Front camber for track...

[ZDan]

Was only able to get ~-3.0 degrees with camber plates, finally got oem crashbolts to add some. Calcs suggest the camber bolts should get another ~1 degree. Tentative plan is to run -3.5 but thought I'd see what people who have tried to optimize wound up with.

Tires: 245/40-17 A052s, *maybe* RE71RS if they get here in time

Car is lowered ~35-40mm (12-7/8" hub to lip) on Swift R-Spec springs (5.3F/4.4R), Bilstein B8s, Eibach front/rear sways (front on softer setting, rear on stiffer).

Previous alignment settings: ~6.5 caster, zero front/rear toe, -3F/-2.7R camber

Tracks: Palmer MA, Watkins Glen, New Hampshire Motor Speedway, Thompson CT

Car is still a bit more understeery than I'd like, but don't wanna overdo it as I do daily the car and also put a fair amount of street miles on my track tires.

IMO there's a pretty broad range of camber that works well for most 200tw radials so I think I'll be fine at -3.5, but interested to hear what experienced successful trackhounds think...

[TommyW]

I have a similar setup. I found -3 front and -2 rear for camber is just about right. I know guys that run -3.2 to 3.5 front that have had good results also. Much has to do with driving styles whether you get too much push or not.

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by TommyW

I have a similar setup. I found -3 front and -2 rear for camber is just about right. I know guys that run -3.2 to 3.5 front that have had good results also. Much has to do with driving styles whether you get too much push or not.

True, to be clear I’m talking about midcorner transition from light tralbraking to initializing throttle around 90-180dg extended cornering particularly at Palmer MA, difficulty maintaining line to get on the gas as soon as I’d like. Not being able to mat the throttle sooner is costing me…

[Muskoka800]

You may consider double camber bolts.
16mm top location and 14mm lower hole.
My alignment guy said -3.5 was achievable with both bolts and Pedders top mounts which give only -.75.
With your camber plates you might find -4.5 possible.
Good Luck!

[NoHaveMSG]

Tire pyro is the way to go. Have a buddy in a different session ready. Pull down the hot pit and get you readings with no cooldown lap. I run -3.5f -2.5r granted I have wing and splitter and a bit more spring rate then normal. I could use a touch more in the front.

[TommyW]

Originally Posted by ZDan

True, to be clear I’m talking about midcorner transition from light tralbraking to initializing throttle around 90-180dg extended cornering particularly at Palmer MA, difficulty maintaining line to get on the gas as soon as I’d like. Not being able to mat the throttle sooner is costing me…

You can play around with tire pressures too.

[TommyW]

Another thing is without coil overs you can’t adjust front and rear stiffness which makes a difference. I also run B8’s because I don’t like adjusting things more than just bar stiffness.

I get slight push in some corners at some tracks however you’ll never have a car that works perfectly in every corner at every track. . Try reducing rear camber next alignment. Before adding more to the front check the inside, center and outside tire temps.

[Goingnowherefast]

At -3.8 my pyrometer still said I need more negative camber. These McPherson strut cars basically need all the static negative camber they can get.

[Icecreamtruk]

Originally Posted by ZDan

Was only able to get ~-3.0 degrees with camber plates, finally got oem crashbolts to add some. Calcs suggest the camber bolts should get another ~1 degree. Tentative plan is to run -3.5 but thought I'd see what people who have tried to optimize wound up with.

Tires: 245/40-17 A052s, *maybe* RE71RS if they get here in time

Car is lowered ~35-40mm (12-7/8" hub to lip) on Swift R-Spec springs (5.3F/4.4R), Bilstein B8s, Eibach front/rear sways (front on softer setting, rear on stiffer).

Previous alignment settings: ~6.5 caster, zero front/rear toe, -3F/-2.7R camber

Tracks: Palmer MA, Watkins Glen, New Hampshire Motor Speedway, Thompson CT

Car is still a bit more understeery than I'd like, but don't wanna overdo it as I do daily the car and also put a fair amount of street miles on my track tires.

IMO there's a pretty broad range of camber that works well for most 200tw radials so I think I'll be fine at -3.5, but interested to hear what experienced successful trackhounds think...

You have a relatively soft sprung car on sticky A052 tires. There will be a lot of roll and A052 naturally love lots of camber. With taht setup, I bet the perfect alignment up front would be around -5, probably around -3 to -3.5 on the rear. (yes I have run that tire and that is what I found out worked for me, on an even stiffer car but with heavy aero which loaded it pretty hard).

Edit:short version, all the camber you can get, it will still not be enough with your setup.

[PLX92]

6k front 7K rear rates here w/ 22mm front bar, no aero

I've found my a052's(and almost everything else i've run) wear pretty even at 4*front and 2.5* rear.

[ZDan]

Thanks everybody! I'm going to see where I am at max with camber plates plus max with crash bolts and go from there. Should be around -4* I think.

In my experience there should be a quite broad range of camber that will work pretty well but maybe that range is a bit higher than I thought... I might try -4 then -3.5, back to back and see how different they feel and if there's any detectable difference in lap times.

[Icecreamtruk]

Originally Posted by ZDan

Thanks everybody! I'm going to see where I am at max with camber plates plus max with crash bolts and go from there. Should be around -4* I think.

In my experience there should be a quite broad range of camber that will work pretty well but maybe that range is a bit higher than I thought... I might try -4 then -3.5, back to back and see how different they feel and if there's any detectable difference in lap times.

Nice, post your findings if you dont mind. Im curious to see if theory meets reality in this case.

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by Icecreamtruk

Nice, post your findings if you dont mind. Im curious to see if theory meets reality in this case.

Will do. Just dropped car off for alignment, asked for -3.7 front camber and zero toe front and rear. Figure -3.7 should be about the midpoint of the range I wanna try out, so going +/- from there should keep toe reasonably near zero...

I don't really expect to learn a whole lot as tomorrow looks like rain most of the day at the Palmer (MA). Sunday looks clear but only get 2 practice sessions before time trial, maybe open track at the end of the day. Anyway I'll report back with my impressions.

[ZDan]

Meh, I forgot a couple of things when I calculated how much camber the crash bolts should get me.
1) The total change is split between adding negative camber to the lower/upright/wheel and making the upper/strut portion more upright, and
b) 14mm crash bolt only moves 1mm at the side with the 16mm hole, side with 14mm hole doesn't move.

New alignment with left front maxed out:
LF -3.48, RF -3.65
LR -2.47, RR -2.89

Will probably just leave it as-is for the weekend