Gauging Interest:New for 2017 Essex Designed AP Racing Radi-CAL Competition Brake Kit

[JRitt]

Originally Posted by RJasonKlein

@JRitt you're a man of your word! For the rest of you, Jeff and I exchanged e-mails a few days ago when I inquired about about the possibility of developing a Radi-CAL Pro5000R for our cars, and he said he'd survey the forum to gauge interest.

Obviously, I'm on board! Option A or B would work for me, but I think option B offers the broadest appeal. At around $2,600 I can put a deposit down on a kit now.

Thanks! We discussed this project in our weekly product planning meeting. We had touched on it before, but the calipers were just too far out on the horizon, and we had a stack of other projects that we needed to get done first. I think the time is ripe to bring the latest tech to the 86 market. We just haven't had the proper components to do so. Our Radi-CAL kits are becoming the gold-standard in every market we enter with them. Whatever we end up with, I can promise you that it will be by far the most advanced option on the market, and unlike anything else at any price.

[cjd]

I admit that for the events I do, the only thing that's really of value is weight. Don't get me wrong, pedal feel and such matters a lot, but the only compelling reason for me to switch would be weight loss over the Sprint kit. Fade isn't on the map.

Same weight and more wheel options would be nice, less weight would be crazy...
That said, same weight as Sprint with the capacity of the Endurance would really be something. Buying new today this would probably get my money over the Sprint setup in A or B. I'd take Sprint if it's still lighter, since it's also less expensive.

Also, you mention rear configuration; I assume that we'll not see a rear package for this car but, can you confirm?

C

[Brzzee]

Like option B.

[JRitt]

Like option B.

Originally Posted by cjd

I admit that for the events I do, the only thing that's really of value is weight. Don't get me wrong, pedal feel and such matters a lot, but the only compelling reason for me to switch would be weight loss over the Sprint kit. Fade isn't on the map.

Same weight and more wheel options would be nice, less weight would be crazy...
That said, same weight as Sprint with the capacity of the Endurance would really be something. Buying new today this would probably get my money over the Sprint setup in A or B. I'd take Sprint if it's still lighter, since it's also less expensive.

Also, you mention rear configuration; I assume that we'll not see a rear package for this car but, can you confirm?

C

Thanks for the feedback gents. If we go up to the 310mm disc with the Radi-CAL, we're going to wind up within half a pound of the Sprint Kit, except with more heat capacity. The CP944X Radi-CAL is significantly stiffer than the CP8350, and it will provide a substantial feel improvement. The domed-back pistons will contribute to this benefit as well. Cooling will also be improved considerably. As described previously, the ventilated pistons allow the pistons, fluid, and caliper body to run cooler. Also, the design of the Radi-CAL caliper body itself lends itself to superior cooling, since air can flow around and between the pistons. The outer contour of the Rad-CAL is a bit more sculpted vs. the CP8350, which should help with wheel spoke clearance. Additionally, since the caliper will move out slightly towards the wheel barrel, that will provide even more wheel spoke clearance. The 310mm spare discs would be the same price as the current 299mm discs.

Basically, if we go Option B, the new kit will do more than the Sprint Kit in numerous areas, while still weighing nearly identical. That doesn't even include bragging rights or street cred.

[Devil 86]

Jizz. I just jizzed. Many times

[RiskyTrousers]

Wow, beautiful piece of kit! I would prefer option A, for maximum addition of lightness!

[churchx]

JRitt: btw, but how about such heresy as 16" or even 15" wheel fitment?
Hence i'd probably vote for smaller disk size.

[Vracer111]

Thanks for the explanation on the caliper design. So basically they have the same mass as earlier designs because of previous optimization, but the Radi-CAL design was not really a matter of modifing the existing design - it is entirely a rethink of the caliper using the same mass but redistributed and restructured in a way that dramatically improves stiffness and thermal cooling of the caliper. Got it....and fully on board with it. Was just hoping a little mass could have been removed in the process....would have been icing on the cake.

Question regarding fitment: so if a certain wheel fits the Sprint kit, then the Radi-CAL kit should have the same or better fitment even though it will have a wider caliper because its 'centerline' will be more inboard compared to the other calipers? The wheels I run have a 7mm clearance closest to the wheel hub according to the Sprint Kit template. I should expect the Radi-CAL kit to have about the same clearance as well with option A? Or would option B be needed for a similar fit (don't like the weight penalty though):

[Traktor]

You're saying these give better feel than the Sprints?!?!? I am in love with my Sprint and Carbon Lorraine pad combo and can't imagine how it could be improved for feel.
My instructor drove my car at the last HPDE and said it was one of the best setups he'd ever driven.
Too bad I've already invested in the Sprints or I'd be in!
I might still be if you were to go for option A. I'm guessing they will have a different mounting hole pattern than the CP8350s?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[JRitt]

Originally Posted by churchx

JRitt: btw, but how about such heresy as 16" or even 15" wheel fitment?
Hence i'd probably vote for smaller disk size.

Heresy indeed! :p The 310mm disc should still fit inside many 15's, and no issues in 16's. We cram our 325mm disc in some 15's in circle track racing!

Thanks for the explanation on the caliper design. So basically they have the same mass as earlier designs because of previous optimization, but the Radi-CAL design was not really a matter of modifing the existing design - it is entirely a rethink of the caliper using the same mass but redistributed and restructured in a way that dramatically improves stiffness and thermal cooling of the caliper. Got it....and fully on board with it. Was just hoping a little mass could have been removed in the process....would have been icing on the cake.

Precisely, you got it. The only way to save more weight is to go to exotic materials such as titanium through-bolts and pistons, or go to a monobloc design. All of those routes would drastically increase the price.

Question regarding fitment: so if a certain wheel fits the Sprint kit, then the Radi-CAL kit should have the same or better fitment even though it will have a wider caliper because its 'centerline' will be more inboard compared to the other calipers? The wheels I run have a 7mm clearance closest to the wheel hub according to the Sprint Kit template. I should expect the Radi-CAL kit to have about the same clearance as well with option A? Or would option B be needed for a similar fit (don't like the weight penalty though):

The aluminum disc hat we use on our 299mm disc can also fit our 310mm disc. We would likely retain that hat, so the offset of the disc won't change. It will sit in exactly the same location as it does now. I have to double check, but I believe the caliper offset on the Radi-CAL is also very similar to the CP8350. That means the caliper is going to be oriented very similarly to our current Sprint Kit relative to the spokes and wheel barrel.

If we went with Option A and kept the 299mm disc, everything would fit pretty much exactly how it does now.

Option B would only be a very slight change. Looking at your drawing, imagine lengthening the wheel fitment template 5mm towards the wheel barrel (going from a 299mm to a 310mm /2= 5mm radius increase). So if you move the whole template out 5mm out towards the wheel barrel, you'd be left 20mm of barrel clearance, and potentially gain a couple mm of spoke clearance on the inner spoke near the hub..maybe from 7mm to 9mm or so (depending on the angle of the wheel spoke). On those particular wheels, it looks like you may lose a little spoke clearance on the outside though...maybe you'd go from 15mm to 13mm, since the spokes start to curve back in as they get closer to the wheel barrel. You'd still have plenty of clearance everywhere though.

See my edited drawing below...I just took the template and slid it out to the left. I left a nub of the red line to illustrate how far I moved it. Please let me know if that doesn't make sense. Thanks!

[JRitt]

Originally Posted by Traktor

You're saying these give better feel than the Sprints?!?!? I am in love with my Sprint and Carbon Lorraine pad combo and can't imagine how it could be improved for feel.
My instructor drove my car at the last HPDE and said it was one of the best setups he'd ever driven.
Too bad I've already invested in the Sprints or I'd be in!
I might still be if you were to go for option A. I'm guessing they will have a different mounting hole pattern than the CP8350s?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks for the great feedback, and I'm glad you're still loving your kit! We will be sure to investigate a caliper upgrade package for current Sprint Kit customers. Worst case you'd have to buy calipers and brackets. Best case, maybe just calipers. We'll do what we can to figure out a solution. Thanks again for the purchase!

[gramicci101]

Originally Posted by JRitt

We will be sure to investigate a caliper upgrade package for current Sprint Kit customers.

There was another thread just posted asking about this exact subject.
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=115425

[cjd]

Originally Posted by JRitt

Thanks for the great feedback, and I'm glad you're still loving your kit! We will be sure to investigate a caliper upgrade package for current Sprint Kit customers. Worst case you'd have to buy calipers and brackets. Best case, maybe just calipers. We'll do what we can to figure out a solution. Thanks again for the purchase!

I know I'd be more inclined to sell a working Sprint setup than upgrade the calipers. Not that I have a compelling reason to sell, the Sprint really is excellent.

Unless... it's a 4 wheel upgrade. I assume it's still just front.

C

[Iceman]

Option B, please & thank you.

Which kind of pad would these use? I'm only interested if Carbone Lorraine's lineup is available, but i guess that won't be a problem.