follow ft86club on our blog, twitter or facebook.
FT86CLUB
Ft86Club
Delicious Tuning
Register Garage Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community - FT86CLUB > Technical Topics > Engine, Exhaust, Transmission

Engine, Exhaust, Transmission Discuss the FR-S | 86 | BRZ engine, exhaust and drivetrain.


User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 11-08-2020, 11:14 PM   #1
Suzuyans
Something something
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Drives: 2017 BRZ (Vortech), 1993 R32 GT-R
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 59
Thanks: 6
Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Fitment of FDs on AT

Greetings,

After installing the Vortech Supercharger on an Automatic (yeah I know, it was the only one on the lot after a hurricane and I was dead set on a BRZ), I was deciding that I want to get a higher FD to stay in the higher revs after each shift. I exclusively stay in manual mode and only use AT on traffic and drive thrus.

So far I'm looking at 4.56 on a 260 HP 190 TQ BRZ.

But, besides all that I was wondering about the fitment. Does the Cusco FD fit on an AT? I noticed it's for MT on the website.

I've tried searching but, alas I can't really find much. Unless my google fu is just awful...which it probably is.

https://www.cusco.co.jp/en/news/clos...ion_gears.html
Suzuyans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2020, 11:30 PM   #2
Ashikabi
Senior Member
 
Ashikabi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Drives: 2013 FR-S
Location: Northwest Iowa
Posts: 7,354
Thanks: 454
Thanked 4,542 Times in 2,947 Posts
Mentioned: 59 Post(s)
Tagged: 5 Thread(s)
I believe you are going the wrong way with your ratio. It should be a smaller number to stretch your revs out. The Lexus IS300 diff is a direct swap pumpkin iirc M85 is the code you're looking for there. I think that's a 3.65 ratio with LSD. I don't know anything about the Cusco diffs but I know replacing the final drive gear is much more expensive than swapping pumpkins unless you can do it all yourself perhaps

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk
Ashikabi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2020, 11:36 PM   #3
Suzuyans
Something something
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Drives: 2017 BRZ (Vortech), 1993 R32 GT-R
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 59
Thanks: 6
Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashikabi View Post
I believe you are going the wrong way with your ratio. It should be a smaller number to stretch your revs out. The Lexus IS300 diff is a direct swap pumpkin iirc M85 is the code you're looking for there. I think that's a 3.65 ratio with LSD. I don't know anything about the Cusco diffs but I know replacing the final drive gear is much more expensive than swapping pumpkins unless you can do it all yourself perhaps

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk
Ooh, I see.

I guess I was under the impression that a higher ratio equates to more torque at the wheels and faster acceleration...or maybe I just used the wrong words?

I guess I was wrong, eh. I'll have to read up on it again.

I'll check out the M85 then when I reeducate myself, thanks.
Suzuyans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2020, 11:52 PM   #4
Ashikabi
Senior Member
 
Ashikabi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Drives: 2013 FR-S
Location: Northwest Iowa
Posts: 7,354
Thanks: 454
Thanked 4,542 Times in 2,947 Posts
Mentioned: 59 Post(s)
Tagged: 5 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzuyans View Post
Ooh, I see.

I guess I was under the impression that a higher ratio equates to more torque at the wheels and faster acceleration...or maybe I just used the wrong words?

I guess I was wrong, eh. I'll have to read up on it again.

I'll check out the M85 then when I reeducate myself, thanks.
I took "staying in the revs longer" to mean that you wanted a taller gear that would decrease your torque and increase top speed (per transmission gear). This is common practice for turbo guys. I intend to do the same with my LS swap to mitigate my poor traction

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk
Ashikabi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2020, 11:56 PM   #5
Suzuyans
Something something
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Drives: 2017 BRZ (Vortech), 1993 R32 GT-R
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 59
Thanks: 6
Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Ah, got you.

Yeah I just misworded then, that's my bad.
Suzuyans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2020, 12:06 AM   #6
Ashikabi
Senior Member
 
Ashikabi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Drives: 2013 FR-S
Location: Northwest Iowa
Posts: 7,354
Thanks: 454
Thanked 4,542 Times in 2,947 Posts
Mentioned: 59 Post(s)
Tagged: 5 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzuyans View Post
Ah, got you.

Yeah I just misworded then, that's my bad.
Indeed. If you want more torque then you will need a different gear set as there is no pumpkin to swap that already has an appropriate ratio. We are at the bottom of the pyramid of power

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk
Ashikabi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2020, 01:43 AM   #7
FRSBRZGT86FAN
Senior Member
 
FRSBRZGT86FAN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Drives: 2023 GR SUPRA,15 FR-S (SOLD)
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 4,235
Thanks: 3,086
Thanked 2,100 Times in 1,397 Posts
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashikabi View Post
I believe you are going the wrong way with your ratio. It should be a smaller number to stretch your revs out. The Lexus IS300 diff is a direct swap pumpkin iirc M85 is the code you're looking for there. I think that's a 3.65 ratio with LSD. I don't know anything about the Cusco diffs but I know replacing the final drive gear is much more expensive than swapping pumpkins unless you can do it all yourself perhaps

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzuyans View Post
Ooh, I see.

I guess I was under the impression that a higher ratio equates to more torque at the wheels and faster acceleration...or maybe I just used the wrong words?

I guess I was wrong, eh. I'll have to read up on it again.

I'll check out the M85 then when I reeducate myself, thanks.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashikabi View Post
I took "staying in the revs longer" to mean that you wanted a taller gear that would decrease your torque and increase top speed (per transmission gear). This is common practice for turbo guys. I intend to do the same with my LS swap to mitigate my poor traction

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashikabi View Post
Indeed. If you want more torque then you will need a different gear set as there is no pumpkin to swap that already has an appropriate ratio. We are at the bottom of the pyramid of power

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk

He's definitely going the correct way for the auto, 4.56 puts you at a similiar ratio as the manual and is exactly what he's looking for. Some of the gears in the auto trans are longer and getting a 4.56 FD equates to having close to the same as the manual FR-S. I've seen N/A auto cars getting amazing results but that's not recommended in his setup.....
__________________
*SOLD*OFT Stage 2 UEL E85/Nameless Performance 3 inch axleback with 5 inch mufflers/ TRD CAI / CNT UEL/ Cusco Strut BAR & LHD Brake Stop / "JDM" Toyota Badges / WinJet JDM headlights - DRL MOD from fteightysix.com - 5000K Diode Dynamics HID kit / Diode Dynamics LED interior Lights and sidemarker bulbs / JDM Clear Sidemarkers / Diode Dynamics LED switchbacks/ OLM LED rear turn signals / Tap Turn Relay*SOLD*
FRSBRZGT86FAN is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to FRSBRZGT86FAN For This Useful Post:
whataboutbob (11-11-2020)
Old 11-09-2020, 02:24 AM   #8
Suzuyans
Something something
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Drives: 2017 BRZ (Vortech), 1993 R32 GT-R
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 59
Thanks: 6
Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Hm, I could go 4.44.

But, like I said I'm not sure if these kits will fit.

I'm unsure if the AT and MT have differences.
Suzuyans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2020, 09:23 AM   #9
86TOYO2k17
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Drives: 2017 toyota 86
Location: PNW
Posts: 2,131
Thanks: 336
Thanked 1,188 Times in 781 Posts
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
AT can handle a lot more torque, can shift much faster than a human, and still be controlled to shift or hold gear however you want,

Any FD gear for MTs will work for ATs no different.
MT and AT have the same rear diff pre 17, post 17 MT switched to a 4.3gearing same pumpkin/lsd, which is also still a direct swap and is a much better option for FI Autos.

Final drive will not change your shift points / RPM drop after shifting. Your transmission gearing determines this not FD gearing.
A shorter (numerically higher) FD will provide more mechanical torque to the wheels at the expensive of a lower top speed per gear / rpm.

I tried 4.1, 4.56, and ultimately settled on 4.3. 4.56 was too short. 4th topped out at about 115 which came up way too quick and I always wanted a little more, as you fall on your face once you go into 5th. Also traction was much more of an issue with a 4.56 gear.
86TOYO2k17 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to 86TOYO2k17 For This Useful Post:
Devil 86 (11-11-2020)
Old 11-09-2020, 11:15 AM   #10
Suzuyans
Something something
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Drives: 2017 BRZ (Vortech), 1993 R32 GT-R
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 59
Thanks: 6
Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by 86TOYO2k17 View Post
AT can handle a lot more torque, can shift much faster than a human, and still be controlled to shift or hold gear however you want,

Any FD gear for MTs will work for ATs no different.
MT and AT have the same rear diff pre 17, post 17 MT switched to a 4.3gearing same pumpkin/lsd, which is also still a direct swap and is a much better option for FI Autos.

Final drive will not change your shift points / RPM drop after shifting. Your transmission gearing determines this not FD gearing.
A shorter (numerically higher) FD will provide more mechanical torque to the wheels at the expensive of a lower top speed per gear / rpm.

I tried 4.1, 4.56, and ultimately settled on 4.3. 4.56 was too short. 4th topped out at about 115 which came up way too quick and I always wanted a little more, as you fall on your face once you go into 5th. Also traction was much more of an issue with a 4.56 gear.
I like that idea. I get to keep it OEM basically and can switch on trade in.

Basically all I would be doing is buying the Diffrential and fluids?
Suzuyans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2020, 11:31 AM   #11
Ashikabi
Senior Member
 
Ashikabi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Drives: 2013 FR-S
Location: Northwest Iowa
Posts: 7,354
Thanks: 454
Thanked 4,542 Times in 2,947 Posts
Mentioned: 59 Post(s)
Tagged: 5 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzuyans View Post
I like that idea. I get to keep it OEM basically and can switch on trade in.



Basically all I would be doing is buying the Diffrential and fluids?
Sure sounds like it. I didn't know the ratios were different between the AT and MT.

Anyone know what the ratio is for the 17+ ATs?

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk
Ashikabi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2020, 11:44 AM   #12
86TOYO2k17
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Drives: 2017 toyota 86
Location: PNW
Posts: 2,131
Thanks: 336
Thanked 1,188 Times in 781 Posts
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashikabi View Post
Sure sounds like it. I didn't know the ratios were different between the AT and MT.

Anyone know what the ratio is for the 17+ ATs?

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk
All ATs any year are 4.1

Pre 17 MTs are also the exact same 4.1
17+ MTs are 4.3
86TOYO2k17 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to 86TOYO2k17 For This Useful Post:
Ashikabi (11-09-2020), mrg666 (11-09-2020)
Old 11-09-2020, 11:45 AM   #13
dragoontwo
Senior Member
 
dragoontwo's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2020
Drives: 22 BRZ limited
Location: Clarksville TN
Posts: 1,181
Thanks: 216
Thanked 987 Times in 519 Posts
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashikabi View Post
Sure sounds like it. I didn't know the ratios were different between the AT and MT.

Anyone know what the ratio is for the 17+ ATs?

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5010 using Tapatalk


The same as all previous models. The 17+ manuals were changed to 4.3.
dragoontwo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2020, 11:47 AM   #14
86TOYO2k17
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Drives: 2017 toyota 86
Location: PNW
Posts: 2,131
Thanks: 336
Thanked 1,188 Times in 781 Posts
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzuyans View Post
I like that idea. I get to keep it OEM basically and can switch on trade in.

Basically all I would be doing is buying the Diffrential and fluids?
Yup, direct swap, just get some fluid.

I picked up a 1k mile 2019 4.3FD a little over a year ago for like 600$ shipped on ebay. At that low mileage all the seals should be perfectly fine. Just make sure they have the garter spring and you lube up the axle tips and the seals to not scratch the seal on insert. Pretty easy swap.
86TOYO2k17 is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
FRS Fitment help !! FRS Megan Wheels | Tires | Spacers | Hub -- Sponsored by The Tire Rack 1 04-03-2020 09:17 PM
How's the fitment of 1320's dual res fp fitment on AT aznchris Engine, Exhaust, Transmission 0 04-16-2019 06:02 AM
TRD Kit fitment Ds3ire Cosmetic Modification (Interior/Exterior/Lighting) 20 03-16-2016 03:11 PM
Help on Fitment! lxsedan Wheels | Tires | Spacers | Hub -- Sponsored by The Tire Rack 9 06-07-2015 10:01 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:09 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging v3.3.0 (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2024 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

Garage vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.