BRZ STi tS Confirmed. Teased on Official Website

[snky_snky]

Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k

In my earlier post about curvy roads and traffic, I wasn't blaming traffic on anything related to the car. Rather saying that it's not easy (on public roads) to enjoy this car the way that puts a big smile on your face. An extra 50 hp cold help you get grins as well, from stomping on the throttle more...which something that more readily able to be done on public roads

I agree with you. But I think this friendly argument is going in a circle; my point was that I also welcome additional power, but for the price we paid on a new (sports) car, I can't really complain.

This thread has gotten away from the tS model, I'm going to kindly bow out ;-) Good discussion, however. :tup:

[chanomatik]

Originally Posted by DylanFRS

They are pretty similarly equipped to be honest, aside from the Golf. And in that list, the WRX Premium is better equipped (performance aside) than the STi I listed.



I am sure they are. I am sure the suspension is up to the task too. Doesn't mean that Subaru deems them up to the task.

I am hoping that if a turbo model of the BRZ comes out that you can get it in the lower trim and for a few grand more because if it is $35k, I won't be able to afford it. But I am hoping Subaru knows they will sell it in the $35k range and will not do it because they won't sell enough at that price. Mostly because I don't want to sell my.

How much did the Honda S2000 cost? And you don't think a turbo'd BRZ should be $35k?

[DylanFRS]

Originally Posted by chanomatik

How much did the Honda S2000 cost? And you don't think a turbo'd BRZ should be $35k?

Are you asking me? I think it will. Do I think it should? That's kind of a subjective question. Do I think the S2000 should have costed $35k? I don't know that either. Car pricing is all relative, isn't it? Honestly, I think it is a bargain that any of us can go out and buy a tiny econo car that will do close to 100mph surrounded by a billion airbags for under $15k. Modern cars are a bargain in themselves.

[tacoss23]

I just doubt highly the possibility of a Turbo BRZ STI for this generation.

As I said before, this car is selling well even with the "not enough power" complain from Magazines, reviews, customers. tS versions like this one will only help to hype up even more the car, but that's not going to stop anyone from getting their BRZ as soon as they can.

Financially speaking and as a business, developing a full STI version with a turbo charged engine, will mean that the car will cost close to or above $35000. Toyota and Subaru both know that at that price range, the profitability of such a project goes down quite a bit, because the volume of sales of a vehicle like that are very low compared to base models.

1) It appeals mostly to enthusiasts.

2) It competes with an entire new segment of powerful sports cars. From muscle cars, to real sports cars like the 370z. Not to mention the used car market that allows you to have Porsche Cayman Ss, M3s, C63s, etc.

All of the sudden the car is no longer a bargain, but rather has to stand on its own, both in reviews and actual performance.

Lets face it, 0-60 and 1/4 in reviews matter for sales, A LOT. It might not matter to you or me, it might not matter to the "real enthusiasts" but we are the minority.

Think about it, the WRX currently does 0-60 in 5.1, the STI is somewhere between 4.5 to 4.7. Those are respectable numbers, so it can get by. What do we expect of a STI BRZ when the base is doing 6.5, maybe...maaaybe 5.4?? That's still slower than most sedans out there, like Altimas and Accords V6s.

I know, 0-60 doesn't really matter when the car is that much fun, whatever, the reality is strictly from a business standpoint, those are selling points for a sports car, if you can't deliver a good performing sheet for $35k, then your sales market is going be greatly diminished, of an already smaller segment.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by Marchy

i didn't realize i was barking at a tree, i thought i was just that dog your neighbor has that you hate who is barking at the world.

THE WORLD I TELLS YOU.

@WolfpackS2k is now a tree.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by chanomatik

How much did the Honda S2000 cost? And you don't think a turbo'd BRZ should be $35k?

35k in 2009 for a brand new one.

Originally Posted by DylanFRS

Are you asking me? I think it will. Do I think it should? That's kind of a subjective question. Do I think the S2000 should have costed $35k? I don't know that either. Car pricing is all relative, isn't it? Honestly, I think it is a bargain that any of us can go out and buy a tiny econo car that will do close to 100mph surrounded by a billion airbags for under $15k. Modern cars are a bargain in themselves.

Lets see... It comes properly cooled... has a factory oil cooler... capability for a complete alignment (camber/caster/toe front, camber/caster rear)...

How much does it cost to add an oil cooler and alignment capability to a FRS/BRZ? =\

Most people will never realize it, but the S2000 is/was a bargain for what you get, if you intend to drive it.

[dsgerbc]

Originally Posted by DylanFRS

And in that list, the WRX Premium is better equipped (performance aside) than the STi I listed.

Lol, Fogs=better equipped?

[Voodoo Rufus]

Originally Posted by maverickar15

I would be lying if I said I was not disappointed with lack of additional power.

...although to be honest, the only time when I think I really wanted additional power is when I'm enjoying a spirited drive in a mountain pass and I don't have enough room to pass the car in front of me safely. I keep thinking that this would have been nothing if I was in my STi...just drop a gear and punch it.

Sure with BRZ I can close the gap and basically ride someone's ass during the corner since this car corners very well but as soon as the corner straightens out the car in front of me also accelerates and I don't have enough power to pass when that happens. Sometimes I do when the person in front of me is slow at getting back on the gas but most of the times I don't, at least with the minimum distance I think I must maintain with the incoming traffic. And when you ride someone's ass getting ready to pass it is a human condition to not let that happen easily. You need instant acceleration to stop people from thinking they won't let you pass.

I would never pass someone in a corner on a public road due to obvious safety concerns so this means I must have enough power to pass someone in a straight road...and BRZ is definitely not adequate in that part. Most of mountain roads here are at 8000+ ft of altitude so that doesn't help either...

And this is the reason I didn't buy the car. Everything else nearly fit what I was looking for in a car.

[OrbitalEllipses]

The more I think about it, the more I realize this is just a commuter car engine in a sports car body. Does it make for fun? Hell yes it does. Would I welcome a proper hi-po version? Hell yes I would.

[DylanFRS]

Originally Posted by Marchy

quality post for sure, but i think you'd get a better idea if you compared the difference between the wrx premium to the sti premium (at 3k more) to at least IMO get a better estimate of the msrp of a turbo brz limited. I do agree with everything else in the above post (which i cut out cuz its huge) so

Yeah, I didn't do just the STi because it was mentioned more than a few times that you get a lot more stuff with the STi. Differentials, driveshafts, tranny, engine, etc.

[DylanFRS]

Originally Posted by dsgerbc

Lol, Fogs=better equipped?

I guess I don't know the Subaru WRX lineup all that well... You are saying that you get fog lights as the only upgrade for a $3k difference in price?

[DylanFRS]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

Lets see... It comes properly cooled... has a factory oil cooler... capability for a complete alignment (camber/caster/toe front, camber/caster rear)...

How much does it cost to add an oil cooler and alignment capability to a FRS/BRZ? =\

Most people will never realize it, but the S2000 is/was a bargain for what you get, if you intend to drive it.

I guess that is what I mean, car pricing is all relative right?

[OrbitalEllipses]

Originally Posted by DylanFRS

I guess that is what I mean, car pricing is all relative right?

You also couldn't get them for $35K from the dealer. Also pre-global economic meltdown too.

[dsgerbc]

Originally Posted by DylanFRS

I guess I don't know the Subaru WRX lineup all that well... You are saying that you get fog lights as the only upgrade for a $3k difference in price?

How the hell should I know what you meant when you said that performance aside WRX premium is better equipped than a base STI? I'm only aware of fog lights being present on WRX premium and absent on a base STI that would qualify as 'better equipped'. There also might be a sunroof, don't remember.