Dai Yoshihara's 2014 Falken Tire/Discount Tire Subaru BRZ FD Reveal

[Superhatch]

Originally Posted by Fett4Real

Not to most people...swaps in cars have been happening since theres been cars. You get a 4cyl mustang put a V8 in it is that OK? Of course. You get a light car put a big motor in it. Thats a common thing.

A mustang engine in a mustang isn't changing the nature of the car...it's just an upgrade. A B16/18 swap into a Civic chassis isn't that different since the car came in that configuration in other countries (talking about EK/EG), but put a Jseries into an EF and I just don't understand it.

I get it, lightweight, big engine, beat chest. It's just not my cup of tea. Also, I disagree that to most people the powerplant isn't the defining characteristic of a car. If not that, what?

[unlimited86]

Not fond of any of this LS engine and big motors in formula D. I remember going to D1gp and amazed add the varieties of motor they had and the unique sound that each gave off.. Now you go to formula 80% are like using LS motors.

[Luckrider]

Originally Posted by Superhatch

A mustang engine in a mustang isn't changing the nature of the car...it's just an upgrade. A B16/18 swap into a Civic chassis isn't that different since the car came in that configuration in other countries (talking about EK/EG), but put a Jseries into an EF and I just don't understand it.

I get it, lightweight, big engine, beat chest. It's just not my cup of tea. Also, I disagree that to most people the powerplant isn't the defining characteristic of a car. If not that, what?

Balance, wheelbase, poise, basic handling characteristics. These things are inherent to a platform and can only be enhanced and tweaked. About the only way to change that is to ditch the whole suspension, and then you are changing the car and its nature. I am talking something like taking a double wishbone rear and swapping in a built solid axle with a spool and triangulated long arm suspension so that it becomes a dragster.

The thing about power is, no matter which way you upgrade it, as long as you aren't changing the engine in a car that never rev past 5k and made 350ft/lbs of torque to a motor that spins 2x as fast to make a measly 400hp, then the change in power will never change so drastically that some upgraded version of a factory-like option would be insanely different. With handling, you can't take a light fwd car and make it handle like a heavy rwd car or a rw-biased AWD car just like you can't make a heavy sedan like a charger walk corners like a a CRX. The thing about the above axle example, whether you have a a V8 pushing 750HP or a turbo 4 pushing that power, as long as you are launching in the powerband and staying there, they won't launch drastically different. If you change the suspension as described, no matter which motor you have, it will drag, drift, and corner totally differently.

[Luckrider]

Originally Posted by unlimited86

Not fond of any of this LS engine and big motors in formula D. I remember going to D1gp and amazed add the varieties of motor they had and the unique sound that each gave off.. Now you go to formula 80% are like using LS motors.

This is why I would love to see brand matching engines. Take a look at the offerings of each manufacturer (and subsidiary companies) and limit engine choice to that. Let them be unlimited and built as desired since power isn't everything in drift and you will get some awesome and unique combinations.

[2014BRZ_kcrow]

I completely agree that swapping a ford motor for a bigger ford motor is one thing...putting a Corvette motor in a BRZ is a complete other. It isn't a BRZ/FR-S anymore. But I do find it pretty cool to see these wild swaps, and it's awesome that the body/chassis of the BRZ is able to support these small block V8s! When I was involved in the Honda scene we never had people putting Corvette motors in Civic's. There have been a few swaps like this where they converted the Honda to rear wheel drive, but you couldn't do the kind of swaps in a Honda that you can in the BRZ/FR-S platform. I personally would never do this, I would only build up the FA20's engine and drivetrain. don't see what the real point is in putting a V8 in a BRZ, your just adding weight to the car. The guys at Full Blown Motorsports are putting out products that are capable of making the FA20 engine put out 1000hp and they've got drivetrain components to support it. They aren't the only company doing this....so why put any other engine in the car when the possibilities are limitless with the current setup. That's my personal preference, and to each his own! As someone stated before, since cars have been cars, people have been swapping motors...It's all part of the hobby.

[Fett4Real]

Think its called....Torque? And selling a product attention is gotten from insane swaps always has...people will do it for simpily the attention it got yours good or bad...its not all go its a show car too if you think about it. Putting a turbo on the NA FA20 to some people is rediculous....like turboing a TypeR was once considered ubsurd.

[switchlanez]

In this sport - and correct me if I'm wrong - a swap like this is critical to compete against the likes of V8-powered drift cars. 4-cylinder turbos demand more from the driver mentally as they must multitask keeping in the power band while controlling drifts. V8 guys have predictable power/torque readily available so they can focus their attention on drift technique.

The 4-cylinder motor is at home when traction needs to step in to settle a car after powering out of corners such as in a track setting. The BRZ/86 original character and engine allow for easy sliding into predictable traction. But traction isn't needed in drifting. At last year's Formula D finale, I noticed the V8s (domestic and swapped imports) maintained a more constant plume of smoke from start to end of course while 4-bangers couldn't. Generally, 4-cylinders struggled to compete unless a genius was behind the wheel ("genius" is a slight exaggeration). More smoke counts for more points. This V8 swap removes the handicap of a 4-cylinder. It levels the playing field so it becomes more about driver+chassis+tuning vs. driver+chassis+tuning. This swap frees the driver fighting against impending traction to sustain more of the chassis' slide-able character needed for this type of competition.

[Slonie]

Watch PRIVATEER if you want some insight into what it takes to compete in modern Formula D, powerplant-wise. Well worth your time and this specific issue is discussed at length (besides just being a fantastic profile of Taka and the history of competitive drifting in the US, to boot).

[ame="http://vimeo.com/90591811"]PRIVATEER: Taka Aono + The Flying 86 [Documentary] on Vimeo[/ame]

One hour long. Watch it and learn!

[SuperDave]

that documentary makes me want to buy my friend's rebuilt AE86 and drive it at autocross...

it sucks that what Taka said is true, the obstacle for new drivers to get into the scene is very high because they don't have the monetary resources to compete or get started, so we'll see if this is truly sustainable for the future.

I'm also sad that the drag racing roots/culture of the US has transformed the sport into an torque/money game, and less so about the elegance and balance of driver and car, but it's what sells tickets.

I'm personally excited to see what Dai Yoshihara can do in his car, but I do agree with the of the point that an engine swap causes a loss of the characteristics of a car.

BUT HONESTLY SCREW ALL OF THIS, WHEN ARE WE GONNA START RACING EACH OTHER DOWN MOUNTAINS LIKE IN INITIAL D?!!!!?

[Gunman]

Engine swaps have been part of hot rodding since the dawn of hot rodding.

[Kids Heart]

No horseshoe leds, No gummy smile, No flat 4, No BRZ.

[Kids Heart]

Originally Posted by Luckrider

I have similar feelings, but it is impressive to see. Note that these things are occuring becasue the shell that Subaru has made is as technically impressive (if not more so) than any motor swap.

I think it would be cool to see rules that only allow swaps for blocks from the same manufacturer: IE: Vipers can only have a mopar motor (8.4L v10, 6.4L V8 SRT, 6.4L Ram V8 ect), FR-S can only have the FA-20, 2JZ ect, the BRZ can have the FA20, EJ25 ect. I really want to see a 11+:1 CR e85 Turbo BRZ for formula D revving out to 9000rpm. You would only need 3rd gear and would have all of the torque you need.

The Formula Drift Manufacturers Championship rules state the motor must come from that manufacturer. This car even though it is sponsored by Subaru, does not qualify, while Ryan Tuerck and Ken Gushi's 2JZ FR-S's do.

[raul]

Is it me or every 86 Formula D driver embracing their inner ricer with the choice of tail lights?

[Luckrider]

Originally Posted by Kids Heart

The Formula Drift Manufacturers Championship rules state the motor must come from that manufacturer. This car even though it is sponsored by Subaru, does not qualify, while Ryan Tuerck and Ken Gushi's 2JZ FR-S's do.

If you had to chose a Subaru motor for Formula Drift what would you go with?