07-07-2023, 11:13 AM | #1639 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2018
Drives: Crapcan
Location: Oregon
Posts: 11,167
Thanks: 18,159
Thanked 16,325 Times in 7,383 Posts
Mentioned: 107 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
Hybrids have their place, for someone like me or my dad who used to commute 100 miles a day, they are not a great solution since most of our driving is highway and freeway. At the time he was working he had an old CRX that he paid like 1500 bucks for that got around 45mpg, about the same as a Prius of the time. He went through 2 engines and 2 transmissions in that car. I'd imagine living in town in stop and go traffic they do a lot better.
__________________
"Experience is the hardest kind of teacher. It gives you the test first and the lesson afterward." -Oscar Wilde.
|
The Following User Says Thank You to NoHaveMSG For This Useful Post: | Dadhawk (07-07-2023) |
07-07-2023, 11:24 AM | #1640 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2019
Drives: what
Location: WA
Posts: 341
Thanks: 337
Thanked 278 Times in 161 Posts
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
Quote:
how is 45mpg not a great solution? especially considering that a CRX is incredibly unsafe in a crash compared to a modern vehicle |
|
07-07-2023, 12:04 PM | #1641 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2018
Drives: Crapcan
Location: Oregon
Posts: 11,167
Thanks: 18,159
Thanked 16,325 Times in 7,383 Posts
Mentioned: 107 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
Quote:
Point being, highway commuting I don't see the value of a hybrid. In town driving, absolutely better than pure ICE.
__________________
"Experience is the hardest kind of teacher. It gives you the test first and the lesson afterward." -Oscar Wilde.
|
|
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to NoHaveMSG For This Useful Post: |
07-07-2023, 12:30 PM | #1642 | |
1st86 Driver!
Join Date: Feb 2012
Drives: '13 FR-S (#3 of 1st 86)
Location: Powder Springs, GA
Posts: 19,814
Thanks: 38,823
Thanked 24,939 Times in 11,376 Posts
Mentioned: 182 Post(s)
Tagged: 4 Thread(s)
|
Quote:
What I would prefer is a PHEV with a 200 mile electric range, and a Volt style generator so that the vehicle is always (well 99% of the time) running off the electric engines even when burning fuel. (And, yes, I know the Volt has some situations where the gas engine assists with driving the wheels)
__________________
Visit my Owner's Journal where I wax philosophic on all things FR-S Post your 86 or see others in front of a(n) (in)famous landmark. What fits in your 86? Show us the "Junk In Your Trunk". Last edited by Dadhawk; 07-07-2023 at 01:31 PM. |
|
The Following User Says Thank You to Dadhawk For This Useful Post: | NoHaveMSG (07-07-2023) |
07-07-2023, 12:33 PM | #1643 | |
1st86 Driver!
Join Date: Feb 2012
Drives: '13 FR-S (#3 of 1st 86)
Location: Powder Springs, GA
Posts: 19,814
Thanks: 38,823
Thanked 24,939 Times in 11,376 Posts
Mentioned: 182 Post(s)
Tagged: 4 Thread(s)
|
Quote:
Ultimately not everyone can go out (or wants to go out) and buy a new car until they actually have to, or maybe never (choosing to always by used, and sometimes REALLY used cars).
__________________
Visit my Owner's Journal where I wax philosophic on all things FR-S Post your 86 or see others in front of a(n) (in)famous landmark. What fits in your 86? Show us the "Junk In Your Trunk". Last edited by Dadhawk; 07-07-2023 at 01:29 PM. |
|
The Following User Says Thank You to Dadhawk For This Useful Post: | NoHaveMSG (07-07-2023) |
07-07-2023, 01:00 PM | #1644 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2018
Drives: Crapcan
Location: Oregon
Posts: 11,167
Thanks: 18,159
Thanked 16,325 Times in 7,383 Posts
Mentioned: 107 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
Quote:
__________________
"Experience is the hardest kind of teacher. It gives you the test first and the lesson afterward." -Oscar Wilde.
|
|
The Following User Says Thank You to NoHaveMSG For This Useful Post: | Dadhawk (07-07-2023) |
07-07-2023, 03:34 PM | #1645 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2017
Drives: Q5 + BRZ + M796
Location: Santa Rosa, CA
Posts: 7,884
Thanks: 5,668
Thanked 5,805 Times in 3,299 Posts
Mentioned: 70 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
Quote:
https://www.ft86club.com/forums/show...postcount=1584 Most hybrids have a 10-30% improvement in fuel efficiency, but EVs have 3x the fuel efficiency, so it isn't really a comparison why we are moving to EVs. The argument by the article is that we could move more cars to battery vehicles if we use one EV battery for multiple hybrid batteries, and this is true if we had bottlenecks in battery material supply chains that pushed the cost of EVs up, but that is yet to be seen, and we have mandates for EVs from governments, so getting people into battery vehicles faster isn't an issue of battery supply. Hybrids have been around for a long time, and their popularity hasn't really grown. It wasn't until Tesla showed that EVs could be economical and have better performance that hybrids started to be built to appeal to people wanting a performance improvement and not just an economy improvement (contrast the CRZ hybrid for lackluster performance for a mild economy improvement to the Rave4 Prime, or compare the Prime PHEV to the hybrid). I've said this before, but I think there is a place for manufactures to make PHEVs for many people who need the range. Their batteries can be big enough to give them 50-70 miles of range, which is good enough for most people's daily needs, while still having the ICE backup. I still think the majority of people will just choose an EV because it will be less complicated, it will likely have better performance and driving characteristics with having more frunk/trunk space and cabin room than comparable PHEVs. Compare the price of a hybrid Rav4 and Prime and the EV bZ4X, and the Prime is more expensive than the EV and weighs only 30lbs less, yet the EV is AWD and the Prime is FWD. Again, the premise of the article is that: --We could get people into more fuel efficient vehicles faster. Well, yes, this is true. They could say all new vehicles would need to be at least PHEVs by a sooner date or increase the targets from only a fraction EVs to that same fraction plus the rest can only be PHEVs, so 100% plug-in, but they can mandate all electric too. I would like to see them push PHEVs, so we have 100% plug-in-capable, so no new ICEs are sold, but I don't know if this is too aggressive for the industry to adapt. Quote:
--Batteries will get more expensive to make because of material cost bottlenecks, so PHEVs will be cheaper. This is speculation, and we typically see the opposite where prices of production drop, as volume increases. We will likely see more lithium production come online like what Tesla is doing to make battery-grade lithium. Refining is the bottleneck, not lithium mining/supply. --We need PHEVs until we can build out the grid and infrastructure. The growth of EVs is still small. Even if we were mandating all new vehicles be EVs, we are growing only 6% per year, and maybe less if some EV owners are replacing cars with EVs. Every home has a charger in one form or another, and we can add more superchargers to the grid faster than we will need them, so it is mostly about building green energy infrastructure, but this is only going to happen when there is demand, so utilities aren't sitting around doing nothing. I don't see this as an issue. Wind and solar are the cheapest and fastest forms of energy to build, and we can build all types of non-lithium-ion-based storage systems. I don't know that we need PHEVs because of the grid, especially if 90% of their propulsion is suppose to come from the grid. The best case for PHEVs is high mileage users and trucks, in which case, I'm onboard using them over larger batteries.
__________________
My Build | K24 Turbo Swap | *K24T BRZ SOLD*
|
||
The Following User Says Thank You to Irace86.2.0 For This Useful Post: | NoHaveMSG (07-07-2023) |
07-07-2023, 03:42 PM | #1646 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2018
Drives: Crapcan
Location: Oregon
Posts: 11,167
Thanks: 18,159
Thanked 16,325 Times in 7,383 Posts
Mentioned: 107 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
I have a lot of interest in a hybrid truck but with everything going on I am holding out to see what the future holds with BEV trucks. I'd like to make some kind of decision in the next couple years.
__________________
"Experience is the hardest kind of teacher. It gives you the test first and the lesson afterward." -Oscar Wilde.
|
07-14-2023, 02:05 PM | #1647 | ||||
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2017
Drives: Q5 + BRZ + M796
Location: Santa Rosa, CA
Posts: 7,884
Thanks: 5,668
Thanked 5,805 Times in 3,299 Posts
Mentioned: 70 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
So Texas is making so much power from wind and solar at peak generation and during peak use that the grid can't disperse the power fast enough. They will either need to upgrade their grid, or they will need to work on local (to the energy generation sites) storage solutions, so they don't waste energy.
One form of local storage is battery storage in BEVs by charging them during peak times. There are other storage solutions like the Rondo battery, to name one of many solutions. This article highlights two problems: the need for comprehensive improvements to electric grids, and growth/supply of energy infrastructure can outpace demand. Many people continue to suggest that there is no way we can grow the grid fast enough to accommodate BEVs, but this highlights the fact that growth can outpace demand, and that BEVs could be a part of the solution through local energy storage. ***The quotes from the article assume no investment in the grid, but continued investment in energy production.*** Texas solar and wind are setting records, and the state’s grid can’t handle it https://electrek.co/2023/07/13/texas-solar-wind-grid/ Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
__________________
My Build | K24 Turbo Swap | *K24T BRZ SOLD*
|
||||
07-17-2023, 10:00 AM | #1648 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2011
Drives: '12 C63 P31, '23 GRC
Location: NC
Posts: 3,200
Thanks: 2,935
Thanked 2,072 Times in 1,185 Posts
Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
Can't use liquid salts? I don't follow it much but I thought that's what solar plants did for storage. Hell, could also do water pumping....though on that scale...nevermind, lol
__________________
Current: 2023 GRC Circuit Edition, 2012 C63 AMG P31
Past: (2) 2000 MR2 Spyder, 2017 GTI Sport, 2006 Porsche Cayman S, Supercharged 2013 BRZ-L, 2007 Honda S2000, 1992 Integra GS-R |
07-27-2023, 11:12 PM | #1649 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2017
Drives: Q5 + BRZ + M796
Location: Santa Rosa, CA
Posts: 7,884
Thanks: 5,668
Thanked 5,805 Times in 3,299 Posts
Mentioned: 70 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
Seems like axial flux motors like the Koenigsegg below and Mercedes below might be a big hit with enthusiasts in sports cars. About a third the weight of a radial motor, but might require shifting a few gears, which could be ideal for some car enthusiasts.
https://www.ft86club.com/forums/show...5&postcount=10 https://www.thedrive.com/news/why-ax...g-deal-for-evs
__________________
My Build | K24 Turbo Swap | *K24T BRZ SOLD*
|
The Following User Says Thank You to Irace86.2.0 For This Useful Post: | bcj (07-28-2023) |
07-28-2023, 06:05 AM | #1650 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2018
Drives: 2013 frs red
Location: South Florida
Posts: 3,517
Thanks: 2,520
Thanked 3,088 Times in 1,654 Posts
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
|
|
07-28-2023, 07:45 AM | #1651 | |
1st86 Driver!
Join Date: Feb 2012
Drives: '13 FR-S (#3 of 1st 86)
Location: Powder Springs, GA
Posts: 19,814
Thanks: 38,823
Thanked 24,939 Times in 11,376 Posts
Mentioned: 182 Post(s)
Tagged: 4 Thread(s)
|
Quote:
The acceptance of the NACS (the Tesla plug) by the major OEMs helps, as well as the recent announcement of the coalition to create a charging network for both standards. If this all comes to fruition I think it will be a different environment in two to three years.
__________________
Visit my Owner's Journal where I wax philosophic on all things FR-S Post your 86 or see others in front of a(n) (in)famous landmark. What fits in your 86? Show us the "Junk In Your Trunk". |
|
The Following User Says Thank You to Dadhawk For This Useful Post: | soundman98 (07-28-2023) |
07-28-2023, 10:00 AM | #1652 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2011
Drives: '12 C63 P31, '23 GRC
Location: NC
Posts: 3,200
Thanks: 2,935
Thanked 2,072 Times in 1,185 Posts
Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
|
I knew that all EVs fell short of their published range, but this seems a little dishonest:
https://www.reuters.com/investigates...tteries-range/
__________________
Current: 2023 GRC Circuit Edition, 2012 C63 AMG P31
Past: (2) 2000 MR2 Spyder, 2017 GTI Sport, 2006 Porsche Cayman S, Supercharged 2013 BRZ-L, 2007 Honda S2000, 1992 Integra GS-R |
|
|
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Tcoat banned? | Hotrodheart | Off-Topic Lounge [WARNING: NO POLITICS] | 95 | 07-06-2019 01:46 AM |
Does anyone know why pansontw got banned? | Soloside | Off-Topic Lounge [WARNING: NO POLITICS] | 17 | 10-26-2018 04:20 AM |
Got banned from gf's complex | jdmblood | Other Vehicles & General Automotive Discussions | 11 | 07-12-2015 12:46 PM |
Why have so many users been banned? | xuimod | Site Announcements / Questions / Issues | 9 | 03-08-2015 02:23 PM |
Banned Toyota GT 86 Advert Banned | Nevermore | FR-S & 86 Photos, Videos, Wallpapers, Gallery Forum | 9 | 11-16-2012 07:27 PM |