Buying used FRS tomorrow.. need some advice.

[lupindub]

So i'm buying a used 2013 FRS tomorrow and everyone keeps telling me to negotiate and haggle with the price. Only thing is the car listed is cheaper then the KBB price so.. how do you even negotiate a car that is ALREADY cheaper then the KBB listed price.

Anyways for more information, the FRS i'm looking at is around $21,000 but KBB says it's worth $21,500. Any help is appreciated, thanks.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by lupindub

So i'm buying a used 2013 FRS tomorrow and everyone keeps telling me to negotiate and haggle with the price. Only thing is the car listed is cheaper then the KBB price so.. how do you even negotiate a car that is ALREADY cheaper then the KBB listed price.

Anyways for more information, the FRS i'm looking at is around $21,000 but KBB says it's worth $21,500. Any help is appreciated, thanks.

First of all you need to ask yourself (and them) "Why is it under KBB?" to start with.
If the answer is to just sell fast then you probably can't negotiate. Still make the attempt though.
If high miles, damaged, dead skunk stuck in exhaust, etc then you may be able to bargain with them.

[SisterBlue22]

Haggling for the sake of haggling can make for a negative experience. When I bought mine used back in May, I had done tons of research and shopping, and I knew the price of the car was fair, and it was a great deal compared with some others that were for sale at other dealers, especially since mine had only 17K miles on it, and most others had 30K+. It was also a color I loved, and was in flawless condition.

In the end, what I negotiated on was what they gave me for my trade. I had a number in my head I wanted for my trade going in, and they initially offered less...did some haggling, and they came up to the number I wanted, so I was very happy with the deal I got. Granted, my sales guy was phenomenal - I bought my car at a BMW dealership, so the service overall was stellar - but I think you can have a good experience if you go in with the right attitude.

Many people go into the car buying experience ready for a fight, and it makes the process very ugly. But if you've done your research, you know what a fair price is for the car you want, know what you CAN pay, and have an idea of trade in value and interest rate going in, it doesn't have to be such a hostile experience. You also have to be prepared to walk away without the car if you can't get to a win-win deal, and that's the part many people have a hard time with. The sales guys are in the business to make money - dealerships aren't non-profit organizations...but that doesn't mean you have to get screwed.

In the end stop worrying about what every is telling you to do, and do what works best for you and your personal financial situation.

[smg1138]

Originally Posted by lupindub

So i'm buying a used 2013 FRS tomorrow and everyone keeps telling me to negotiate and haggle with the price. Only thing is the car listed is cheaper then the KBB price so.. how do you even negotiate a car that is ALREADY cheaper then the KBB listed price.

Anyways for more information, the FRS i'm looking at is around $21,000 but KBB says it's worth $21,500. Any help is appreciated, thanks.

Just curious, how many miles are on it?

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by SisterBlue22

The sales guys are in the business to make money - dealerships aren't non-profit organizations...but that doesn't mean you have to get screwed.
.

Hoooray, I have support on my long standing statement!

[thill]

Think about it. Someone traded in this car to the dealer most likely for $16-18K, and KBB, while a guide, is not foolproof because price can vary by region and supply and demand. Most dealers usually target about $4K profit on their used cars.

I would bet that you still have at least $1K in play with that number. It just comes down to whether or not you want to negotiate and play the game or not. You don't have to be a ****, you can be very professional and perhaps you can simply negotiate in other things like accessories and/or maintenance in with the deal. I typically would never take the dealers first offer just as I would expect they may not want my lowest offer. It's called negotiation and, if done professionally, nobody should have hurt feelings. Car salesman and dealers are trained to do this (negotiate) and they do it every single day.

[lupindub]

Originally Posted by smg1138

Just curious, how many miles are on it?

Here is all the information on it: http://www.dunningtoyota.com/certifi...8109e3faf3.htm ($20,999) (21,384 miles)

KBB price: http://www.kbb.com/scion/fr-s/2013-s...&pricetype=cpo ($22,900)

Now the only thing that is fishy to me is it has the Toyota Badge instead of the Scion. The positive is it has a pristine CarFax, low mileage, and from what I can tell pretty much perfect condition. It is also Certified Pre-Owned which is good. Something is naggling me though because how can a good car like this be listed $2000 less then KBB value?

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by lupindub

Here is all the information on it: http://www.dunningtoyota.com/certifi...8109e3faf3.htm ($20,999) (21,384 miles)

KBB price: http://www.kbb.com/scion/fr-s/2013-s...&pricetype=cpo ($22,900)

Now the only thing that is fishy to me is it has the Toyota Badge instead of the Scion. The positive is it has a pristine CarFax, low mileage, and from what I can tell pretty much perfect condition. It is also Certified Pre-Owned which is good. Something is naggling me though because how can a good car like this be listed $2000 less then KBB value?

Like said by somebody else your area may just have a bunch and the value is lower there. KBB is an average which of course means there are just as many below as above the "normal" price.
Looks like a good deal to me and don't sweat the rebadge since there are 1,000s of them that have had it done.

[lupindub]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Like said by somebody else your area may just have a bunch and the value is lower there. KBB is an average which of course means there are just as many below as above the "normal" price.
Looks like a good deal to me and don't sweat the rebadge since there are 1,000s of them that have had it done.

Cool. I actually dig the Scion logo a bit more but the Toyota badge is okay. Makes me look like a dirty hipster though.

[raven1231]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

First of all you need to ask yourself (and them) "Why is it under KBB?" to start with.
If the answer is to just sell fast then you probably can't negotiate. Still make the attempt though.
If high miles, damaged, dead skunk stuck in exhaust, etc then you may be able to bargain with them.

Your pic is exactly what popped into my head lol

[soulreapersteve]

Who cares about the KBB price?

Relatively low price with miles to match, great condition... sounds like an awesome deal to me!

Inspect the car yourself when you get there. If you can get a lower price than what is shown, more points to you!

I would've bought used but couldn't take the idea of buying someone's sloppy seconds, especially as my first car purchase.

[steeloyangster]

I come from two different views on this topic. I've been on both sides of the table on this.

Salesperson Side - There is definitely always wiggle room on cars. If the customer is financing with one of our banks then the easiest way to get the price down is by negotiating the monthly payment. Never tell them how much you're hoping to pay a month. If your credit is good and they come back with a $400 a month payment just remember that a grand is about $20 a month. (Of course there are more variables to this so keep that in mind.) Tell them you can't swing it if it's $400 a month. Ask if they can try to get it down to about $360-$380 a month without extending the loan term. They'll bring down the price for you without having to negotiate what the 'value' of the car is. It's hard to justify telling the salesperson why you think the car should be $19k instead of its sticker of $21k (reasonably anyway without saying stuff like "I just FEEL like it's not worth $21k.) Especially if other cars on the market are going above those going rates.

Buyer Side - When purchasing a used vehicle it is now a "unique" vehicle. It's going to be almost impossible for you to find the same type of vehicle with the same amount of miles with the exact color that you want. Sure you can walk away from this deal and say I'll go look for a cheaper price somewhere else and get a different color or much higher miles or maybe a different trim level. But in the end if THIS is the car that you want and you're WILLING to pay this price then you should get it. My wife is a very wise woman and she explains things to me in the simplest of terms and is able to help me quantify why I should do or not do certain things. She says "If it's the car you want and you truly love it, then you should will be willing to pay for it. If you get a car that you don't want then you'll hate transferring that money even more every month."

IMO, just do it. Go in, tell them that you want that car, get your shit sorted money-wise and drive away with a smile on your face. Don't look at it as the dealer getting something from you but you getting something for yourself.

[soulreapersteve]

Originally Posted by lupindub

Cool. I actually dig the Scion logo a bit more but the Toyota badge is okay. Makes me look like a dirty hipster though.

Wait, the Toyota badge makes you look like a hipster???

[lupindub]

Originally Posted by steeloyangster

I come from two different views on this topic. I've been on both sides of the table on this.

Salesperson Side - There is definitely always wiggle room on cars. If the customer is financing with one of our banks then the easiest way to get the price down is by negotiating the monthly payment. Never tell them how much you're hoping to pay a month. If your credit is good and they come back with a $400 a month payment just remember that a grand is about $20 a month. (Of course there are more variables to this so keep that in mind.) Tell them you can't swing it if it's $400 a month. Ask if they can try to get it down to about $360-$380 a month without extending the loan term. They'll bring down the price for you without having to negotiate what the 'value' of the car is. It's hard to justify telling the salesperson why you think the car should be $19k instead of its sticker of $21k (reasonably anyway without saying stuff like "I just FEEL like it's not worth $21k.) Especially if other cars on the market are going above those going rates.

Buyer Side - When purchasing a used vehicle it is now a "unique" vehicle. It's going to be almost impossible for you to find the same type of vehicle with the same amount of miles with the exact color that you want. Sure you can walk away from this deal and say I'll go look for a cheaper price somewhere else and get a different color or much higher miles or maybe a different trim level. But in the end if THIS is the car that you want and you're WILLING to pay this price then you should get it. My wife is a very wise woman and she explains things to me in the simplest of terms and is able to help me quantify why I should do or not do certain things. She says "If it's the car you want and you truly love it, then you should will be willing to pay for it. If you get a car that you don't want then you'll hate transferring that money even more every month."

IMO, just do it. Go in, tell them that you want that car, get your shit sorted money-wise and drive away with a smile on your face. Don't look at it as the dealer getting something from you but you getting something for yourself.

I am actually planning on buying it with straight cash, no finance - thank God. As a former salesman, would you say paying in cash is favorable or un-favorable? Is cash a negotioable tool, as in, would they lower the price of the vehicle if someone pay's all in cash?