This car is nuts!!! 200 hp?!? No way.

[chrisl]

Originally Posted by Jen

Okay. I officially have a Camaro. White, manual, orange racing stripes.


Issue #1= finding first gear, no problem, second gear, no problem, where the fck is third, fourth, fifth, sixth....

Is it the base 6cyl? I drove an SS model with the V8, and I definitely felt a similar feeling - you couldn't really feel where the different gears were. It's disappointing that the 6cyl is the same way...

[Jen]

Originally Posted by chrisl

Is it the base 6cyl? I drove an SS model with the V8, and I definitely felt a similar feeling - you couldn't really feel where the different gears were. It's disappointing that the 6cyl is the same way...

The only problem is finding third. I've been going back to first. I thought the car was going to skid out. It revved to like 7k before I quickly got it to fourth. The Camaros I test drove didn't do this. I'm going to take it to a parking lot.

I do like that an "R" appears on the display for reverse so you know you aren't in first.

My past 322k miles have been on a Prius, so shifting is something I need to get used to again. This car has way more than enough power. I'm spinning the tires in first and second too much (not on purpose). The V8 is totally unnecessary for my purposes and for another 10k, I definitely don't need it.

Your car is much more fun. Anything manual to me is fun at this point.

I do like having hill assist on the Camaro. Once this is paid off, I'll look at the FRS again or earlier if I have crazy Camaro issues.

[regal]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

How can you love something that you're unsure of? Do I have to link to the posts of people getting this car lemon lawed based on fogged up taillights or idle hunting or crickets?

This car isn't for everybody and if a potential owner doesn't want to deal with potential issues then that's totally ok, even if for most people they are non-issues. A buyer that gets immediately turned off by the chirping is going to get turned off by rattles, road noise, fogged up tailights, trim pieces wearing out quickly, stiff second gear, popping rear package shelf, rattling clutch/flywheel and on and on, odds are the average owner will experience at least one of these issues and complain.

.

Well I love it because fogged tail lights, chirping, squeaks, rattles are flyshit. They could have just thrown in a 100 lbs of sound deadener but I'm glad they didn't and fogged tail lights who cares, drill a damn hole in the bottom. These are typical new car buyer complaints, the type who keeps a car 3 years at most and trades in.


My "unsure" off about the engine isn't in the next 100k mi its the next 200k miles. I'm not a new car buyer, but a midweight FR low COG, drivers car pulled me out of the wood work. I don't think there will be another made like it, in fact I think its the last of its kind at least in this price range. Never bought into the dream that Nissan will follow suit and certainly not Honda Motor co.




I hope the original poster enjoys the camero, to each is own. I think its an atrocious compared to a real '67- '69 camero. But what ever floats your boat.

[Boxer486]

Originally Posted by regal

Well I hate to say this but TSB are good.

Not when pretty much every model you've made over the last 30 years racks up 10 pages worth. That's not good, that's a fundamental problem with your organization.

It's not a coincidence that the number of TSBs from Toyota and Honda are but a fraction of those from GM, Ford and Chrysler over the same period of time. The reliability of these cars seems indicative of a correlation to the number of TSBs which are also underpinned by other various fundamental differences.

GM transparency? Toyota had a recall to fix a typo in the owners manual. GM killed 13 people over a $1 part.

[chrisl]

Originally Posted by Jen

The only problem is finding third. I've been going back to first. I thought the car was going to skid out. It revved to like 7k before I quickly got it to fourth. The Camaros I test drove didn't do this. I'm going to take it to a parking lot.

Be very careful about doing that - the rev limiter won't protect you from that kind of overrev, and most engines don't do so well when they're dragged above their redline after you shift into the wrong gear...

Originally Posted by Jen

I do like that an "R" appears on the display for reverse so you know you aren't in first.

I didn't like how easy it was to accidentally go into reverse rather than first - there isn't a ton of difference between the two, from a tactile standpoint (at least in the SS). The dashboard gear indicator is nice though, since it at least gives you some warning when you accidentally put it in R rather than 1.

Originally Posted by Jen

My past 322k miles have been on a Prius, so shifting is something I need to get used to again. This car has way more than enough power. I'm spinning the tires in first and second too much (not on purpose). The V8 is totally unnecessary for my purposes and for another 10k, I definitely don't need it.

Keep in mind, I live at altitude (5500 feet), so the power is down pretty significantly for me compared to anyone at sea level. A manual Camaro SS up here is probably only making about 350 crank horsepower, and the V6 is down to probably 265 or so (sadly).

Originally Posted by Jen

Your car is much more fun. Anything manual to me is fun at this point.

I do like having hill assist on the Camaro. Once this is paid off, I'll look at the FRS again or earlier if I have crazy Camaro issues.

Actually, due to the horsepower loss at altitude for an NA engine, I don't own an FRS/BRZ. They are fun little cars though. At the same time, I definitely understand what you mean about anything manual being fun - I still enjoy driving my 175hp Outback - it has a reasonably nice manual gearbox, and an engine that is nice and smooth all the way up to its 6400rpm redline, and that makes it a joy to drive (despite its large amount of body roll and fairly low power).

As for crazy Camaro issues? I hope you don't have those. I would never wish car problems on anyone. Enjoy your Camaro!

[regal]

Originally Posted by Boxer486

Not when pretty much every model you've made over the last 30 years racks up 10 pages worth. That's not good, that's a fundamental problem with your organization.

It's not a coincidence that the number of TSBs from Toyota and Honda are but a fraction of those from GM, Ford and Chrysler over the same period of time. The reliability of these cars seems indicative of a correlation to the number of TSBs which are also underpinned by other various fundamental differences.

GM transparency? Toyota had a recall to fix a typo in the owners manual. GM killed 13 people over a $1 part.

I'm not getting into a pissing match between GM and Toyota, we both know the better run company. Hell GM could be called the epitome of corruption, I've seen it.


But Scion service and TSB has been a lot left to be desired with the twins. I got better service with my '09 Yaris than my new Scion. But I can manage without the hassle, I guess they see the FRS as a DIY type person car, but there aren't many of us left.


Case in point I've never heard of a company that refuses to flash to the latest calib rom, and have the nerve to charge you $40 if they deem its not needed while all the new ones have it, and no rentals? Should have waited a year and bought used.


But I had to have a Japanese mid weight FR coupe manual 6 speed with LSD right when it came out. Buying used is almost always a better deal.

[Boxer486]

Originally Posted by regal

Case in point I've never heard of a company that refuses to flash to the latest calib rom, and have the nerve to charge you $40 if they deem its not needed while all the new ones have it, and no rentals? Should have waited a year and bought used.

That's mostly a dealer issue. I've learned after many years what I can blame on corporate and what I can blame on the stealership. That's why I stopped going over fifteen years ago. There is some shady stuff going on I have heard about regarding schemes to increase traffic to service depts to help bolster dealerships but I can't confirm or deny that.

[regal]

Originally Posted by Boxer486

That's mostly a dealer issue. I've learned after many years what I can blame on corporate and what I can blame on the stealership. That's why I stopped going over fifteen years ago. There is some shady stuff going on I have heard about regarding schemes to increase traffic to service depts to help bolster dealerships but I can't confirm or deny that.

Its a dealer issue that Corp Scion condones and Corp Toyota doesn't (same dealership.) I was treated like a valued customer with my new Toyota and a second classs citizen with the Scion at the same dealership.


Finally said screw and bought a tatrix now I have Ecuflash and techstream. One day we'll figure out how to program TPMS and have no use for the dealer

[BadMoon]

What a dumb thread. I feel dumber myself for checking up on it.

[Jen]

Originally Posted by BadMoon

What a dumb thread. I feel dumber myself for checking up on it.

The maturity.

[DIF]

Originally Posted by Jen

I can't imagine what you guys do to people who come on here and don't love your cars.

There are a lot of holes in the Nevada desert.

[s2d4]

Originally Posted by Jen

The maturity.

It gets old really quick when people don't listen to constructive advice or at least give it the time of the day because of some blinkers on tunnel vision/preconceived notion.

[BadMoon]

Originally Posted by Jen

The maturity.

Exactly. Read how many times you go back and forth. Hell just read your first post in this thread about the Camaro that you eventually purchased.

I have a manual R/T Challenger now (425hp) that feels like an ocean liner. I test drove a Camaro yesterday, and even with the 323hp, it felt like it didn't want to go anywhere, smooth as a Cadillac, no road feel, but a beautiful thing to look at.

The FRS has 200 hp but feels worlds faster than the Camaro and hauls more ass than my Challenger. I was really surprised. The closest thing I have driven to compare it to would be a Porsche. It feels the same size as a Porsche and has that same kind of road feel. The Camaro totally lacks that road feel.

I totally understand what they mean in the reviews when they say that this is a driver's car. This car was all over the place, took corners like a lunatic, and was screeching tires.

That said, I am not used to the clutch at all. The Camaro is pretty close to my Challenger. The FRS was a completely different beast. You definitely had to shift it more and it was way harder for me to get the thing started. I stalled it like three times when we first started moving.

So basically you traded in your car for a car that drives
"pretty close" like your current one because of a mistaken belief that the FRS is not reliable? Am I correct? If so.....then there is this gem.

The noise from the engine would drive me up a wall, I couldn't deal with it.

I'm hoping the Camaro is oaky. It's nice, white, black interior, manual, orange racing stripes, it moves.

If you want a reliable car, get a Prius. Seriously. I have 322k miles and you can't break the car. I'm forever going to have one of those cars to commute with unless something better comes along.

When the FRS has been out a few model years and there are no more "crickets" then I'm game. It's an awesome car, drives better than what's out there, and is a load of fun. I'm taking the Chevy bet vs the Scion bet for issues. It seems I would have guaranteed "cricket" issues.

Sounds to me like you should have bought another Prius. I could go on and on with quotes from this thread where you contradict yourself multiple times. But again, I'm now even dumber for continuing to go on about it. Shame on me.

[Mikem53]

Originally Posted by chrisl

It's kind of amusing, since I just recently had the opposite experience in a test drive of a new Camaro SS - I floored it all the way to redline in second gear on a highway onramp, and I had a feeling of "really? Is that it? I thought this thing was supposed to have 400hp...". I guess it all depends on whether or not you're used to responsive, agile, lightweight cars. As for the FA20 and it's many noises? It sounds like a reasonably normal small, high compression, direct injection engine with minimal sound deadening to me...

My nephew has a new SS camaro.. It's hard to believe it has the same LS3 engine as my vette had.. The thing felt like a pig in comparison.. So heavy and big.. Gross! How anyone can choose a mega fat blob car over something smaller and so agile as the twins.. Bulk and loose and fat vs scalpel like lightweight precision.. Her loss.. If it's even real.. And because of a cricket sound? Lol..
Whatever....