally (aside from massive overheating...). None of the description the poster provided sounds like internal mechanical failure. A 2000psi fuel line rupturing from a surrounding fire, on the other hand, could certainly produce those symptoms.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

That is what I am struggling with, taking the chain of events as accurate it's hard for me to jump to a recall issue.



Spot on as usual. Even a thrown rod though doesn't guarantee an engine fire. I had one go out the side of a chevy vortec V6 leaving a hole you could stick your hand through, but it didn't catch fire. Left quite a mess on the highway though.

Nope. I have thrown a couple and never had a fire. Have also seen cars throw one (it was a pretty common occurrence at the dragstrips in the 70s) that caused just a small crack that erupted into a spectacular ball of flame. I figure the big holes let the oil just dump out and that is it but the small ones push it out under pressure which turns it aerosol. It hits the hot exhaust and POOF!

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

.. I figure the big holes let the oil just dump out and that is it but the small ones push it out under pressure which turns it aerosol. It hits the hot exhaust and POOF!

Good point, and makes sense.

[Sapphireho]

Originally Posted by venturaII

Not that it'll ever be done, but I bet that motor was torn down, it'd be completely fine internally (aside from massive overheating...).

Now that would be interesting. My first thought were along the same lines; something with fuel.


Either way, engine failure, or sloppy re-assembly of fuel components = recall related. Be very interested how this ends up.


I bet if he had not had the recall done, his car would be in his garage now. We may never know.

[venturaII]

Originally Posted by Sapphireho

Now that would be interesting. My first thought were along the same lines; something with fuel.


Either way, engine failure, or sloppy re-assembly of fuel components = recall related. Be very interested how this ends up.


I bet if he had not had the recall done, his car would be in his garage now. We may never know.

Actually, my money would be on a slow-ish oil leak that eventually caught fire, and then the rest of the underhood domino effect as the fire spread.. An oil leak could hide for weeks or even months before the right conditions caused a fire.

[ermax]

Originally Posted by venturaII

Not that it'll ever be done, but I bet that motor was torn down, it'd be completely fine internally (aside from massive overheating...). None of the description the poster provided sounds like internal mechanical failure. A 2000psi fuel line rupturing from a surrounding fire, on the other hand, could certainly produce those symptoms.

Hood popping was a good indication of mechanical failure.. loss of traction of the rear wheels also does.

Speaking of failures we have a new report of a new spring breaking and dropping a valve. This sounds suspect to me. Probably didn't get a good set on the keepers and it popped.

[ermax]

The one thing I find odd about the fire case is they didn't say if there was a hole in the block and it's been long enough since the incident that I would have expected that to be known. I would hate for this engine to be tossed aside and not used as another example to help out others getting denied repair after failures. Seems a fire would get Toyota motivated but if they never know it happened then it's a lost opportunity.

[venturaII]

Originally Posted by ermax

Hood popping was a good indication of mechanical failure.. loss of traction of the rear wheels also does.

Speaking of failures we have a new report of a new spring breaking and dropping a valve. This sounds suspect to me. Probably didn't get a good set on the keepers and it popped.

Popping hood could easily be fuel system failure and explosion/ignition after the initial fire started, and loss of traction simply means ABS/ESC system had failed/melted from the same fire. From the description, there were no oil pressure lights, no check engine lights, etc. Those would be lit up with a rod through the cases.

[ermax]

Originally Posted by venturaII

Popping hood could easily be fuel system failure and explosion/ignition after the initial fire started, and loss of traction simply means ABS/ESC system had failed/melted from the same fire. From the description, there were no oil pressure lights, no check engine lights, etc. Those would be lit up with a rod through the cases.

Yeah I could see a fuel failure doing that. If I was in his shoes I know I would be like oh shit wah... boom.. get me out of here. I wouldn't be like, wait let me look to see if my radio works or if I have a CEL or dummy light on before I jump. Your theory about melting wires causing TC to fail would most likely take out the cluster too which would leave you with no TC light, dummy, CEL, ect.

I say we just wait for the owner to give more details. Hopefully he isn't a one hit wonder never to be seen again. I'm very interested in his case because I think it will put the most fire under Toyota's ass.

[Chimera]

my cars going in tomorrow