Supra (Toyota/BMW) vs. FT86 (Toyota/Subaru)

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k

For the most part that's actually not true. The Mustang continues to do well. The Camaro's sales have gone down ever since they focused more on driving enjoyment / made it a sports car (oh the depressing irony there), and the Challenger's sales, despite the car being almost a decade old, are higher than ever.

Continued to do well does not mean they have not dropped!


I would say that the drop is significant considering they are considered the "best selling" of all. The point was that all "sports" segments are dropping it isn't just one make or model.

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k

From the beginning Toyota has said this will be a small volume car, on the magnitude of 15,000 cars worldwide (IIRC). At that volume, they would still sell every single car were it only offered with a manual transmission.

That goes both ways, they'll sell every one with an AT as well. In general (assuming it already existed and met their standards) they could have put an MT in it, had the car cost less to produce and left the price the same as it is now. They would still sell them and at a larger profit.

Bottom line is unless Toyota fesses up to why there is no MT option, anything we say is guessing, and it's their game they make the rules.

[RRnold]

Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k

I'm sorry but that's 100% false. Porsche did AT only for the 991.1 GT3 and it created an uproar. They reoffered a manual (actually a brand newly developed 6sp manual) for the 991.2 GT3 that came out just 2 years later. However the 991 Turbo is exclusively PDK. But the lion's share of 911's sold are base, S, GTS, AWD models and those have always had a manual option. In fact they developed a 7sp manual specifically for the 991 generation. If we're keeping score that's 2 freshly developed manual transmissions for the 991 911. A far cry from AT only for the 911.

I'm sorry but that's also 100% false. Porsche brought back the manual for the 2016 911R. AP realized the "Principle of Purity" by actually listening to his customers that it was offered for the 2018 991.2 GT3.


I drove the 86 and throught eh, not my cup of tea. I'll hold my judgement for the MKV Z4 Coupe when it arrives at the dealership.

[WolfpackS2k]

LOL, I didn't bother mentioning the 911R because everyone already knows the story about that one. Technically wasn't "brought back". It never left the full 911 line up!

[RRnold]

Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k

LOL, I didn't bother mentioning the 911R because everyone already knows the story about that one. Technically wasn't "brought back". It never left the full 911 line up!

Yep, damn those flippers and what they did to the R

Technically it did leave and wasn't available for the 991.1 GT3 like it was for the 997.2. Then it was "brought back" in the 991.2 GT3.

Back to the topic, 2020 Supra. There should be a poll here. How many current 86/BRZ owners are planning to buy the new Supra?



[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GXTOg7_BNBY[/ame]

[JR]

Maybe Toyota is currently developing a manual transmission for this vehicle and it will be available 1-2 years after the initial release. Or not. Toyota knows better though. They knew the 86 needed a manual transmission.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by RRnold

Back to the topic, 2020 Supra. There should be a poll here. How many current 86/BRZ owners are planning to buy the new Supra?

Very few I would bet. Many just saved up the $13K for a used FRS.

[JR]

Originally Posted by RRnold

There should be a poll here. How many current 86/BRZ owners are planning to buy the new Supra?

If I was in the market for a new sports car, I would probably just spend a little extra and get an M2/Competition Package, since it can be optioned with a manual transmission. The reliability will be the same anyway

[JR]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Very few I would bet. Many just saved up the $13K for a used FRS.

This is true. That is quite a difference in pricing.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by JR

Maybe Toyota is currently developing a manual transmission for this vehicle and it will be available 1-2 years after the initial release. Or not. Toyota knows better though. They knew the 86 needed a manual transmission.

It should be available about the same time the turbo 86 is released.

[JR]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

It should be available about the same time the turbo 86 is released.

Next Year!!

Joke aside, I can't stand the majority of vehicles that have a turbo because of the lag. I will avoid them like Millennials avoid manual transmissions.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by JR

Next Year!!

Joke aside, I can't stand the majority of vehicles that have a turbo because of the lag. I will avoid them like Millennials avoid manual transmissions.

yep. The guys that complain so bitterly about the torque dip have obviously not spent much time behind the wheel of a stock 90s turbo car!
Wait for it...
Wait for it...
Wait for it...
BOOST

[WolfpackS2k]

I only buy sports cars with manual transmissions.

[mrg666]

Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k

I only buy sports cars with manual transmissions.

Yeah, figured out that much.