Guide - Choosing the right supercharger/turbo kit - Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community

The Sentinel · 05-06-2015, 03:17 AM

Hi all,

This week I put together a bit of a guide based on the research and learning I did before adding the Kraftwerks Supercharger kit to my car.

In the guide I attempt to answer the most common questions and areas that require consideration. I also address the age old Turbo vs. supercharger argument, and address different types of supercharger and their pros and cons.

GUIDE HERE

Have I missed something? Please let me know. Keen for your feedback as always as I continue to discover more about these excellent cars

kbogarto · 05-06-2015, 06:14 AM

That's a ton of good info in one spot. I'm sure this will be very helpful for people who are just starting to look into FI. Only comment I have is about supercharger making more low
Down torque than turbos. Especially with the 86 platform and the rotrex kits being so popular that make very little torque low down in the rev range. A correctly sized turbo can yield huge torque at low RPMs. Well done though looks like a lot of work.

The Sentinel · 05-06-2015, 06:54 AM

Thanks for the feedback. With regards to the low down torque, I'm talking about below the point where a turbo is generating useful boost

tahdizzle · 05-06-2015, 11:04 AM

a link that takes you to a link....

Its like inception for the interwebs!

King Tut · 05-06-2015, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Sentinel

Thanks for the feedback. With regards to the low down torque, I'm talking about below the point where a turbo is generating useful boost

What is useful boost? I would argue that even at 2000 RPM a properly sized turbo can generate just as much boost as a centrifugal supercharger, but for that 500RPM or less, you are free.

AVOturboworld · 05-06-2015, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Tut

What is useful boost? I would argue that even at 2000 RPM a properly sized turbo can generate just as much boost as a centrifugal supercharger, but for that 500RPM or less, you are free.

That seems to be the question. Most comparisons between a supercharger and a turbocharger tend to use data from a large turbo build. A properly sized turbo setup will be building boost from 2000rpm or earlier. And due to the nature of superchargers, having boost "from idle" doesn't necessarily mean they've overcome the parasitic drag of the supercharger from idle.

As an example:

DFWFRS · 05-06-2015, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AVOturboworld

That seems to be the question. Most comparisons between a supercharger and a turbocharger tend to use data from a large turbo build. A properly sized turbo setup will be building boost from 2000rpm or earlier. And due to the nature of superchargers, having boost "from idle" doesn't necessarily mean they've overcome the parasitic drag of the supercharger from idle.

As an example:

This doesn't look biased or anything.

AVOturboworld · 05-06-2015, 02:22 PM

Unlike the charts from that article, this one is at least on a BRZ/FR-S, on the same pump gas, at the same dyno.

Indeed, there is a bit of bias, I happen to think that turbocharging a small motor is going to be more efficient than supercharging.

The Sentinel · 05-06-2015, 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Tut

What is useful boost? I would argue that even at 2000 RPM a properly sized turbo can generate just as much boost as a centrifugal supercharger, but for that 500RPM or less, you are free.

And you'd be spot on. However a twin screw will still generate more torque from idle.

It's not an argument of what's "better", it's about what's most suitable for the desired outcome.

The Sentinel · 05-06-2015, 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AVOturboworld

That seems to be the question. Most comparisons between a supercharger and a turbocharger tend to use data from a large turbo build. A properly sized turbo setup will be building boost from 2000rpm or earlier. And due to the nature of superchargers, having boost "from idle" doesn't necessarily mean they've overcome the parasitic drag of the supercharger from idle.

As an example:

Very true of some setups. Good graph for comparison too!

For my particular application, I chose a centrifugal supercharger due to the low parasitic drag, linear power delivery and simplicity.

I've driven AVO turbo kitted brz/86 before and they do feel more powerful than my car at low RPM, even with significantly lower boost. However over 6000RPM there's no comparison.

It all comes down to what the owner is looking for out of the car, and that's the point of the article.

The Sentinel · 05-07-2015, 07:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tahdizzle

a link that takes you to a link....

Its like inception for the interwebs!

LOL. That was my bad. Accidentally included the wrong link. Fixed now

Sportsguy83 · 05-07-2015, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DFWFRS

This doesn't look biased or anything.

Might be biased, but it's 1000% true.

King Tut · 05-07-2015, 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Sentinel

For my particular application, I chose a centrifugal supercharger due to the low parasitic drag, linear power delivery and simplicity.

He said my magic words "centrifugal supercharger" and "linear power". I don't want to waste my time explaining what linear power is again, but I will state that it is not what you get from a centrifugal supercharger.

CSG Mike · 05-07-2015, 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AVOturboworld

Unlike the charts from that article, this one is at least on a BRZ/FR-S, on the same pump gas, at the same dyno.

Indeed, there is a bit of bias, I happen to think that turbocharging a small motor is going to be more efficient than supercharging.

Efficiency =/= throttle/transient response

05-06-2015, 03:17 AM	#1
The Sentinel Project BRZ-Boosted Autos Join Date: Nov 2013 Drives: MY14 BRZ Location: Australia Posts: 121 Thanks: 15 Thanked 154 Times in 45 Posts Mentioned: 2 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Guide - Choosing the right supercharger/turbo kit Hi all, This week I put together a bit of a guide based on the research and learning I did before adding the Kraftwerks Supercharger kit to my car. In the guide I attempt to answer the most common questions and areas that require consideration. I also address the age old Turbo vs. supercharger argument, and address different types of supercharger and their pros and cons. GUIDE HERE Have I missed something? Please let me know. Keen for your feedback as always as I continue to discover more about these excellent cars __________________ Check out my ProjectBRZ YouTube Channel and Facebook Page for the latest reviews, guides and information. Last edited by The Sentinel; 05-07-2015 at 07:14 AM.

05-06-2015, 06:14 AM	#2
kbogarto Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Drives: 2013 BRZ limited WRB Location: Jacksonville, FL Posts: 120 Thanks: 135 Thanked 43 Times in 31 Posts Mentioned: 1 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	That's a ton of good info in one spot. I'm sure this will be very helpful for people who are just starting to look into FI. Only comment I have is about supercharger making more low Down torque than turbos. Especially with the 86 platform and the rotrex kits being so popular that make very little torque low down in the rev range. A correctly sized turbo can yield huge torque at low RPMs. Well done though looks like a lot of work. __________________ 92 240sx (sold), 03 350z (sold), 13 BRZ (AVO turbo)

05-06-2015, 06:54 AM	#3
The Sentinel Project BRZ-Boosted Autos Join Date: Nov 2013 Drives: MY14 BRZ Location: Australia Posts: 121 Thanks: 15 Thanked 154 Times in 45 Posts Mentioned: 2 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Thanks for the feedback. With regards to the low down torque, I'm talking about below the point where a turbo is generating useful boost __________________ Check out my ProjectBRZ YouTube Channel and Facebook Page for the latest reviews, guides and information.

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05-06-2015, 02:22 PM	#8
AVOturboworld Join Date: Jan 2012 Drives: 2013 "AVO Orange" FR-S Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 1,067 Thanks: 69 Thanked 2,277 Times in 636 Posts Mentioned: 108 Post(s) Tagged: 2 Thread(s)	Unlike the charts from that article, this one is at least on a BRZ/FR-S, on the same pump gas, at the same dyno. Indeed, there is a bit of bias, I happen to think that turbocharging a small motor is going to be more efficient than supercharging.

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