spark plugs change...

[Fish]

Originally Posted by GL4787

yeah, because losing their job isn't "incentive" enough to do good work. Some technicians take pride in the jobs they do. Just because you've obviously had a bad experience or two doesn't mean every tech on earth is an unknowledgable dirtbag that's only worried about a paycheck.

Thank you.

I was a BMW Tech for 4 1/2 years. As a Tech we obviously don't have the greatest reputations thanks to a lot of shady mechanics out there. But I can tell you not every Tech is like that (at least where I worked). I can see everyones point about forgotton tools and such. It happens sometimes when your working on 15-25 cars at the same time in one day with some being waiters and the service writer breathing down your neck at the same time. I know, I've done it myself. I even did free labor every now and then just to help a customer out. But I still took great pride in the work I did and made sure I did everything correctly. Thanks to that I got to where I'm at now. I wish I could same the same for some other Techs out there.

But back on topic, my experience has shown that repair manuals are very by the book. They will always tell you to remove something that you won't always have to. This may very well be the case this time as well.

[Calum]

I've been a technician for 13 years now, not automotive, but that's beside the point. I've also been working on cars for over 20 years, I know my work and trust it.

The way automotive shops are run is the cause of the vast majority of the problems, but to the end consumer that doesn't matter. I've know three automotive techs that I trusted. Two work at a small shop about a half hour drive away and they do all of my alignments. The other took a job installing elevators years ago. I'm sure there are more, probably even close to me, but I can't afford to find them. Maybe I'm too picky, maybe I just live in a bad area, I don't know.

Sorry if you take offense to my view point, but it comes from my own experience. YMMV

[Fish]

Originally Posted by Calum

I've been a technician for 13 years now, not automotive, but that's beside the point. I've also been working on cars for over 20 years, I know my work and trust it.

The way automotive shops are run is the cause of the vast majority of the problems, but to the end consumer that doesn't matter. I've know three automotive techs that I trusted. Two work at a small shop about a half hour drive away and they do all of my alignments. The other took a job installing elevators years ago. I'm sure there are more, probably even close to me, but I can't afford to find them. Maybe I'm too picky, maybe I just live in a bad area, I don't know.

Sorry if you take offense to my view point, but it comes from my own experience. YMMV

Oh no, no offense was taken. I understand exactly what you were talking about. Being on that side of the fence I've seen some shady techs myself. Needless to say, they didn't last very long. But I do agree, it's the way the system is run that causes all the problems.

When I left the dealer, BMW redid their warranty system resulting in like a 20% paycut. On top of that the only thing managers/owners care about are numbers the techs are putting out. I even almost got fired once from a low customer service index that turned out had nothing to do with me. I was rated low for things like the customer lounge not having Wi-Fi. Another customer loved my work and how fast I got her back on the road. But she gave me a 0 because she didn't know how the survey worked.

Pretty much every one of my friends that are auto techs agree, the flat rate system needs to go. We would rather be paid hourly and get the job done right then rush through car after car hoping to make an hour or two. A lot of my friends at the dealer have quit as well and moved on to other fields.



Anyways, I plan on looking at the engine this weekend. I'm curious to see where the plugs and everything sit now.

[Black Tire]

I kept wondering in the procedure on the spark plugs when they would actually get to the "replace plugs" part. I hope they last a while!

Maybe it would be easier to remove the front tires, suspension, and fenders, then cut an access holes/panels in the inner fenders if needed, remove half of the exterior engine ancillaries and then change the spark plugs.

[Dustin@Dynosty]

We can confirm removal of number 1 (with just overpipe removed) and number 2 plug can be done with out anything else removed, the frame is wider at the front, the rear gets a little tighter so those are questionable, if I get time I will investigate further. The coils are very flexible at least with only 2,000 miles on them. It is a very tight squeeze, recommend small hands.

[finch1750]

flex head ratchet, extension, swivel adapter.

That and some time will be all you need. (Assuming its similar to an 05 sti)

[Pscylo]

Engine swap~ :happy0180:

[Rokkinpo]

as a Toyota tech and an owner of an frs I take some offence the the half ass work statement. I like to think I give what the customer pays for. In any event you can undo the motor mounts and jack up the motor enough to get to them. and half ass or as some people call it flat rating it is how we find short cuts so u don't have to rebuild the motor

[rice_classic]

Originally Posted by Rokkinpo

as a Toyota tech and an owner of an frs I take some offence the the half ass work statement. I like to think I give what the customer pays for. In any event you can undo the motor mounts and jack up the motor enough to get to them. and half ass or as some people call it flat rating it is how we find short cuts so u don't have to rebuild the motor

Flat Rate leads to some very good and productive time-saving procedures but I also feel that the negative stigma given to many mechanics (besides that of shady shops) is partly due to "shop rate" or "flat rate". This type of compensation structure inherently breeds quick-work as opposed to correct-work sometimes. I just wanted to point out that shop-rate is a double edged sword.

Like Calum I can say I'm more comfortable when I do my own work but let me be honest... when I'm doing my own work sometimes I take 4 hours to do a 45 minute job, just because.

[OrbitalEllipses]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

Like Calum I can say I'm more comfortable when I do my own work but let me be honest... when I'm doing my own work sometimes I take 4 hours to do a 45 minute job, just because.

That is why sometimes I pay a few greasy men to install things. They're cool guys and I don't mind paying them to do something that would have taken me way longer AND I'd have to buy more tools to do.

[AZP Installs]

Originally Posted by fistpoint

That's my point. I normally do simple stuff like this, but after reading there is no way in hell I'm going to be able to with lack of time or knowledge/tools.

Dealerships are infamous for leaving 2 foot(yes, TWO foot long) wrenches under the hood of my cars, leaving screws/bolts laying around that they forgot where to put back, forgetting to hook up the turbos, forgetting this and that and whatever.

That's why I buy Hondas, because they don't need maintenance beyond oil changes for the most part. The stuff I mentioned above was parents cars and minor wreck fixes for me(not my fault).

So, we're looking at a $200-$300 or more spark plug change. Thankfully it should only have to be done once, but having it done correctly is my major worry.

Find a good local independent Subaru shop and I bet you will not be paying the dealer's price of $400+.

For instance we change plugs on most subies right now for about $135, on the BRZ since the motor is sunk a bit deeper, we'll probably have to figure out how to do it a different way but in the end it will likely not be a crazy price to do it.

-Mike Paisan


11+ Years Maintaining, Modifying and Educating TriState Subaru Enthusiasts.
Call directly as We carry almost every manufacturer now, so before you buy parts call us.
Like us on Facebook! | E-mail: sales@azpinstalls.com | 725 Fairfield Ave | Kenilworth, NJ 07033 | 908.248.AZP1 (2971) | T-1 Certified Amsoil Direct Jobber |AIM: AZP Installs
"Race Tested, Enthusiast Approved!"

[gmookher]

Thats not half assed in any way, its a git her done way, and if you have finesse, and arent gonna be a tool about it, its the way to go.
Always good to know what you can do well, and what you cant, sometime sit pays to pay a tech. like the air conditioning under the dash on my land rover? I wouldnt touch it if you paid me to.

No offense meant at techs, there are plenty of good ones, and like with any a few rotten apples spoil the bunch. I have had to retorque bolts cause techs just whack it with a the gun and thats that. Thats fine for a passenger car maybe, but when its my foot to the floor and I'm passing you on the inside, it better hold together. Hopefully the tech training will emphasize the torques specs and need to be sure this car gets treated like a race car, as the customer is a demanding one

[AZP Installs]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

Flat Rate leads to some very good and productive time-saving procedures but I also feel that the negative stigma given to many mechanics (besides that of shady shops) is partly due to "shop rate" or "flat rate". This type of compensation structure inherently breeds quick-work as opposed to correct-work sometimes. I just wanted to point out that shop-rate is a double edged sword.

Like Calum I can say I'm more comfortable when I do my own work but let me be honest... when I'm doing my own work sometimes I take 4 hours to do a 45 minute job, just because.

Yup, this is why we have specialized in subies for years and we work off of hourly salary. I preach to my guys to do it correctly the first time, even if that means it takes more time (which costs me more $) but in the end it builds a better customer base.

-Mike Paisan


11+ Years Maintaining, Modifying and Educating TriState Subaru Enthusiasts.
Call directly as We carry almost every manufacturer now, so before you buy parts call us.
Like us on Facebook! | E-mail: sales@azpinstalls.com | 725 Fairfield Ave | Kenilworth, NJ 07033 | 908.248.AZP1 (2971) | T-1 Certified Amsoil Direct Jobber |AIM: AZP Installs
"Race Tested, Enthusiast Approved!"

[AZP Installs]

Originally Posted by gmookher

Thats fine for a passenger car maybe, but when its my foot to the floor and I'm passing you on the inside, it better hold together. Hopefully the tech training will emphasize the torques specs and need to be sure this car gets treated like a race car, as the customer is a demanding one

Unfortunately unless you bring it to a non-dealer who really specializes, no one is going to treat it like a race car. To a dealership it is just another econobox that pays the bills by coming into the service bay. Heck even Porsche Dealers rarely treat their cars like racecars and they are probably the most raced/tracked marquee out there.

-Mike Paisan


11+ Years Maintaining, Modifying and Educating TriState Subaru Enthusiasts.
Call directly as We carry almost every manufacturer now, so before you buy parts call us.
Like us on Facebook! | E-mail: sales@azpinstalls.com | 725 Fairfield Ave | Kenilworth, NJ 07033 | 908.248.AZP1 (2971) | T-1 Certified Amsoil Direct Jobber |AIM: AZP Installs
"Race Tested, Enthusiast Approved!"