2019 Toyota Corolla Hatchback & Sedan

[Kaotic Lazagna]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

It's built on the tnga platform and passes safety everywhere else in the world. It's pure economics why Toyota stopped selling Yaris in the USA, and Honda stopped selling the Fit. Americans don't buy small cars. They both have a longer wheelbase then a Supra, it's not like they're kei cars.


I'll survive playing with other fun cars, a hopped up Corolla just isn't high on my purchase list as much as I like the tnga platform.

You have things like airbag requirements and the like that adds weight. And this also circles back to when I said that the US is not a car market, which is why I think a GR Corolla won't be "cheap" as everyone is hoping it will be.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by Kaotic Lazagna

You have things like airbag requirements and the like that adds weight. And this also circles back to when I said that the US is not a car market, which is why I think a GR Corolla won't be "cheap" as everyone is hoping it will be.

Are you implying that the gr Yaris doesn't have airbags? It most definitely does and all the other safety equipment required to sell it in countries like the UK, EU, Japan, Australia, etc. and weighs 2,700# to do it with the AWD.

Outgoing fit weighed 2,500#, Miata currently weighs 2,300, 4c 2,500#, let alone the dozen econoboxes that are in that Weight range today.

Regulations aren't why we don't get light cars, it's lack of demand, on which we agree.

The gr Corolla will be as cheap as Toyota wants to make it. They'll build what, 10,000 for the us market? They don't need to make 10% on each unit to survive, they're Toyota. Pre-pandemic you could pick up a fully loaded xse Corolla hatch for <$20k

As a Corolla it's a GTI/wrx/Veloster competitor, if they price it like a golf R/sti/type R they'll have shot themselves in the foot.

[Jeonsa]

Originally Posted by Kaotic Lazagna

You have things like airbag requirements and the like that adds weight. And this also circles back to when I said that the US is not a car market, which is why I think a GR Corolla won't be "cheap" as everyone is hoping it will be.

I still think it’s funny how people want it to sit at 30k. If this car is built in Motomachi alongside the GR Yaris (with long wait times built by Toyota Takumi) and they advertise it as a “pure Toyota sports car” they could easily charge a premium. Lol.

Reveal should be coming soon with these teasers coming out, time will tell.

[Kaotic Lazagna]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

Are you implying that the gr Yaris doesn't have airbags? It most definitely does and all the other safety equipment required to sell it in countries like the UK, EU, Japan, Australia, etc. and weighs 2,700# to do it with the AWD.

Outgoing fit weighed 2,500#, Miata currently weighs 2,300, 4c 2,500#, let alone the dozen econoboxes that are in that Weight range today.

Regulations aren't why we don't get light cars, it's lack of demand, on which we agree.

The gr Corolla will be as cheap as Toyota wants to make it. They'll build what, 10,000 for the us market? They don't need to make 10% on each unit to survive, they're Toyota. Pre-pandemic you could pick up a fully loaded xse Corolla hatch for <$20k

As a Corolla it's a GTI/wrx/Veloster competitor, if they price it like a golf R/sti/type R they'll have shot themselves in the foot.

Doesn't the US require more airbags and other additional safety items than other countries?

The Miata is a really small 2-seater car. Not exactly fair to compare the weight of that to a vehicle that is AWD and larger. Also using the weight of a Yaris and comparing it to a Corolla isn't exactly fair either. They're both economical cars, but the Yaris is/was a straight up bareboned vehicle. Minimal NVH reducing items, even when compared to a car like the Corolla. Everything in it was cheaper and lighter materials as well.

The CF hood that they used on the GR Yaris saves a lot of weight, but as mentioned, drives up the cost. But yeah, I'll agree with you on the lack of demand for more track focused cars.

[Kaotic Lazagna]

Originally Posted by Jeonsa

I still think it’s funny how people want it to sit at 30k. If this car is built in Motomachi alongside the GR Yaris (with long wait times built by Toyota Takumi) and they advertise it as a “pure Toyota sports car” they could easily charge a premium. Lol.

Reveal should be coming soon with these teasers coming out, time will tell.

I would love if it actually is 30k, but it'll more realistically sit closer to 40k unfortunately.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by Kaotic Lazagna

Doesn't the US require more airbags and other additional safety items than other countries?
.

Depends on the country. Mexico? Sure. France? Nope. That's why most cars sold in volume are built to meet all standards like the 86.

[Jeonsa]

Originally Posted by Kaotic Lazagna

I would love if it actually is 30k, but it'll more realistically sit closer to 40k unfortunately.

I think it’s going to hit 40k as well. Like I said before though I wouldn’t be mad if it was less

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by Jeonsa

I still think it’s funny how people want it to sit at 30k. If this car is built in Motomachi alongside the GR Yaris (with long wait times built by Toyota Takumi) and they advertise it as a “pure Toyota sports car” they could easily charge a premium. Lol.

If Toyota markets this as a sports car, that would explain why Toyota had to partner with someone else to actually build a sports car.

[mazeroni]

Originally Posted by Kaotic Lazagna

I would love if it actually is 30k, but it'll more realistically sit closer to 40k unfortunately.

I think so too.

You have the WRX ($30K) on one end, and the Golf R ($45K) on the other.

In terms of quality, the Corolla is closer to the Impreza, but I suspect the AWD hardware will probably be closer to the Golf R - meaning up to 70% or more power to the active rear clutch at the rear.

Even the Focus RS, with its eco-box platform that was meant to be "attainable" was priced around $37K to start, but went over $40K with options. The unique engine and diffs added a lot to the cost. Plus it was built in Germany.

Of course, they can throw a curve ball and just use a standard RAV4 based AWD system with open diffs and call it "rally inspired." In that situation, I think $30k would be realistic.

[Jeonsa]

Originally Posted by mazeroni

I think so too.

You have the WRX ($30K) on one end, and the Golf R ($45K) on the other.

In terms of quality, the Corolla is closer to the Impreza, but I suspect the AWD hardware will probably be closer to the Golf R - meaning up to 70% or more power to the active rear clutch at the rear.

Even the Focus RS, with its eco-box platform that was meant to be "attainable" was priced around $37K to start, but went over $40K with options. The unique engine and diffs added a lot to the cost. Plus it was built in Germany.

Of course, they can throw a curve ball and just use a standard RAV4 based AWD system with open diffs and call it "rally inspired." In that situation, I think $30k would be realistic.

WRX STi actually sits on the high end too. Lol

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by mazeroni

I think so too.

You have the WRX ($30K) on one end, and the Golf R ($45K) on the other.

In terms of quality, the Corolla is closer to the Impreza, but I suspect the AWD hardware will probably be closer to the Golf R - meaning up to 70% or more power to the active rear clutch at the rear.

Even the Focus RS, with its eco-box platform that was meant to be "attainable" was priced around $37K to start, but went over $40K with options. The unique engine and diffs added a lot to the cost. Plus it was built in Germany.

Of course, they can throw a curve ball and just use a standard RAV4 based AWD system with open diffs and call it "rally inspired." In that situation, I think $30k would be realistic.

I agreed that the car will be $35-40k. The top trim Corolla is already $28k+. Prices could climb further like they did for the Supra and Focus RS once the dealers mark them up.

On the special engine in the Focus RS, it isn’t all too different than the 2.0L or other 2.3L variants. The same with the CTR 2.0T and the Accord’s 2.0T; they are different, but too similar to make much cost difference. That is evident by the fact that the CTR crate motor is fairly reasonably priced.

https://fordauthority.com/fmc/ford-m...st-engine/amp/

A lot of the pricing depends on different markets and what the bean counters determine is a fair price proportional to the performance and competition. This is more evident when we consider the price similarity of vastly different cars of a similar performance, irrespective of the features. For instance, the Mustang Ecoboost, 86, Miata, Civic SI and others all compete in a similar performance class and price bracket, yet some have 2WD, some have AWD, some have turbocharger systems, some have both, some are compacts, some are mid-sized, some are 1.5L and some are 2.3L, some are 2200 pounds and some are 3600 pounds…Again, lots goes into the price, but cost of materials in and of itself is clearly not as large a factor as we think it is. Adding more components to the Corolla to make a GR Corolla doesn’t necessarily need to increase the price a whole lot, but it will because they can do it.

[Jeonsa]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

I agreed that the car will be $35-40k. The top trim Corolla is already $28k+. Prices could climb further like they did for the Supra and Focus RS once the dealers mark them up.

On the special engine in the Focus RS, it isn’t all too different than the 2.0L or other 2.3L variants. The same with the CTR 2.0T and the Accord’s 2.0T; they are different, but too similar to make much cost difference. That is evident by the fact that the CTR crate motor is fairly reasonably priced.

https://fordauthority.com/fmc/ford-m...st-engine/amp/

A lot of the pricing depends on different markets and what the bean counters determine is a fair price proportional to the performance and competition. This is more evident when we consider the price similarity of vastly different cars of a similar performance, irrespective of the features. For instance, the Mustang Ecoboost, 86, Miata, Civic SI and others all compete in a similar performance class and price bracket, yet some have 2WD, some have AWD, some have turbocharger systems, some have both, some are compacts, some are mid-sized, some are 1.5L and some are 2.3L, some are 2200 pounds and some are 3600 pounds…Again, lots goes into the price, but cost of materials in and of itself is clearly not as large a factor as we think it is. Adding more components to the Corolla to make a GR Corolla doesn’t necessarily need to increase the price a whole lot, but it will because they can do it.

I’m just wondering how Toyota is going to market this thing to the general public. Most people who are realistic know what the price ballpark is but it’s going to be interesting to see how it’s advertised. They’ll obviously lean heavy on the “Pure Toyota Sports Product” angle and rally DNA from the GR Yaris, but the only Corolla in history anyone knows well (and they barely even understand the car) is the AE86. Lmao. For the most part, the average consumer is going to look at it and be like “why is this Corolla 37k”

[Kaotic Lazagna]

Originally Posted by Jeonsa

I’m just wondering how Toyota is going to market this thing to the general public. Most people who are realistic know what the price ballpark is but it’s going to be interesting to see how it’s advertised. They’ll obviously lean heavy on the “Pure Toyota Sports Product” angle and rally DNA from the GR Yaris, but the only Corolla in history anyone knows well (and they barely even understand the car) is the AE86. Lmao. For the most part, the average consumer is going to look at it and be like “why is this Corolla 37k”

I'm sure a fair amount of people know about the Corolla WRC from back in the day.



Though, probably no where near the amount of people who know what the AE86 is. Then again, the GR Corolla won't really be for the average consumer. Toyota, of course, will try to come up with a marketing strategy that will try to be as inclusive as possible to sell as much as possible, but will more likely lean towards the enthusiasts' side.

[Jeonsa]

Originally Posted by Kaotic Lazagna

I'm sure a fair amount of people know about the Corolla WRC from back in the day.



Though, probably no where near the amount of people who know what the AE86 is. Then again, the GR Corolla won't really be for the average consumer. Toyota, of course, will try to come up with a marketing strategy that will try to be as inclusive as possible to sell as much as possible, but will more likely lean towards the enthusiasts' side.

Only issue is enthusiasts for the most part barely know the Corolla’s history as well. It has a very underrated history.

It’s exciting though that Toyota will finally have a full lineup of fun cars since the MR2, Celica and Supra.