Frs vs BMW z4 - Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community

si · 05-31-2012, 10:11 PM

I have ordered a raven frs, but since have been looking at a 2007 BMW 3.0i with less than 18000 miles at a price several thousand less than the frs......any thoughts,pros and cons?

chulooz · 05-31-2012, 10:37 PM

New VS used is the first question. Then comes the BMW reliability; you wouldnt happen to be an engineer would ya?

si · 06-01-2012, 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chulooz

New VS used is the first question. Then comes the BMW reliability; you wouldnt happen to be an engineer would ya?

I'm not an engineer or mechanic nor have I ever owned a BMW, are they really that bad for reliability? Have only ever owned Mazdas, Toyotas and Hondas which have all been decent mechanically.

Sasquachulator · 06-01-2012, 01:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by si

I'm not an engineer or mechanic nor have I ever owned a BMW, are they really that bad for reliability? Have only ever owned Mazdas, Toyotas and Hondas which have all been decent mechanically.

Lets put it this way.
Reliability wise, they could last a long time just like any other car.
But if something breaks, you're gonna be paying up the ass for it.....

350is · 06-01-2012, 01:35 AM

This is just my opinion. BMW is NOT RELIABLE cars. German car drive good & look good when it run. If you get a used bmw, be prepared $1k to $3k for frequent trip to dealer w/ rip-off maintenance service. German car always have problem and high cost repairs. You can order most of Japanese car parts for good deal price online and have it replace at any shop or diy. Good luck.

Capt Canuck · 06-01-2012, 01:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by si

I'm not an engineer or mechanic nor have I ever owned a BMW, are they really that bad for reliability? Have only ever owned Mazdas, Toyotas and Hondas which have all been decent mechanically.

Go read up on a BMW forum. Most here are weened on Japanese cars and fear those of German origin will take all their money.

Will a used BMW Z4 be as cheap to maintain as a brand new FRS? No. But do your due dilligence on the forums and call up some BMW specialists and make an informed decision

reni · 06-01-2012, 03:16 AM

It won't be cheaper considering upkeep... which will be an arm and a leg if you can't do the work yourself.

Scooby · 06-01-2012, 03:36 AM

Never prefer a used car over a new one.

RaceR · 06-01-2012, 11:51 AM

Since this thread got so into maintinance and stuff ill go the same way..

New cars are always very cheap to maintain! Combined with 5 years warranty and you should have minimal expenses.
A used higher power sports car will always have higher maintenance costs.
_______

Some years ago i owned 2 older BMWs (e36) when they were over 10 years old.
Little problems. Cheap parts (due to 3. party options.)
My Toyota MR-2 cost me a fortune btw.. Not reliable, expensive parts from dealer
________

I used to be involved in the BMW community earlier. I could not see or hear the complaints some people on this forum say about them.
Over the years I have seen several charts on reliability (EU and scandinavia) In most of them I have noticed BMW were above average. And often over the other German rivals. But people "over here" tend to have smaller engines compared to the US.
Seeing some US reports from late years, they seem to be under average on reliability.
________

Funny facts about BMW here in scandinavia according to Autoindex.
1. BMW have the most loyal buyers. (usually number one, always in top three)
2. BMW owners are on average the people who are are most satisfied/happy with their cars. (always seen them in top three)

I do not doubt the information above.

_____________
This is my personal opinion and toughs, combined with what what many others say and what reports/statistics say. (May not be the same in USA)
1. BMW owners are among the more aggressive drivers in traffic. They are among the fastest drivers (usually Audi seem to win here). I rarely see a BMW making traffic go slower.
They drive their cars harder compared to the average car. BMW also appeal to people who like do drive. You know, "Ultimate driving machine"...
Compare the average BMW driver with the typical Prius, Aygo and Yaris driver.
Those drivers take corners about the same speed as someone in a weelchair (a little exaggeration there, but not by much).
Point is. BMW drivers generally drive harder compared to owners of most other brands. Of course that would make the car have more wear and tear making components go wrong.

2. Most german cars, like BMW are loaded with equipment. There is a lot more stuff can can go wrong compared to the average Japanese cars. Of course that would have a negative impact on reliability.
__________

The BMW Z4 3.0si (probably not the car mentioned be the OP) is a real beauty!

noAE86 · 06-03-2012, 01:41 PM

PRICE OF ADMISSION
^
dont look at the second had price of the bmw, look at the new price and how old it is now,
if you could not afford the new price you prob cant afford to keep it running,
the z4 was made and marketed to a high salary segment, and the car makers in there wisdom know if you got the pocket to buy it new you can afford to shell out each time you need new brakes, coils(lots of coils) etc, (thats why the ppl on BMW forums don't complain about expensive servicing and parts)

my bmw 745 when i had it
FFS a set of wiper blades cost me $80nzd about $26USD, and ecu faults dont get "repaired" they get replaced at $2000 a unit, and the car had 7 freaking computer units, praying to the car gods that non of the other ones got faults. 5 coils changed in less then 6 months at 430 each + labor, when they go they commit suicide in pairs,

my bmw 330i when my wife had it, not a single problem since new,
my company 2012 mini cooper, still waiting for something to break, and i know it will cos of the way i treat it...
bmw 328---great car back then,

if you can afford the frs/brz new then most likely you can afford to keep it running,
my ae86 has only cost me one rear axle ($100) and a 2way LSD rebuild ($500) in the last 4 years, i beat the living crap out of it every time,
ive owned alot of cars in my time and the bmws have exactly the same amount of problems as any other good car, BUT they cost more to fix each time,
i see more bmw's in my future,

CSSM · 06-03-2012, 01:48 PM

We bought a new BMW twin turbo 5 in 2008, and nothing has gone wrong so far.

Mitchs_86 · 06-03-2012, 02:33 PM

I had a 2005 2.5i Z4 ad loved the car! Never had any issues arise within the 67,000 miles I put on it in a year and a half (I drive ALOT). I bought it as a CPO with 16,000 miles on it when was about 3 years old. I consider BMW a great brand, but maintenance isn't cheap. The only reason I sold the Z4 was because I didn't have enough space to haul things, it was my daily driver...

05-31-2012, 10:11 PM	#1
si Member Join Date: May 2012 Drives: FRS Location: Canada Posts: 24 Thanks: 1 Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts Mentioned: 12 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Frs vs BMW z4 I have ordered a raven frs, but since have been looking at a 2007 BMW 3.0i with less than 18000 miles at a price several thousand less than the frs......any thoughts,pros and cons?

06-01-2012, 01:35 AM	#5
350is Member Join Date: May 2011 Drives: TRD86 Location: CA Posts: 36 Thanks: 1 Thanked 5 Times in 3 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	This is just my opinion. BMW is NOT RELIABLE cars. German car drive good & look good when it run. If you get a used bmw, be prepared $1k to $3k for frequent trip to dealer w/ rip-off maintenance service. German car always have problem and high cost repairs. You can order most of Japanese car parts for good deal price online and have it replace at any shop or diy. Good luck. Last edited by 350is; 06-01-2012 at 02:53 AM.

06-01-2012, 03:16 AM	#7
reni Nobody beats the B[I\|R]Z Join Date: Apr 2012 Drives: shopping cart i stole from walmart Location: somewhere Posts: 939 Thanks: 262 Thanked 1,145 Times in 456 Posts Mentioned: 7 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	It won't be cheaper considering upkeep... which will be an arm and a leg if you can't do the work yourself. __________________ "The [Subaru BRZ] feels as trim, nimble, and athletic as the great sports coupes of the pre-bloat era." -- Car and Driver, June 2012 "And I thought to myself, I'm not going to die, because this is annoying" -- Niki Lauda

06-03-2012, 01:48 PM	#11
CSSM Still Dreamin' Join Date: Dec 2011 Drives: 2001 Chevrolet Tahoe Location: Washington/Oregon Posts: 656 Thanks: 88 Thanked 115 Times in 67 Posts Mentioned: 3 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	We bought a new BMW twin turbo 5 in 2008, and nothing has gone wrong so far. __________________ Check out my photos here!! (Click)

05-31-2012, 10:37 PM	#2
chulooz Registered you sir Join Date: Feb 2010 Drives: 99 impreza coupe Location: DC / CT Posts: 1,666 Thanks: 259 Thanked 380 Times in 207 Posts Mentioned: 3 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	New VS used is the first question. Then comes the BMW reliability; you wouldnt happen to be an engineer would ya?

06-01-2012, 03:36 AM	#8
Scooby Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Drives: Audi A5 Coupe Location: Netherlands Posts: 103 Thanks: 135 Thanked 29 Times in 22 Posts Mentioned: 5 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Never prefer a used car over a new one.

06-01-2012, 11:51 AM	#9
RaceR Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Drives: 2010 Cooper S, 74 Beetle Location: Norway Posts: 726 Thanks: 239 Thanked 252 Times in 124 Posts Mentioned: 2 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Since this thread got so into maintinance and stuff ill go the same way.. New cars are always very cheap to maintain! Combined with 5 years warranty and you should have minimal expenses. A used higher power sports car will always have higher maintenance costs. _______ Some years ago i owned 2 older BMWs (e36) when they were over 10 years old. Little problems. Cheap parts (due to 3. party options.) My Toyota MR-2 cost me a fortune btw.. Not reliable, expensive parts from dealer ________ I used to be involved in the BMW community earlier. I could not see or hear the complaints some people on this forum say about them. Over the years I have seen several charts on reliability (EU and scandinavia) In most of them I have noticed BMW were above average. And often over the other German rivals. But people "over here" tend to have smaller engines compared to the US. Seeing some US reports from late years, they seem to be under average on reliability. ________ Funny facts about BMW here in scandinavia according to Autoindex. 1. BMW have the most loyal buyers. (usually number one, always in top three) 2. BMW owners are on average the people who are are most satisfied/happy with their cars. (always seen them in top three) I do not doubt the information above. _____________ This is my personal opinion and toughs, combined with what what many others say and what reports/statistics say. (May not be the same in USA) 1. BMW owners are among the more aggressive drivers in traffic. They are among the fastest drivers (usually Audi seem to win here). I rarely see a BMW making traffic go slower. They drive their cars harder compared to the average car. BMW also appeal to people who like do drive. You know, "Ultimate driving machine"... Compare the average BMW driver with the typical Prius, Aygo and Yaris driver. Those drivers take corners about the same speed as someone in a weelchair (a little exaggeration there, but not by much). Point is. BMW drivers generally drive harder compared to owners of most other brands. Of course that would make the car have more wear and tear making components go wrong. 2. Most german cars, like BMW are loaded with equipment. There is a lot more stuff can can go wrong compared to the average Japanese cars. Of course that would have a negative impact on reliability. __________ The BMW Z4 3.0si (probably not the car mentioned be the OP) is a real beauty!

06-03-2012, 01:41 PM	#10
noAE86 Member Join Date: May 2012 Drives: ae86, etc.. Location: CHCH new zealand Posts: 76 Thanks: 0 Thanked 12 Times in 9 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	PRICE OF ADMISSION ^ dont look at the second had price of the bmw, look at the new price and how old it is now, if you could not afford the new price you prob cant afford to keep it running, the z4 was made and marketed to a high salary segment, and the car makers in there wisdom know if you got the pocket to buy it new you can afford to shell out each time you need new brakes, coils(lots of coils) etc, (thats why the ppl on BMW forums don't complain about expensive servicing and parts) my bmw 745 when i had it FFS a set of wiper blades cost me $80nzd about $26USD, and ecu faults dont get "repaired" they get replaced at $2000 a unit, and the car had 7 freaking computer units, praying to the car gods that non of the other ones got faults. 5 coils changed in less then 6 months at 430 each + labor, when they go they commit suicide in pairs, my bmw 330i when my wife had it, not a single problem since new, my company 2012 mini cooper, still waiting for something to break, and i know it will cos of the way i treat it... bmw 328---great car back then, if you can afford the frs/brz new then most likely you can afford to keep it running, my ae86 has only cost me one rear axle ($100) and a 2way LSD rebuild ($500) in the last 4 years, i beat the living crap out of it every time, ive owned alot of cars in my time and the bmws have exactly the same amount of problems as any other good car, BUT they cost more to fix each time, i see more bmw's in my future,

06-03-2012, 02:33 PM	#12
Mitchs_86 Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Drives: 09 BMW Z4 Location: Madisonville, La Posts: 79 Thanks: 8 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Mentioned: 4 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	I had a 2005 2.5i Z4 ad loved the car! Never had any issues arise within the 67,000 miles I put on it in a year and a half (I drive ALOT). I bought it as a CPO with 16,000 miles on it when was about 3 years old. I consider BMW a great brand, but maintenance isn't cheap. The only reason I sold the Z4 was because I didn't have enough space to haul things, it was my daily driver...

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