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Scion FR-S / Toyota 86 GT86 General Forum The place to start for the Scion FR-S / Toyota 86 | GT86


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Old 02-09-2017, 11:33 AM   #43
Liquid_Doji
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this is so interesting...
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Old 02-09-2017, 12:40 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by strat61caster View Post
Mazda had the niche and abandoned it.
Toyota hasn't had any 2+2 RWD since the '90s (in the US), they abandoned the niche for over a decade and during that time dominated the industry without it.
Nissan hasn't bothered since the 90s either, Honda never even tried.

Critical thinking would be reading all the statements, interviews, and history about the development of this car, realizing this is the President's pet project and is likely constantly on the chopping block during board meetings as a frivolous expense.

Hell some would argue that the RX-8 was too heavy and grand-toury to qualify which means we had nearly a decade without one of these on the market. How valuable is fulfilling that niche if literally nobody bothered to challenge it for nearly a decade?
I saw some merit of your statement until the boldface above. No, since you nor anyone else here is in board meetings this isn't something that has to be realized. In fact, there's plenty of evidence to suggest otherwise. Like...

Multi-million dollar investments in the LFA, SF-R, FT-1 and sports-sedan-ization of the Camry XSE. These major investments point to Toyota's desire to embrace at the very least the image of performance, but more likely improving performance across their line-up including actual fun to drive niche cars like the ones noted above. To my eyes Toyota's embrace of the 86 seems to be opposite of the market analysis you've provided above.
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Old 02-09-2017, 01:15 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by DAEMANO View Post
I saw some merit of your statement until the boldface above. No, since you nor anyone else here is in board meetings this isn't something that has to be realized. In fact, there's plenty of evidence to suggest otherwise. Like...

Multi-million dollar investments in the LFA, SF-R, FT-1 and sports-sedan-ization of the Camry XSE. These major investments point to Toyota's desire to embrace at the very least the image of performance, but more likely improving performance across their line-up including actual fun to drive niche cars like the ones noted above. To my eyes Toyota's embrace of the 86 seems to be opposite of the market analysis you've provided above.
You're right, I overreached.

But the fact is that getting a car like this made was a struggle. Combine that with past history and I'm not optimistic about seeing a true Mk2 86.

Which is why I bought one.

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You need to remember that this car was the result of an executive board meeting at Toyota in 2007 with the sole agenda that people around the world are losing interest in cars and what Toyota was going to do about it. One suggestion on how to address this was to go back to basics with a sports car that would rekindle interest. In the past, sports cars had been repeatedly rejected as having a poor return on investment, but at this meeting it was decided that if the technology division could make something that could restart interest, then the marketing division would support it.
[...]
Yet the first question from the board when I reported back was, ‘how fast is it?’ They couldn’t imagine a car which drives like a dream but isn’t that quick. I was thinking that maybe the car guys were right when they said they thought Toyota would be the hardest company to get such a high-fun, low-top-speed car past.
http://blog.toyota.co.uk/tada-how-to...eated-the-gt86
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ineedyourdiddly
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Old 02-13-2017, 06:01 PM   #46
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Less of a marketing ploy, more smart business decision, because not all that many were sold last year in North America.
Because why would anyone in their right mind pay $26-30k for a car they can get used for under $20,000. My 2013 BRZ Limited is only worth 16k according to KBB... That's almost HALF of what I paid in 2013.
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Old 02-13-2017, 06:10 PM   #47
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Because why would anyone in their right mind pay $26-30k for a car they can get used for under $20,000.
That's the price you pay to know that YOU will be the ONLY one to flatulate in the drivers seat!

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Old 02-13-2017, 07:28 PM   #48
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That's the price you pay to know that YOU will be the ONLY one to flatulate in the drivers seat!

Getting a custom interior made is far cheaper than this level of depreciation. Maybe a couple grand for a full leather job from a local shop. About the same for Sparco and harnesses. From my POV, they over-saturated the market to the point that you see the 86/FRS/BRZ everywhere. Supply is ridiculously high, even with all the newbies wrecking their cars. Add to that the lackluster power compared to a similarly-priced Mustang and interest dropped off quickly. High supply. Low demand.

I'm only annoyed because I bought my car less than a year before my wife changed her mind about us having kids. The BRZ can haul a baby, but it's a huge pain in the ass. Considering selling for a 4Runner for some off-road hooning. If we don't sell it, I'll start upgrading for track/SCCA duty after it's paid off next year and still get the 4Runner.
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Old 02-13-2017, 08:04 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by darthpnoy1984 View Post
Yeah tell that to the people that surely loves to compare this to the Miata and S2000 LMAFO thats a roadster with no 2+2 seating.


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The 86 is 2+0.5+0.5 at best. Gotta chop off your friends' legs to fit comfortably in the back with anyone in front. Maybe 2+2 for people who are 5' tall. Just because you can fit eight people into a Ford Escort doesn't mean it's a 2+6.
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Old 02-14-2017, 07:28 AM   #50
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Originally Posted by kuhlka View Post
Because why would anyone in their right mind pay $26-30k for a car they can get used for under $20,000. My 2013 BRZ Limited is only worth 16k according to KBB... That's almost HALF of what I paid in 2013.
Hey, could be worse, according to KBB mine is worth a little over $10,000 (Private Sale), but then it is a 5 year old car with just shy of $100,000 miles on it.

In the end though, not sure what you expect. No reason for this car to depreciate any slower than any other car. My car has depreciated about 64% over 5 years. That is a little above average, but primarily due to mileage.

This is right on track for most cars and is why I never buy a car expecting it to hold its value. I simply drive it until it has no value, then it doesn't matter.

It is also why 90% of the cars I buy are used (2 to 10 years old).

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Old 02-14-2017, 11:09 AM   #51
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Originally Posted by kuhlka View Post
The 86 is 2+0.5+0.5 at best. Gotta chop off your friends' legs to fit comfortably in the back with anyone in front. Maybe 2+2 for people who are 5' tall. Just because you can fit eight people into a Ford Escort doesn't mean it's a 2+6.


To some people, those 2 back seats make all the difference.


The 86 is the only rwd car under 3100lbs that has more than 2 seats.
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Old 02-14-2017, 11:12 AM   #52
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My friends without legs love sitting back there.
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Old 02-14-2017, 11:42 AM   #53
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To some people, those 2 back seats make all the difference.


The 86 is the only rwd car under 3100lbs that has more than 2 seats.
I fit 5 people into a mini cooper and it looked like a clown car with all of us pouring out of it. But I must say, there's even less room in the 86
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Old 02-14-2017, 11:44 AM   #54
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To some people, those 2 back seats make all the difference.


The 86 is the only rwd car under 3100lbs that has more than 2 seats.
It's the reason I initially bought it over an S2000.
Needed a backseat everyday and didn't want to deal with driving 2 different cars everyday just to have the pleasure of having an S2000.
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Old 02-14-2017, 11:52 AM   #55
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It's the reason I initially bought it over an S2000.
Needed a backseat everyday and didn't want to deal with driving 2 different cars everyday just to have the pleasure of having an S2000.


Yeah, if I didn't need rear seats occasionally I would be driving a Cayman right now.
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Old 02-14-2017, 11:26 PM   #56
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Gotta stuff the kids in occasionally... So what if they have to sit cross-legged... Haha.
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