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Old 09-14-2021, 07:11 AM   #29
x808drifter
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And then practice on crap knives that are already dull or you dont car about messing up.
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Old 09-14-2021, 02:52 PM   #30
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And then practice on crap knives that are already dull or you dont car about messing up.
I started with an axe lol.
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Old 09-14-2021, 05:04 PM   #31
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I started with an axe lol.
I started with a knife I found on the bus.
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Old 09-14-2021, 05:49 PM   #32
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Sharpening and honing are two different things. Sharpening removes material to make a sharp edge, while honing straightens out the edge material that is there.
Understood. I don't do either well but can put on a show.

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And then practice on crap knives that are already dull or you dont car about messing up.
I did that and made the crap set worse so donated them.
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Old 09-14-2021, 05:57 PM   #33
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I started with a knife I found on the bus.
Classy!
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Old 09-14-2021, 11:06 PM   #34
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i sharpen my own knife, just oil and a whetstone, though i'm starting to change to diamond stones.. main problem is that i think i need to re-quench it, as i can't seem to get it to keep an edge much more than a week anymore...
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Old 09-15-2021, 01:17 AM   #35
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i sharpen my own knife, just oil and a whetstone, though i'm starting to change to diamond stones.. main problem is that i think i need to re-quench it, as i can't seem to get it to keep an edge much more than a week anymore...

Try sharpening at a shallower angle.
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Old 09-15-2021, 03:29 AM   #36
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TILTL how mosquitos can so unerringly and SOoo quickly find your veins?

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Old 09-15-2021, 03:34 AM   #37
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I did that and made the crap set worse so donated them.
If you're serious about learning, it's actually pretty simple. The two biggest impediments for people are low quality stones and the overcomplicated sharpening techniques found online. The third is that stainless knives are about 5x harder to sharpen than carbon steel, so get one of the latter to learn on.

Regarding stones, avoid the cheap amazon dual grit ones. They're soft, wear quickly, and sharpen very slowly. It's hard to get enough feedback to know when you're doing something right and when you're not. Water stones will generally be better than oil stones for the same reason, they cut faster.

If you're just sharpening stainless kitchen knives it's usually not worth going above 2000 grit. With carbon or powdered steels I like to go up to about 5000. For regular sharpening I just hit my 1200 and a strop. I'm a big fan of the Atoma diamond stones. The Naniwa green brick and Suehiro Rika 5K are exceptional. The King stones are great entry-level options, but wear quickly.

For technique, many work, but I think this one's easy.
  1. Sharpen one side of the knife. Periodically inspect the edge by pulling your finger across the burr. This will form on the top side of the edge (bottom being on the stone). Keep sharpening the same side until you feel the burr along the entire length of the edge.
  2. Repeat step 1 for the other side of the knife. The burr will move from one side of the edge to the other. Keep sharpening until this happens.
  3. Repeat steps 1 and 2 for each grit in your progression until you're created a burr with the finest grit.
  4. Congrats. The geometry is done. But your knife still can't cut because of the burr. At this point, with a stainless knife, you should be able to use a honing rod to knock it off. Or if you want to stay on the stone...
  5. Flip the knife (so the burr is face down). Remember how long it took to create the last burr? Sharpen this side for about 2/3rds as long. Flip. 2/3rds. Flip. 1/3rd. Flip. 1/3rd. Flip. Keep decreasing the time spent on each side until you're doing 1-2 strokes between flips.

The last step is the most critical, and why lots of people have trouble getting something to cut. The goal is to grind down the burr without creating a new one on the opposite side. Done slowly like this it should be pretty straightforward. With practice you'll be able to knock it down with larger jumps between flips.
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Old 09-15-2021, 12:26 PM   #38
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If you're serious about learning, it's actually pretty simple.
Those are great tips, thanks for posting.

I have a mixed set of Zwillings Twin Henkels knives. I'm not sure if they're high carbon or stainless, their website says it's a proprietary blend.

From watching my sharpening guy, he has a complex wrist motion like a Vegas card dealer. With the blade almost flat on the stones, he works the edge in an oval motion. He says he sharpens by feel and can do it with eyes closed. Are there videos online you'd recommend to learn the right motion?
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Old 09-15-2021, 02:23 PM   #39
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Those are great tips, thanks for posting.

I have a mixed set of Zwillings Twin Henkels knives. I'm not sure if they're high carbon or stainless, their website says it's a proprietary blend.

From watching my sharpening guy, he has a complex wrist motion like a Vegas card dealer. With the blade almost flat on the stones, he works the edge in an oval motion. He says he sharpens by feel and can do it with eyes closed. Are there videos online you'd recommend to learn the right motion?
I'm familiar with the Friodur stuff, my parents have a set as well. Aggressive stones help, since their burr is more prone to bending than carbon (rustable) steel. 1200 + a hone is good enough for me, they work well with a toothier edge. It's still enough to shave hair and feels sharper longer than if you go finer.

The video below is almost exactly how I learned. I'm picturing the complex wrist motion you mentioned as a way to hit the whole edge with each pass. Starting out I would try a simpler method like shown in the video, which should make it easier to focus on maintaining a constant edge angle.

You'll pick up the feel part as you learn to associate it with a burr. It's capillary adhesion between the stone and the now-flat edge you created. If you've ever had two flat sheets of material with liquid in between and tried to pull them apart, it's that but on a much smaller scale. The stone has a big effect here, some making it pronounced and others almost unnoticeable.

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Old 09-15-2021, 03:18 PM   #40
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Diamond "stones" are not worth it for fine blades. I use one to flatten my sharpening stones though. They don't stay the same grit as they wear.

I use "splash" stones and water. Knives all on the harder side, many with carbon cores. Mostly Japanese hand-made at this point.
Softest/crappiest knife I use now is a Shun I was gifted. It's hefty and feels a bit clumsy. Workhorse is a Konosuke HD2 240mm. Very thin back. Amazing.
Leather strop for regular honing. Many of my knives would chip with a normal steel hone.
Common German stainless knives are a huge disappointment. Soft. Need a much more blunt grind to be sharp and still don't hold it as long.

Big mistake I see a lot of people make when sharpening is trying too hard. Just like when cutting with the knife, let the tool do the work. If you have to force it, something is wrong. And with sharpening, if you're fixing a blemish you need time and patience. And maybe a coarser grit to start, if it's still getting nowhere.
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Old 09-15-2021, 03:40 PM   #41
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TILTL how two companies in the same business selling the exact same product (well equivalent products) can justify selling them for such different prices.

As an example, current product is replacement windows. Our house has 35 windows, of which 30 are standard but large double-hung windows (either 28" or 32" x 72").

One company quoted a price of @$19,000 to replace them all with their top quality vinyl windows, which I thought was steep but not unreasonable.

The second company, whose windows were feature to feature equivalent to company 1 quoted (hold your breathe and prepare) $78,943!! No, they were not made of crystal aluminum and Adamantium.

First company came in, measured the windows, quoted their top of the line (which matched ones we already had used when we remodeled our kitchen), offered us a 20% discount if we close within 30 days. In and out if less than 45 minutes.

Second company spent 30 minutes measuring the windows then spent the next 60 minutes selling their product with a standard sales pitch, and trying to use car dealership methods with us until their price got down to $44,000 "if you sign today". When I told them I never sign a contract before I have all bids, they went to the "customer survey" which was really just a call to the manager for additional sales pitch and a further reduction to $37,000 if I was willing to go on their "flexible install schedule".

I finally just kicked the guy and the manager out with "I'm sorry, but at this point the only way I would go with you is if you move the decimal point one place to the left just for wasting so much of my time." I felt bad for the sales guy (really looked like a kid just starting out and was just had a script he had to go through which was why I tolerated it as long as I did).
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Old 09-16-2021, 07:54 AM   #42
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TILTL why I can't just pay for sports channels. For example, I wish I could just pay per channel instead of being shoved plans down my throat for stuff that I don't watch nor I am interested in watching. I just want my BeIN Sports so I can watch La Liga and TNT for UEFA Champions League. That's it.
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