Power at High Altitude

[Sasquachulator]

Originally Posted by stilesg57

You’d think that would be the case but it’s not. And there’s enough altitude change around CO that you’ll feel your wheezy car in Breck suddenly become a thoroughbred in Denver, then back to a wheezy couch potato again as you head back up the hill.

Had a ‘95 Impreza I drove all across the country and it was a GREAT car on the west and east coasts and I couldn’t get it to break 40mph on I-70 near Vail pass. Dangerously underpowered.

Maybe its just where i live its kinda flat, and not alot of huge elevation changes overall.

Plus although I am above sea level its not as high as colorado (my city is about 0.65 miles above sea level)

[Baldeagle]

You up for a road trip?

• Lightweight? Check.
• Manual Trans? Check.
• Power at high elevation? Check.
• Daily Driver? Negative.
• Cheap? Negative.
• Low miles? 1,700 miles on the odo, check.
• Serious? Maybe.

https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/l-Used...ting=307648394

[Lelandjt]

Originally Posted by stilesg57

That said you make a good point about the 2.0 Supra IF you can stomach that trans.

And the looks. I really should consider that car but don't think I can bring myself to. Next time I'm in Denver I'll test drive one.
All these cars have some deal breaker issue for me.
BRZ: Everything perfect except lack of factory altitude power.
Cayman: Not as good cargo space as I'd like and hard to justify cost.
Emira: Porsche price without reliability and small cargo.
BMW M2: A little heavy and expensive and BMW reliability, repair cost, and image.
Supra: Looks and probably tranny, smallish cargo area.
Nissan Z: Probably heavy and not as much cargo space as I'd like.

As crazy as it sounds an E-converted BRZ could be my best option, aside from giving up on ever sliding the back end again and staying with my 2012 Mazda 3 hatch Skyactive. The stats on that baby make any hypermiling MTBer salivate!

[Lelandjt]

Originally Posted by Baldeagle

You up for a road trip?

• Lightweight? Check.
• Manual Trans? Check.
• Power at high elevation? Check.
• Daily Driver? Negative.
• Cheap? Negative.
• Low miles? 1,700 miles on the odo, check.
• Serious? Maybe.

https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/l-Used...ting=307648394

You hit all my targets except "carry a MTB protected from the elements". Oh, did I mention that even in summer Breckenridge is often chilly and rains more than most of Colorado? I appreciate that you think I'm hardcore enough to even consider it!

[alan7467]

I’ll never forget the first trip from Denver to Grand Junction I took in my 2017 MX5 RF. It was my first time at much higher altitude on the highway with it. A maniac in a giant truck decided to start screwing with me on I70. Boxing me in between him and an even bigger truck in front of me. I would slow down, and so would he. I tried slowing down, then flooring it to get ahead of him and pass. The RF running at 30+% less power simply couldn’t pull off the maneuver. It was equal parts scary and infuriating at the time.

At 10,000’ I would strongly suggest against a low power NA car if you’re used to FI. That said, with all the aftermarket support the twins have and I’m sure the new ones will have as well there’s bound to be a lot of FI options down the road. So maybe a new BRZ could be a viable option eventually?

I too am searching for my next dedicated fun car. The new Z is on my list as well. Though I worry that it would be more GT car than canyon carving sports car. I already have my lightly modified MK7.5 Golf R for my GT like needs.

Best of luck in your decision!

[stilesg57]

Originally Posted by Lelandjt

And the looks. I really should consider that car but don't think I can bring myself to. Next time I'm in Denver I'll test drive one.
All these cars have some deal breaker issue for me.
BRZ: Everything perfect except lack of factory altitude power.
Cayman: Not as good cargo space as I'd like and hard to justify cost.
Emira: Porsche price without reliability and small cargo.
BMW M2: A little heavy and expensive and BMW reliability, repair cost, and image.
Supra: Looks and probably tranny, smallish cargo area.
Nissan Z: Probably heavy and not as much cargo space as I'd like.

As crazy as it sounds an E-converted BRZ could be my best option, aside from giving up on ever sliding the back end again and staying with my 2012 Mazda 3 hatch Skyactive. The stats on that baby make any hypermiling MTBer salivate!

We’re in a remarkably similar spot when it comes to cross shopping options and opinions. I’ve also got a ~$55k limit and need a car soon so those two factors kill the Z and the M2 right off the bat, but do introduce the Mustang to the party (which I understand isn’t beloved around here but that gen3 coyote motor is SPECIAL).

I’d be thinking FI before Electric conversion on a Twin (I’m not at altitude these days and I still am, ha). There’s a market for FI for these cars and I’d bet there are well designed, reasonably reliable kits out within 6 months of the cars’ release. Electric is a one-off custom job and will be expensive, not to mention practically erasing resale value.

Two more options to think about: new WRX and the new Golf R / S3. The new WRX is a wildcard and just might address all the current gen’s issues, in which case it’s a proven formula for fun and practicality at altitude at a great price. The new Golf R and S3 I still need to hear about the AWD dynamics and if they’re as front-weighted as the last ones, but otherwise those are nice and practical altitude cars with the only non-PDK auto I’d be caught dead with.

[Kona61]

Originally Posted by stilesg57

We’re in a remarkably similar spot when it comes to cross shopping options and opinions. I’ve also got a ~$55k limit and need a car soon so those two factors kill the Z and the M2 right off the bat, but do introduce the Mustang to the party (which I understand isn’t beloved around here but that gen3 coyote motor is SPECIAL).

I’d be thinking FI before Electric conversion on a Twin (I’m not at altitude these days and I still am, ha). There’s a market for FI for these cars and I’d bet there are well designed, reasonably reliable kits out within 6 months of the cars’ release. Electric is a one-off custom job and will be expensive, not to mention practically erasing resale value.

Two more options to think about: new WRX and the new Golf R / S3. The new WRX is a wildcard and just might address all the current gen’s issues, in which case it’s a proven formula for fun and practicality at altitude at a great price. The new Golf R and S3 I still need to hear about the AWD dynamics and if they’re as front-weighted as the last ones, but otherwise those are nice and practical altitude cars with the only non-PDK auto I’d be caught dead with.

I’m very unbiased when it comes to cars overall. I’ve also owned or had decent experience with the cars your looking at. I’d say from the sounds of it, don’t bother with a VW/Audi MQB car. My MK7 Golf was nice, but not that fun. They never will oversteer except on ice. Had a 15 WRX and that was nice, but still understeered and wouldn’t really recommend the FA20 for reliability.

I’d probably take a Mustang with the Gen3 coyote. The MT82 is pretty meh, but they are f*cking fast and if you get a Mach 1 it will handle quite well and I believe gets the tremec T56. They do always drive “big” and are never that nimble or tossable.

[shiumai]

What about a base C8? That's in the M2 price range and weighs less.

[Lelandjt]

Originally Posted by shiumai

What about a base C8? That's in the M2 price range and weighs less.

Looks are a little over the top for me and I really like the practicality of a +2 cabin with pass through trunk. Though a little heavy, the driving impressions from the M2 always mention drifty and fun.

[shiumai]

Originally Posted by Lelandjt

Looks are a little over the top for me and I really like the practicality of a +2 cabin with pass through trunk. Though a little heavy, the driving impressions from the M2 always mention drifty and fun.

Yeah, I understand. The C8 is more of a niche car due to its limited cabin and carrying space. But if you don't want drifty, and want 'cornering on rails', the C8 is pretty darn good.