Papa Toyota unhappy that the BRZ/86 feels like a Subaru

[Willpower]

Originally Posted by PulsarBeeerz

The car isn't out yet and none of these number are real:

This ^^^

So we shall see. Nissan needs a good sports car and Toyota needs competition so I’m hoping for it.

[Blighty]

Originally Posted by PulsarBeeerz

It's going to be much more than $1300 all said and done for an aftermarket LSD installed with no factory power train warranty possibly even a voided one but OK.

The cars mention come with a decent LSD even a MX5 does but Nissan can't manage one with a $40K *allegedly* recycled sports car...IDK man...

Nothing to base performance claims off of. The car isn't out yet and none of these number are real. The 400Z is rumored to be 3250lb dry weight; its a 3400lb car just like the A91 Supra. But A91 Supras dyno at 380whp so that's what 435-445bhp (accounting for drive-train losses) easily more than 400bhp from the Z as is Mustangs 460hp.

Its not lighter, its not more powerful. Its based off an old chassis again..that isn't known for great dynamics..

Nissan legendary Japanese build quality..

But does come with a manual and looks like two different cars coming and going so that's neat.

Its such a shame that practically every other rwd sports car has a premium in Australia except for the the 86/BRZ

50k for the cheapest ND2 and 55k for the cheapest 370, 57k for the cheapest mustang and 60k for the cheapest corvett...

Compare that to the base model 86 is 37k...

[Sport-Tech]

Originally Posted by Blighty

Its such a shame that practically every other rwd sports car has a premium in Australia except for the the 86/BRZ

50k for the cheapest ND2 and 55k for the cheapest 370, 57k for the cheapest mustang and 60k for the cheapest corvett...

Compare that to the base model 86 is 37k...

It's a similar scenario in Canada with the exception of the base 370Z being fairly cheap, at about the same price as a loaded twin.

[Red-86]

Originally Posted by Blighty

Its such a shame that practically every other rwd sports car has a premium in Australia except for the the 86/BRZ

50k for the cheapest ND2

Huh? Cheapest ND2 roadster is $39k driveaway. With the 1.5L engine. Loaded 2.0 GT is $48k. Base RF with 2.0 is $45k. Very comparable to 86 GTS or loaded BRZ.

and 55k for the cheapest 370

Where are you getting these prices? My 2020 370Z was $50k driveaway before negotiating.

Your prices are consistently $5k+ above the manufacturer’s advertised driveaway prices before you even start negotiating. I can’t help but feel you are overstating the real prices for the MX-5 and 370Z to make the twins sound better value. There is no need for such exaggeration, the twins are still good value. But in reality all these cars are in competition price-wise for a buyer with AU $50k to spend on RWD sportscar. Especially since most 86/BRZ sales were the more expensive mid-$40k loaded models rather than the sub-$40k base models.

[JesseG]

Originally Posted by wbradley

The 400Z will be Nissan's 2 door version of an Audi A7

I know I'm repeating myself.

Yeahhhhh no, not even close. Or maybe you were being really sarcastic?! The 400Z will be in the same category as the Supra, M2, Mustang GT, Camaro SS, and maybe RS3 or Cayman.


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[Blighty]

Originally Posted by Red-86

Huh? Cheapest ND2 roadster is $39k driveaway. With the 1.5L engine. Loaded 2.0 GT is $48k. Base RF with 2.0 is $45k. Very comparable to 86 GTS or loaded BRZ.



Where are you getting these prices? My 2020 370Z was $50k driveaway before negotiating.

Your prices are consistently $5k+ above the manufacturer’s advertised driveaway prices before you even start negotiating. I can’t help but feel you are overstating the real prices for the MX-5 and 370Z to make the twins sound better value. There is no need for such exaggeration, the twins are still good value. But in reality all these cars are in competition price-wise for a buyer with AU $50k to spend on RWD sportscar. Especially since most 86/BRZ sales were the more expensive mid-$40k loaded models rather than the sub-$40k base models.

Ahh sorry you are right Red. No ulterior motive, my budget just doesn't even stretch an extra 10k.

I didn't include the 1.5l MX5 - but sure, its 40.5k on the website, with nothing on it. I don't even think of that when I think of the ND2.

I always forget about the RF model, yeah its 46k a the cheapest,(I'm not rounding down $985) - I rounded up the 86 too...

I'm not sure why I thought I saw 55k for the 370, I've looked at the website now and your right, I must of remembered if from before 2018 when it was 55k.

Leaving the 1.5l out of it, each other car is at _least_ 25% more expensive, and in other markets I just don't believe that's the case - which is the point I'm making.

For instance the 370 is almost the same price in the US, ditto for the MX5 ND2 (2l) in the UK.

I'm not trying to make the 86/BRZ seem like more value, as you said we all know they have lots of value, I just want Australia to have at least one other car that sits down there - (forgive me if I don't view the 1.5l MX5 as good enough).

[Red-86]

Originally Posted by Blighty

For instance the 370 is almost the same price in the US

Just for completeness sake, in the USA the version of the 370 that is similar to the 86 is the base grade with cloth seats, 18" rims, no LSD and a crappy stereo without a screen or nav - i.e. a complete stripper model. We don't even get that base grade here, we get the top tier 'Sport Touring' trim 370 with leather, 19" rims, VLSD, Bose and Nav etc. If you compare $AU50k it works out to around $US38k which is bang on price wise for their Sport Touring version in the States. So it's actually just as good value here as there.

I just want Australia to have at least one other car that sits down there - (forgive me if I don't view the 1.5l MX5 as good enough).

Yeah, I get it. The bargain price of the entry level twins is appealing here. I just expect a bit of a price bump with the new cars. I very much doubt you'll be able to get GR 86 GT for the $AU30k you could get one back in 2013. My guess is the new GR 86 will start around AU$40k for a GT, with the GTS being about AU$46k. We'll see how far off the mark I am.

[Blighty]

Originally Posted by Red-86

Yeah, I get it. The bargain price of the entry level twins is appealing here. I just expect a bit of a price bump with the new cars. I very much doubt you'll be able to get GR 86 GT for the $AU30k you could get one back in 2013. My guess is the new GR 86 will start around AU$40k for a GT, with the GTS being about AU$46k. We'll see how far off the mark I am.

What's interesting is how little the price of the 86 base model has changed.

In my deposit for the GR 86, the dealer contract is using the base 86 current gen. Its still $29,990 before on-roads and tax.

I'm hoping the price doesn't go up any more than 5k. Otherwise I might be forced to buy the 'low' spec one.

[Israel Moore]

It's a classic Chris Harris video, no overproduction, no shenanigans. It's all about driving the cars and telling us what we need to know.