Cam timing on Dyno

[Sriracha]

Originally Posted by laksman91

Has anyone figured out a solution to this? The Cams turn on when on the road, but wont on the dyno (Dynopak)

Bump, I'm interested in this as well.

[tomm.brz]

I do not understand this problem some guys have
Cams will come on. I hit 471 reflashes on the counter of my Ecu with ecutek so i think i passed though the activation of cams after reflash quite a lot of times

It seems to me they want to see at least 30-31°C of engine oil temperature to activate

If you flash with cold engine, you will have to wait quite a bit, and as steve said, it is better to just leave your car idle for 2-3 minutes without touching throttle.. but if it s really cold outside they need more time... You can now drive a bit (even with vvt fixed at 0, not yet ready... ecu will use the Base Timing A (vvt off) ignition map ) to accelerate warming up and when oil is at least 30°C, the moment you stop for a moment with the engine idling, the cams will "turn" on (they can cause a very small rpm dip while idling when they do)

If you flash with full warm engine, vvt will be a lot quicker to activate
You should always anyway leave the car idle for 2 minutes before doing anything, but the cams with a hot engine oil, will turn on after 20 seconds or less

The colder the oil temperature, the longer the wait

With Ecutek you just look at "vvt enabled" value... 0 is off , 1 is on
you can also set up a custom map that keeps the engine check light on while the vvt is off, so the moment they turn on, the light will turn off

[Tor]

Originally Posted by tomm.brz

With Ecutek you just look at "vvt enabled" value... 0 is off , 1 is on
you can also set up a custom map that keeps the engine check light on while the vvt is off, so the moment they turn on, the light will turn off

Or you just listen to the engine...

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oGUOXcYrn8A[/ame]

[Sriracha]

Originally Posted by tomm.brz

I do not understand this problem some guys have
Cams will come on. I hit 471 reflashes on the counter of my Ecu with ecutek so i think i passed though the activation of cams after reflash quite a lot of times

It seems to me they want to see at least 30-31°C of engine oil temperature to activate

If you flash with cold engine, you will have to wait quite a bit, and as steve said, it is better to just leave your car idle for 2-3 minutes without touching throttle.. but if it s really cold outside they need more time... You can now drive a bit (even with vvt fixed at 0, not yet ready... ecu will use the Base Timing A (vvt off) ignition map ) to accelerate warming up and when oil is at least 30°C, the moment you stop for a moment with the engine idling, the cams will "turn" on (they can cause a very small rpm dip while idling when they do)

If you flash with full warm engine, vvt will be a lot quicker to activate
You should always anyway leave the car idle for 2 minutes before doing anything, but the cams with a hot engine oil, will turn on after 20 seconds or less

The colder the oil temperature, the longer the wait

With Ecutek you just look at "vvt enabled" value... 0 is off , 1 is on
you can also set up a custom map that keeps the engine check light on while the vvt is off, so the moment they turn on, the light will turn off

The issue I'm more interested in is what PTUNING told me about over the phone when I scheduled my tune for FI.

They said it's pretty common for the cams to not advance properly ( or at all ) when commanded to by Ecutek. Something to do with how our VVT is shitty and doesnt like to advance outside of its normal range. I was told over the phone about 1 in 9 of our cars in the earlier years of production have this issue.

I'm more so asking to see if anyone else has had this issue or if it's something I shouldnt worry about. They said its a fix they have had to do quite a bit and it's not cheap ( they said just parts was 1600 when I asked and from what I've gathered includes the cam actuators, sprockets, oil control valves and ECU ).

Basically just trying to see if I should budget another couple grand to repair the VVT system or if its something that I shouldn't worry about as my car runs phenomenally and hasn't had a CEL as long as I've owned it. Currently sits at 50k, and the service history from the dealership that was leasing it out before i bought it shows it's only ever had 2 documented issues, radio stopped working at 86 mi and ECU was reflashed at 158mi.

Any input is beyond appreciated.

[tomm.brz]

Vvt is often inaccurate a bit, and many cars can t reach 40 of intake advance and stop at 38, or goes to 43 of. Exhaust cam instead of 40
That I saw many times but I would just accept the inaccuracy and. Wouldn't spend money for it

[steve99]

Originally Posted by Sriracha

The issue I'm more interested in is what PTUNING told me about over the phone when I scheduled my tune for FI.

They said it's pretty common for the cams to not advance properly ( or at all ) when commanded to by Ecutek. Something to do with how our VVT is shitty and doesnt like to advance outside of its normal range. I was told over the phone about 1 in 9 of our cars in the earlier years of production have this issue.

I'm more so asking to see if anyone else has had this issue or if it's something I shouldnt worry about. They said its a fix they have had to do quite a bit and it's not cheap ( they said just parts was 1600 when I asked and from what I've gathered includes the cam actuators, sprockets, oil control valves and ECU ).

Basically just trying to see if I should budget another couple grand to repair the VVT system or if its something that I shouldn't worry about as my car runs phenomenally and hasn't had a CEL as long as I've owned it. Currently sits at 50k, and the service history from the dealership that was leasing it out before i bought it shows it's only ever had 2 documented issues, radio stopped working at 86 mi and ECU was reflashed at 158mi.

Any input is beyond appreciated.

Of the vvt system is working with your current tune or stock tune it should be fine with the new tune. Ecutek tunes are based on standard ecu logic for cam controll. The only difference with tuning is the vvt system may be asked to do a liitle more than with stock tune. But if your not throwing vvt codes now or having issues with vvt not activating it should be fine in vast majority of cases

[Sriracha]

Originally Posted by steve99

Of the vvt system is working with your current tune or stock tune it should be fine with the new tune. Ecutek tunes are based on standard ecu logic for cam controll. The only difference with tuning is the vvt system may be asked to do a liitle more than with stock tune. But if your not throwing vvt codes now or having issues with vvt not activating it should be fine in vast majority of cases

Awesome, thank you so much for the info ( you too tomm.brz ). Glad to know that's the likely case. This news came just in time as my JDL kit should finally arrive today and my tune is scheduled for the 31st!

Was seriously worried the VVT was not up to the task. I would hate to boost and only gain 30hp due to timing issues.

Hoping to be boosted before the new year!!

[Kodename47]

Originally Posted by tomm.brz

I do not understand this problem some guys have

Me neither, not personally had the issue but know of cars that have some form of "dyno bug" almost as if they require some form of front wheel speed to activate. It's rare, but it does happen - the tuner I work with has come across a couple and it threw him the 1st time. Perhaps a certain ECU hardware version? @Sriracha it certainly doesn't seem to be an issue with the AVCS parts because the ones I know about operate as soon as they are driven out of the dyno room.

[toast]

I know nothing about tuning, but just installed an Edelbrock kit so I have been reflashing and logging for Zach at Delicious to get me dialed in. For each reflash he asks for a cold start log for 15 minutes without touching the throttle. I can verify that in both logs VVT went from 0 to 1 after about 3 seconds, with oil and coolant temps still in the 40's F range and the idle still high (1900 rpm).

This is on a 2014 BRZ with A01C ROM.

[Sriracha]

Originally Posted by Kodename47

Me neither, not personally had the issue but know of cars that have some form of "dyno bug" almost as if they require some form of front wheel speed to activate. It's rare, but it does happen - the tuner I work with has come across a couple and it threw him the 1st time. Perhaps a certain ECU hardware version? @Sriracha it certainly doesn't seem to be an issue with the AVCS parts because the ones I know about operate as soon as they are driven out of the dyno room.

I honestly wish I could find the correlation between the cases where it happens. Luckily me I ran fine and put down a solid 310/260 (hp/tq) today so I'm happy as can be!

Also it was on a mustang dyno so I'm ecstatic

Car is a damn rocket. Should've come this way from the factory!!

Thanks for the info guys, also @toast dont think I forgot about you cause I didnt quote you lol.

[secho]

Hello there,
just found this thread most appropriate. Maybe somebody can help guys.

After rebuilding FA20 engine I have got issue with the intake cam avcs angles. It fires P000A and P000C (slow response to avcs command).
Engine setup is:
Cosworth supercharger
OEM crankshaft
pCoteMax Kings main and rod bearings
Bridgeway forged rods
JP pistons CR12.5 86mm
machined heads and block
DW 450cc PI
baffled sump plate
CUSCO water oil cooler
mishimoto thermostat (the one which comes with the supercharger kit)




I think about several reasons:

*


- bad one or both OCV selenoids ( less probable, because before disassembly of the engine, cams worked ok, I checked the previous logs)*

- incorrectly aligned timing chain (less probable, because engine goes more-less ok)
*
Can I ask you for your opinion please? Check the logs bellow.


——————
*
intake cams
*
• there is rapid oscilation of both cams all the time
• none of the cam goes over 20FR deg
• cam 1 is performing better than cam 2
*
https://datazap.me/u/secho/loguju-va...mark=9166-9354
*
——————
intake cams angle ugly oscillation
*
https://datazap.me/u/secho/loguju-va...zoom=5408-5893


------------
exhaust cams*
*
• actual angles fluctuates much more when the oil temperature is low (one cam more then the other)
• fluctuation stabilises when the oil temperature rise (both cams ok)
• it follows target exhaust angles*
*
https://datazap.me/u/secho/loguju-va...mark=1384-8114
*

[Smooth_assassin]

Originally Posted by laksman91

Has anyone figured out a solution to this? The Cams turn on when on the road, but wont on the dyno (Dynopak)

I am currently dealing with this issues as we speak I have a built motor and am running FI.

I’ve had 2 tuners tried to tune my brz but same answer from both. “The cams aren’t setting in properly”. Or “they would set in and then shut off right away”.

Bill from delicious tuning did the tuning and the people from snail performance tried to tune it as well.

What bill told me I had to do.... recommended me to change the cams gear and possibly the oil pump.

I figured I just swap out the whole cams and and cams gear along with the cams sensor. (Which I have not done yet car is still in the shop)

[Smooth_assassin]

Originally Posted by Sriracha

The issue I'm more interested in is what PTUNING told me about over the phone when I scheduled my tune for FI.

They said it's pretty common for the cams to not advance properly ( or at all ) when commanded to by Ecutek. Something to do with how our VVT is shitty and doesnt like to advance outside of its normal range. I was told over the phone about 1 in 9 of our cars in the earlier years of production have this issue.

I'm more so asking to see if anyone else has had this issue or if it's something I shouldnt worry about. They said its a fix they have had to do quite a bit and it's not cheap ( they said just parts was 1600 when I asked and from what I've gathered includes the cam actuators, sprockets, oil control valves and ECU ).

Basically just trying to see if I should budget another couple grand to repair the VVT system or if its something that I shouldn't worry about as my car runs phenomenally and hasn't had a CEL as long as I've owned it. Currently sits at 50k, and the service history from the dealership that was leasing it out before i bought it shows it's only ever had 2 documented issues, radio stopped working at 86 mi and ECU was reflashed at 158mi.

Any input is beyond appreciated.

I am experiencing your situation as we speak. My car was on the dyno two times and the problem is still occurring! Is this upsetting yes and cost me money yes. I am going to attempt replace the cams gears with another oem ones I found for a good deal off of a 206 brz. I’m not sure if I want to get another ECU tho but if it comes to it I will do that as well! That just means I would have to get another license for ecutek which sucks....

Bill from delicious tuning simply said it’s a mechanical issue so did the other tuner from snail performance. However, I reached out to so much tuners to get an immediate answer one did say that I have to change the ecu, but since I had two tuners that actually attempted to dyno my car stayed that its the cams not working properly would work off the dyno and is ok to drive with a base map that makes slightly over 230whp. A pretty sad numbers

As soon as I attempt to get the whole cams gear switch out along with another pair of camshafts too, might as well I am also doing the the oil control valve replacement as well as the timing chain and timing belt cover. All recommended by Bill.

I will gladly keep you guys updated

[Smooth_assassin]

My dyno results and details from tuner