Harrop TVS86 Owners Thread

[RedReplicant]

Just throwing in a dyno. This is the 85mm pulley on E60 with a super soft tune (by choice). Ace A350, Ace front pipe, and CSG Touring catback.

[botbs]

Originally Posted by ajc209

Nope. I have a mate with this kit. IATs are solid at around +25C over ambient all day.

He running harrop stock pulley. Stock exhaust, stock suspension but running on 225 MPSS tyres and sti Brembo brakes. Also has 4.67 final drive. He was going quickly pushing the kit hard.

Sorry, who has 4.67 final drive + SC?

I found an used one 4.67FD with ATS 1.5Way but I am not sure if I should put it on. Afraid is FD is too high and cannot make good use of the power.

I have a cosworth SC as well.

Thanks!

[mabviper]

I have a Harrop 85mm with a 4.67 FD. It depends on what you're going to do with it. On the street, it's fine. On autox, it's pretty fun. On the race track, it really depends on the track. It can make it too short or make it just right. You'd have to experiment. It makes it feel~ faster since you're going through gears quicker but it may not actually be faster.

[botbs]

Originally Posted by mabviper

I have a Harrop 85mm with a 4.67 FD. It depends on what you're going to do with it. On the street, it's fine. On autox, it's pretty fun. On the race track, it really depends on the track. It can make it too short or make it just right. You'd have to experiment. It makes it feel~ faster since you're going through gears quicker but it may not actually be faster.

Great! I am getting it then =)

This car is all about driving feel, Thanks for your input!

Toyota Camry always passed me on HWY (I thought I was driving fast but it is not )

Did you retune your ECU to match the 4.67FD or you can just plug and play the FD without retune the ECU?

Thanks again!

[mabviper]

You kinda need to retune. Your tuner needs to modify the gear ratio tables. They may charge for it even though there's no engine tuning involved. I know my tuner didn't want to give me 2 tunes, one for 4.3 and another for 4.67. If you don't correct it, you gear indicator in the dash will read wrong.

[botbs]

Originally Posted by mabviper

You kinda need to retune. Your tuner needs to modify the gear ratio tables. They may charge for it even though there's no engine tuning involved. I know my tuner didn't want to give me 2 tunes, one for 4.3 and another for 4.67. If you don't correct it, you gear indicator in the dash will read wrong.

If it is only the gear indicator is wrong, I am not too concerned because I turn the indicator off normally.

But if there is other things that screw up on the tune, then I might have to think about it again.

Thanks!

[RedReplicant]

I was hoping to get down to about 300whp, but clearly I was overly optimistic.

Same dyno, same fuel, 90mm pulley, and a small tune tweak from CSG.



Not sure what to do at this point short of paying CSG to do a flat tune, I need to be making about 300 peak and I want to keep the ethanol for safety on track.

[cjd]

Originally Posted by RedReplicant

I was hoping to get down to about 300whp, but clearly I was overly optimistic.

Same dyno, same fuel, 90mm pulley, and a small tune tweak from CSG.

Not sure what to do at this point short of paying CSG to do a flat tune, I need to be making about 300 peak and I want to keep the ethanol for safety on track.

smaller front-pipe?

[PulsarBeeerz]

Originally Posted by cjd

smaller front-pipe?

Adding exhaust restriction as a means to reduce power is generally a bad idea.

[cjd]

Originally Posted by PulsarBeeerz

Adding exhaust restriction as a means to reduce power is generally a bad idea.

Sure, but sometimes rules make for such things. Not sure that's the case here...

[Tatsu333]

Originally Posted by RedReplicant

I was hoping to get down to about 300whp, but clearly I was overly optimistic.

Same dyno, same fuel, 90mm pulley, and a small tune tweak from CSG.

Not sure what to do at this point short of paying CSG to do a flat tune, I need to be making about 300 peak and I want to keep the ethanol for safety on track.

I presume the tune tweak from CSG was tweaking the ignition timing or richening up the AFR a bit. The problem with trying to de-tune it may be getting to a point where the loss of fuel efficiency and/or other reliability issues from running too rich (E.G. fouling plugs, cylinder wall washing from excess fuel causing ring wear / poor sealing, etc.) outweigh the specific power goal.

I also don't think adding exhaust restriction is a great way to go because of the added strain on components upstream from that restriction with boost. If anything, maybe a restrictor plate on the intake side (at the throttle body or somewhere along that path) might be a better way to go.

That's what they used to do on the WRC cars (and possibly still do?) and in many various touring car series to limit peak power to a specific output while still getting the most low-mid range power.

Other than that, maybe a 95-ish mm diameter larger pulley for slightly less boost? Not sure if that would have to be a custom job or not, as I have no idea what other pulleys are available from Harrop. That would then allow the tune to be "maxed out" and efficient, but keep power levels within your desired range. EDIT: just saw that dropping from 85 to 90mm only gave you a 5 whp drop, so probably an even larger pulley than 95mm would be needed...100 or 105mm? You'd then be dropping way out of the efficiency range of the blower, probably. Could be that an intake restrictor plate may be the better way to go.

[RedReplicant]

Originally Posted by Tatsu333

I presume the tune tweak from CSG was tweaking the ignition timing or richening up the AFR a bit. The problem with trying to de-tune it may be getting to a point where the loss of fuel efficiency and/or other reliability issues from running too rich (E.G. fouling plugs, cylinder wall washing from excess fuel causing ring wear / poor sealing, etc.) outweigh the specific power goal.

I also don't think adding exhaust restriction is a great way to go because of the added strain on components upstream from that restriction with boost. If anything, maybe a restrictor plate on the intake side (at the throttle body or somewhere along that path) might be a better way to go.

That's what they used to do on the WRC cars (and possibly still do?) and in many various touring car series to limit peak power output while still getting the most low-mid range power.

Other than that, maybe a 95-ish mm diameter larger pulley for slightly less boost? Not sure if that would have to be a custom job or not, as I have no idea what other pulleys are available from Harrop. That would then allow the tune to be "maxed out" and efficient, but keep power levels within your desired range.

Yeah, I talked to CSG yesterday. I'm going to rent the dyno and CSG will play with timing / cam timing to tame the top end. Harrop does offer a 95mm pulley, however the ideal thing would be to run the smallest pulley possible and neuter the top end for the most area under the curve.

I'll be playing it safe and staying with the 90mm for now.

[Tatsu333]

Originally Posted by RedReplicant

Yeah, I talked to CSG yesterday. I'm going to rent the dyno and CSG will play with timing / cam timing to tame the top end. Harrop does offer a 95mm pulley, however the ideal thing would be to run the smallest pulley possible and neuter the top end for the most area under the curve.

I'll be playing it safe and staying with the 90mm for now.

The restrictor plate may be the way to go in that case, because it will limit the peak airflow up high but allow full power through the low to mid range. Because it's a relatively small level of restriction, it shouldn't result in a lot of excess heat or wear on the blower (I.E. it's not like you're restricting down a 400 hp potential to 300 hp). You could maybe even go back to the 85mm pulley if you went that route.

Good luck!

[Tatsu333]

Hmmm...interesting to note that Harrop no longer lists the FRS/GT86/BRZ supercharger kit at all on their websites (Australian or US). Maybe the "pause for retooling" is a permanent end to production?