HKS EL vs ACE 350 Dyno Comparison

[Lightened]

Is this ACE 350 vs. Tomei EL?

Ace on top?

Link to thread please...

[PulsarBeeerz]

Originally Posted by Lightened

Is this ACE 350 vs. Tomei EL?

Ace on top?

Link to thread please...

Tomei UEL on the top, ACE 350 on bottom and E85 on both. No thread just research. I will say the Tomei has an aftermarket catback while the ACE does not.

[Lightened]

Originally Posted by PulsarBeeerz

Tomei UEL on the top, ACE 350 on bottom and E85 on both. No thread just research. I will say the Tomei has an aftermarket catback while the ACE does not.

Thanks

So... the ACE 350 had a stock exhaust and stock front pipe with secondary cat?

The stock exhaust is not exactly ideal when tuning for max power with a high performance header...

[PulsarBeeerz]

Originally Posted by Lightened

Thanks

So... the ACE 350 had a stock exhaust and stock front pipe with secondary cat?

The stock exhaust is not exactly ideal when tuning for max power with a high performance header...

Yes and shops have gotten 200whp out of a stock exhaust car in the past on E85. A catback has never made a big difference on this engine.


2015 shop car on E85 and I assume a catback. OEM MY15 header and black IM @201whp vs OEM MY17 header and RedIM @207whp. Again E85 looks to be the equalizer. All one can do is manipulate the Tq delivery but not so much the peak hp.

[wparsons]

Originally Posted by Mike_ZN6

The top line is actually the HKS EL, not the ACE. Needless to say, this is not what anyone would have expected. There is some discussion that the tuner does not know how to tune for the ACE, but the tuner is claiming they have spent several hours on this and can not add any more timing.

What does everyone think? Is the HKS EL the new king? Is there some secret the tuner doesn't know that is necessary to unlock the ACE 350's full potential?

The ACE needs more than just timing thrown at it, it needs some pretty drastic other changes to make optimal power.

[SydBRZ]

I find it pretty strange that apart from a few variances, the ACE and HKS torque and power curves more or less just follow the same contour in this graph. If the tuning was optimal, you'd at least expect to see the ACE filling out the torque curve around the dip in contrast to the HKS.

Seeing the HKS making more power at high RPM doesn't seem that unreasonable, but ACE torque curves usually always look more convex than this. We know ACE needs a well tuned AVCS table to work properly.

OP over in the Naturally Aspirated group actually said words to the effect of 'if it needs this much work to perform better, it's not really superior' and more or less dismissed the idea of comparing his AVCS tables with open source ROMS already out there for ACE. Something seems off.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by SydBRZ

I find it pretty strange that apart from a few variances, the ACE and HKS torque and power curves more or less just follow the same contour in this graph. If the tuning was optimal, you'd at least expect to see the ACE filling out the torque curve around the dip in contrast to the HKS.

Seeing the HKS making more power at high RPM doesn't seem that unreasonable, but ACE torque curves usually always look more convex than this. We know ACE needs a well tuned AVCS table to work properly.

OP over in the Naturally Aspirated group actually said words to the effect of 'if it needs this much work to perform better, it's not really superior' and more or less dismissed the idea of comparing his AVCS tables with open source ROMS already out there for ACE. Something seems off.

Bingo.

[Dzmitry]

Idk guys... looks like after all these years of research, header designs, and tuning, someone finally got it right! Beat the best by a whopping mile, and it only took a few hours!!

[Irace86.2.0]

Isn’t the HKS EL header just the stock header with a test pipe for the cat?

[wparsons]

Originally Posted by Dzmitry

Idk guys... looks like after all these years of research, header designs, and tuning, someone finally got it right! Beat the best by a whopping mile, and it only took a few hours!!

You know that the HKS EL isn't a new design, and has been out for a long time, right?

[gpvecchi]

As new manifold have 45 mm primaries, what can we espect if we put 42.7 mm primaries like the one in ACE?
AFAIK there are just a couple of aftermarket headers with 45 mm primaries, Fujitsubo and Toda...

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by wparsons

You know that the HKS EL isn't a new design, and has been out for a long time, right?

It wasn’t even knew/original when it came out.

[PulsarBeeerz]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

It wasn’t even knew/original when it came out.

Lots of fancier designs out there but as ugly an unoriginal as it may be the HKS header has always worked well.

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by PulsarBeeerz

Lots of fancier designs out there but as ugly an unoriginal as it may be the HKS header has always worked well.

I would just weld in a test pipe. Probably cheaper since the design is almost the same as stock.