How fast is the GT86 on track?

[LoCo]

Hey everyone...

After giving up on the idea of buying a GT86 for a while, I'm again toying with this idea seriously. I figured I'd ask a few questions to ease my decision.

First - about me a bit:
I've been driving various Evos for the last 7 odd years or so - had everything - 8,9,10... Modded, driven em on slicks... The works... They're a blast - fact - and fast as fu*k, however - they are expensive to maintain - and the bigger reason - I have grown a bit bored of them. Since my passion for evos lead me to open a workshop and we're now the #1 place to go to in our country for evos, they are a part of my daily routine... There is no doubt whatsoever I will park myself an evo IX somewhere and keep it till I die at some point, but right now I'm looking for ... well... Fun. I used to be able to have fun on the streets with an evo - nowadays I'll get arrested as they're just too damn fast... 1-2-3 shift to 4th and go to jail.

However ... I am competitive. I like to be fast but as I've grown older, i dont feel right driving a 400+whp car on slicks with no cage anymore... Hence - I'm considering the 86 for real. I'd still drive it on slicks at tracks etc. but it's a newer and safer car...also the occasional street sideways drift moment is intriguing to me. And with less maintenance cost - I could track it a lot too.

Now my question is - how fast/slow is a well driven 86 on the track compared to semi stock-ish evos, stis and the other usual track suspects? On a 1.45 lap - how much time difference can I expect? I would ofcourse mod the car towards trackability (basic boltons, tune, brakes, slicks)...

Also - a non motorsport question - with proper winter tires - how good is the car in the snow? I intend to daily it (like I do the evo) but I don't want to get stuck with it. My old mercedes was rwd and light in the back and it was horrible even with brand new blizzaks. I had to toss in 80kg of sand in the trunk - than it was managable...

Thanks in advance for the comments - keep in mind uour opinion might make me sell an Evo ix to join the community here!

P.s. I have no intention of boosting the car anytime soon so answers should relate to NA.

[mav1178]

2014 times so far on west coast:



Compare that against other cars on the same track. It will ultimately come down to driver, but the car can hold its own against formidable competition.

Yesterday someone in a "Street Class FRS put down a faster time than a gutted NA modded Corolla at Streets! Sub 1:30!

-alex

[LoCo]

Thanks for those times, I'm hoping for some direct feedback from people - also it's hard to compare times not knowing the mods and tires on the cars etc... I'm looking also for feedback "from people that came from faster cars".

Ty

[Reaper]

@CSG Mike

[jvincent]

I can answer the snow question. I DD mine through.one of the snowiest winters in Ottawa in recent years and never got stuck once or felt unsafe.

Toyo GSI5 205/55/16 tires.

[gramicci101]

Originally Posted by mav1178

2014 times so far on west coast:

-alex

So if I'm reading this correctly, James Dutton in stock class put down a 1:40.9 on WSIR, which was at least 7 seconds faster than everyone all the way up until super modified, where CSG_Mike and ImperiousRex went 1:34 and 1:35?

Sounds like Mr. Dutton has mad skills.

[DarkSunrise]

Because of all the variance in driver level, it probably makes sense to look at published/controlled times for something like this.

Pros at Laguna Seca:
1:47.71 - Evo X MR
1:47.93 - Evo IX MR
1:51.30 - BRZ

Amateurs at VIR Grand West Course:
3:10.6 - Evo X SE
3:13.3 - Evo X MR
3:13.5 - Evo IX MR
3:18.6 - BRZ

So bone stock, you're looking at something like 3.5 seconds slower on a ~1:50 course, or 5 seconds slower on a ~3:15 course. This will obviously depend on configuration of the track and other factors, but there's a rough guide. That's a fairly significant gap.

Take an otherwise stock BRZ/FR-S and add extreme performance street tires (RE11, Z2SS, RS3, etc.), and you can expect something like a 2 second improvement on a ~1:30 course.

[litemup]

Originally Posted by Reaper

@CSG Mike

^ this

[ja1217]

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise

Because of all the variance in driver level, it probably makes sense to look at published/controlled times for something like this.

Pros at Laguna Seca:
1:47.71 - Evo X MR
1:47.93 - Evo IX MR
1:51.30 - BRZ

Amateurs at VIR Grand West Course:
3:10.6 - Evo X SE
3:13.3 - Evo X MR
3:13.5 - Evo IX MR
3:18.6 - BRZ

So bone stock, you're looking at something like 3.5 seconds slower on a ~1:50 course, or 5 seconds slower on a ~3:15 course. This will obviously depend on configuration of the track and other factors, but there's a rough guide. That's a fairly significant gap.

Take an otherwise stock BRZ/FR-S and add extreme performance street tires (RE11, Z2SS, RS3, etc.), and you can expect something like a 2 second improvement on a ~1:30 course.

A few basic mods makes a huge difference on a long course like VIR Grand. With just Dunlop Z2's, coilovers, and a BBK I did a 3:11.09 and I know I can probably drop another second or 2 as I've dropped 4 seconds off my VIR full course since the weekend I ran both VIR Full and Grand courses. Haven't had a chance to run Grand since then though.

[ame]http://youtu.be/n5V93tXyiSM[/ame]

Also, I'll throw in a little anecdote from someone I do time trials with. He used to drive a track prepped Evo putting down a lot of power but ended up switching to an E36 M3 for a lot of the reasons you described (safety, running costs, reliability). At first he was bored with how much slower it was than his Evo, but now he's become the fastest driver in my region for my class and is regularly faster than a lot of his friends still driving Evo's. Driving a relatively underpowered car is a great way to become a better driver as it is quite easy for a powerful car to cover up mistakes.

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by ja1217

A few basic mods makes a huge difference on a long course like VIR Grand. With just Dunlop Z2's, coilovers, and a BBK I did a 3:11.09 and I know I can probably drop another second or 2 as I've dropped 4 seconds off my VIR full course since the weekend I ran both VIR Full and Grand courses. Haven't had a chance to run Grand since then though.

Another good data point. Good driving in that video btw. Looks smooth and fast.

[Deep Six]

On the portion of the track that matters, you can more than hold your own against the cars that you mentioned. However corner exit speed can only get you so much on the straights and you will be a sitting duck naturally aspirated. E85 tune and bolt-on's help considerably but a reliable blower may be something you would consider down the road.

I plan to go that route soon but for now it's still a blast just staying near cars like this one until the track straightens out and they run away. BTW this is a 13 GTR with nearly 600 whp and if anyone questions the driver's ability I'll simply mention "Forged"

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NwU7YD-UKOQ"]FRS at Roebling Feb 2014 - YouTube[/ame]

[Chillracing]

Originally Posted by gramicci101

So if I'm reading this correctly, James Dutton in stock class put down a 1:40.9 on WSIR, which was at least 7 seconds faster than everyone all the way up until super modified, where CSG_Mike and ImperiousRex went 1:34 and 1:35?

Sounds like Mr. Dutton has mad skills.

Lap times vary a bunch out at willow due to the heat. Also Stock class isn't really stock out here it's more like slightly modified stock. Yesterday I didn't see anyone but myself on the stock tires. You can run coilovers, BBK, Camber Plates, and stickier tires in the stock class.

That being said and to stay slightly on topic. The BRZ is a fun car to drive because it challenges your skills even though it's slow. Yesterday I think I topped out at 96 MPH or so and at big willow which is a high speed track I think I did 114 MPH. To me it's like racing a big Kart but one of the slower ones that makes you learn to be smooth. I've driven all kinds of fast cars but honestly I'd say this is one of the more fun cars I've driven in a while.

[TylerLieberman]

They're the fastest thing ever on the track. Trade me for your Evo and you can see for yourself lol

[mav1178]

Originally Posted by gramicci101

So if I'm reading this correctly, James Dutton in stock class put down a 1:40.9 on WSIR, which was at least 7 seconds faster than everyone all the way up until super modified, where CSG_Mike and ImperiousRex went 1:34 and 1:35?

Actually... at Big Willow it's about who has the biggest balls. End of turn 1, turns 2-3, turns 8-9 are all about how brave you are and how deep your pockets are if you wreck.

-alex