Insurance for Modified Vehicles in Ontario?

[KurtZehrINS]

Originally Posted by Canehda

Most companies are smart enough to have FSCO filing to not insure modifications, the large companies all have it... as per one of your statements comparing swapping a Cummins into an impala vs swapping a motor into an FRS, an underwriter won’t look at the modification on its own but rather the person who would do this modification. The demographic that swaps the former is different from the latter. Just like big brake kits, the BBK objectively make the car safer but the underwriter will ask why does this person need a big brake kit? At the end of the day there simply isn’t enough data to take the risk and most companies won’t do it even if there is a market. From my experience the only way I’ve ever seen modified cars get on policies is when they are snuck in with large commercial policies.
But I before you all send the mob after me, exterior asthetic mods and mods unrelated to performance a lot of companies are okay with. Over the winter I helped the auto adjusters who were getting smoked with claims and I actually replaced a guys voltex type 2 wing and velox diffuser... insurance is a good faith industry and I can tell you that a lot of stuff gets by... just don’t be that guy who gets your broker to escalate that the adjuster didn’t pay for a Cobb Accessport in your 997 turbo when you said no modifications on your Ontario Application Form because you would be the reason why insurance companies start hating mods...

Everyone is very well read on insurance. Yes companies have to file their rules with the government and the government agency FSCO is what approves or denies all things in terms of auto insurance. So a company wants to take a rate increase to cover losses, then they have to define the increase and the justification and FSCO has the final say on if they can increase the rates as per the stated plan or not, as an example.


This is the sticking point here. Companies cannot just make exceptions here or there, based on their filed rules. So if they have filed their auto rules stating no performance mods, then that is the rule and they have to follow it.


The point of my survey is to try and give a company incentive to go to FSCO and apply for permission to run a specialty program and apply for whatever coverage's.


If I were to go to my companies and say hey I was at a car show and say 50 modded cars and they have a hard time with coverage, the company said well tough for them.


Whereas, if I can go to them and say hey I have 500 responses to a survey of modified car owners, all of whom want coverage for their modified cars. For easy numbers lets say the average policy turns out to be $1000/year. That right there would say, there is a potential $500,000 in business there for you, assuming we only get the car. Also potential say for their home, renters insurance, other toys etc.


On top of this if I can say, from my findings 85% of these drivers have over 7 years of experience with 80% having no tickets or accidents.


All of a sudden I have a much larger case on my hand. With some provable numbers, and what not can give the company incentive to go through the work the create the rules and file the program with FSCO.


This is why I need your help.


Also I do not think that you guys modding your FRS are really that much different to the modding community of classic car owners. It is just a love of different vehicles. I mean is my insured who put a 596 Crate motor in the Factor Five Cobra, or the one who has a 69 Camaro ex drag car, with full cage, tuned big block, and 14" wide tires, etc, really any different than any of you. Again we sell it as they are going for a specific look etc, and the clients have to confirm that they do not use it for speed tests etc. But still are they really that different from those of you with swaps, or lowering, big brakes etc. I don't think so. If it was really down to a NEED, a lot of those cars should just have the inline 6's the cars came off the line with.

[Lynxis]

Originally Posted by KurtZehrINS

Thank you for the suggestions. So far I have hit you guys, Toronto Subaru Club, CASC, Toronto Mazda3. I have been posting as often as possible between other work duties and dad/husband duties at home.


I will do my best to continue to work through the other car manufacturers. If you have links to the best forum options I would so appreciate the assistance!


Cheers.

Unfortunately I don't as I'm not involved in those communities. I know about Camaro6 but that's it.

[sIowbrz]

i believe belairdirect cover up to $5000 on mods... u dont even need to report to them if total is less than $5000

[KurtZehrINS]

Originally Posted by sIowbrz

i believe belairdirect cover up to $5000 on mods... u dont even need to report to them if total is less than $5000

I have looked all over on their website and other sources to see if there is anything that can confirm this. I think the idea of not disclosing a modification even if they total less than $5000 is a big risk.


I mean you could probably add a turbo to your FRS for in and around $5000. I would be willing to bet, that if you were in an accident and it was found that there was a performance modification like that, you will be in a whole heap of trouble with them.


Again I cannot guarantee this, but I could only image that this would be the case.


Either way, hopefully one day there is an option that allows you to have some fun with the car and also feel comfortable to disclose you fun to insurance.


Cheers

[VOSS]

Originally Posted by KurtZehrINS

Hey,


As stated above I think the best option is dealing with a broker. I am not saying this just because I am one, but as a broker we have access to a number of different providers, which gives us a lot more options..........

https://www.surveymonkey.ca/r/QNVVMWY

Thanks for the detailed info. I actually sent an email to Zehr insurance and received a canned response saying "we'll get back to you". That was 9 days ago and i haven't heard since, my email probably went into their junk mail or something.

That being said, i filled out the survey. Hopefully the one extra response helps in the long run.

Since you work as a broker for Zehr, are you able to tell me if they accept drivers under 25? I was looking at Hagerty but they only accept if you're 26.

Originally Posted by Tcoat

This really seems to depend upon the company and type of policy that each individual has.
When I first bought the car and thought it needed FI based on what I had read (I had only done the one test drive at that point) I contacted my insurance company and had a long discussion on coverage. They were very clear that they did not care what I did to the car it would not change the base coverage. The guy even said "doesn't matter if you drop a V8 in there the base coverage doesn't change". He said that the cost of coverage was based far more on the driver than what was done to the car. There was zero risk (according to him at that point in time) of the car not being covered due to any performance mods that were done. He did say that any high level performance mods should be reported though but it was more so that the insurance company had them on record.

Now... the clincher was that the base premiums only covered the value of the car in it's stock state. If I sank $10K into mods and wrecked it I would be out that $10K. He said that if I wanted to cover any modification costs then they could just tack a rider onto my policy. I don't recall the exact amount but it was actually pretty cheap. Something like $20 a year for every extra $5K in value.


The whole thing is to check what your contract says. If it outright bans any form of performance mods then you could be out of luck. If it has restrictions but permits some or does not reference them at all (as mine reads) then all is fine.

What insurance company are you with?

Originally Posted by sIowbrz

i believe belairdirect cover up to $5000 on mods... u dont even need to report to them if total is less than $5000

I'm actually with Belair and thought this as well. I called them and gave them specific items i wanted to modify. It was coilovers, exhaust, rims, lip kit. They got back to me saying they're performance mods and they would cancel my insurance if i got them.

Pretty pissed to be honest because one of the reasons i signed up with Belair was of their "leniency" with mods. I even spoke to 3 different operators and they all told me "oh yeh, lowering your car and an exhaust for sound, no problem". Feel like i've been cheated.

[sIowbrz]

Originally Posted by VOSS

Thanks for the detailed info. I actually sent an email to Zehr insurance and received a canned response saying "we'll get back to you". That was 9 days ago and i haven't heard since, my email probably went into their junk mail or something.

That being said, i filled out the survey. Hopefully the one extra response helps in the long run.

Since you work as a broker for Zehr, are you able to tell me if they accept drivers under 25? I was looking at Hagerty but they only accept if you're 26.



What insurance company are you with?



I'm actually with Belair and thought this as well. I called them and gave them specific items i wanted to modify. It was coilovers, exhaust, rims, lip kit. They got back to me saying they're performance mods and they would cancel my insurance if i got them.

Pretty pissed to be honest because one of the reasons i signed up with Belair was of their "leniency" with mods. I even spoke to 3 different operators and they all told me "oh yeh, lowering your car and an exhaust for sound, no problem". Feel like i've been cheated.

i dont know about you but after i park my civic si for 1 full year i was asked to send them pics of the car before they can put it back on road. car was lowered, rims, exhaust, brembo front calipers, lip kit. belair person i talk to even said nice car....

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by VOSS

What insurance company are you with?

Western Assurance.

[VOSS]

Originally Posted by sIowbrz

i dont know about you but after i park my civic si for 1 full year i was asked to send them pics of the car before they can put it back on road. car was lowered, rims, exhaust, brembo front calipers, lip kit. belair person i talk to even said nice car....

Hmm, interesting. Were you stock when you originally signed up with them? Did you report any of your mods when you were adding them?

[KurtZehrINS]

[QUOTE=VOSS;3082609]Thanks for the detailed info. I actually sent an email to Zehr insurance and received a canned response saying "we'll get back to you". That was 9 days ago and i haven't heard since, my email probably went into their junk mail or something.

That being said, i filled out the survey. Hopefully the one extra response helps in the long run.

Since you work as a broker for Zehr, are you able to tell me if they accept drivers under 25? I was looking at Hagerty but they only accept if you're 26.

QUOTE]

Hey there. I do have the quote request for your BRZ. I apologize for my delay in getting to you. It is that time of year, and everyone is coming out of hibernation and I find myself bogged down in work.


I will email you back shortly and we can see how things go from there. I appreciate the opportunity and hopefully we can work together.


I also appreciate the time you took in filling out the survey. Every little bit helps.


Thanks.

[VOSS]

[quote=KurtZehrINS;3084375]

Originally Posted by VOSS

Thanks for the detailed info. I actually sent an email to Zehr insurance and received a canned response saying "we'll get back to you". That was 9 days ago and i haven't heard since, my email probably went into their junk mail or something.

That being said, i filled out the survey. Hopefully the one extra response helps in the long run.

Since you work as a broker for Zehr, are you able to tell me if they accept drivers under 25? I was looking at Hagerty but they only accept if you're 26.

QUOTE]

Hey there. I do have the quote request for your BRZ. I apologize for my delay in getting to you. It is that time of year, and everyone is coming out of hibernation and I find myself bogged down in work.


I will email you back shortly and we can see how things go from there. I appreciate the opportunity and hopefully we can work together.


I also appreciate the time you took in filling out the survey. Every little bit helps.


Thanks.

No worries, didn't realize this is your busy season. Makes sense thinking about it though. I responded to your email, hopefully this will work out. Thanks.

[sIowbrz]

Originally Posted by VOSS

Hmm, interesting. Were you stock when you originally signed up with them? Did you report any of your mods when you were adding them?

No mods reported cause when I went with it was brand new car and the insurance stated under 5000 dollar modifications not need for report. I assume modifications ae in aftermarket rims body kit stereo suspension? Idk about engine mods that increase power lol

[Canehda]

Spoke with underwriting today and found out that our direct sales insurance arm does not have a filed mod rule but our main broker channel arm does have the rule. Made the switch today and saved $80 a month off my employee discount lol...

Also if there is any car that will be a pain in the ass to insure it will be ours let alone with mods, I’ve dealt with multiple FRS/BRZ fatalities this year already and none of them were pretty
Wouldn’t be surprised if insurance sky rockets with our cars... spoke with another casualty adjuster with another big name insurance company and they joke that the FRS is the new civic of single vehicle stupid accidents

[new2subaru]

Originally Posted by Canehda

Spoke with underwriting today and found out that our direct sales insurance arm does not have a filed mod rule but our main broker channel arm does have the rule. Made the switch today and saved $80 a month off my employee discount lol...

Also if there is any car that will be a pain in the ass to insure it will be ours let alone with mods, I’ve dealt with multiple FRS/BRZ fatalities this year already and none of them were pretty
Wouldn’t be surprised if insurance sky rockets with our cars... spoke with another casualty adjuster with another big name insurance company and they joke that the FRS is the new civic of single vehicle stupid accidents

It will only get worse as the get cheaper to buy.

[Jordanwolf]

Originally Posted by new2subaru

It will only get worse as the get cheaper to buy.

Time to move to Porsche?