Downshift vs neutral roll

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by billwot

...been driving manual trannies over 60 years, and I never realized it was so damn complicated

It's exhausting when you do it right. That's how you know.

[PureShield]

Originally Posted by lukey86

Downshift for sure, helps you stop quicker and adds just a little bit extra to the life of your brakes because you dont need to push as hard on the pedal. These cars are so light, in fact, it's possible to come almost to a complete stop just using your gears, but thats the truck driver coming out in me lol. Plus with a nice exhaust it sounds better too

You may be saving your brakes but your killing your clutch. I do agree about the exhaust though.

[PureShield]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

If I am moving even a little the car is always in gear. The clutch may be in but I am in the lowest gear possible for the speed I am traveling. This has saved my bacon at least 100 times over the years when events suddenly required me to accelerate and motor out of danger. If I had needed to shift into a gear and then accelerate in at least 10 of those cases I would probably have been dead.
Rolling around in neutral takes your nice light sports car and turns it into a big heavy soapbox racer.

Does that mean that say your coming to a stop at a red light or a stop sign your clutch pedal is pushed in and your going through the motions of downshifting? or are you just putting it into 2nd and then with your clutch in you stop then put it into neutral? Haha I know what you mean I just want to get a more clear understanding of what you do.

[PureShield]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

How do you find some of these things?

[PureShield]

Originally Posted by Anthony

Ideally you want to rev up the engine to the RPMs it will be at in the new lower gear, with the clutch engaged (not pushing the pedal), then shift to the lower gear. If done perfectly, the car won't lunge at all and the shifter will go into the next gear buttah smoov.

Say you're at 3,000 RPMs in 5th gear, but you want to go to 4th. If you were already in 4th gear at your current speed, we'll say that would be 4,000 RPMs. So... ideally... you would:

1. Push in the clutch pedal
2. Shift to neutral
3. Left off of the clutch pedal
4. Rev up to 4,000 RPMs
5. Push in the clutch pedal
6. Shift to 4th
7. Let off of the clutch pedal

That'll save your synchros, your clutch, and just be a cool thing to do. It takes practice, but not as much as you might expect from my 7 step instructions.

Originally Posted by Ultramaroon

In b4 THERE IS NO NEED TO DOUBLE CLUTCH EVER BLAH BLAH BLAH...

If you don't lift off of the clutch pedal after putting it into neutral and just rev match is that all right?

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by PureShield

Does that mean that say your coming to a stop at a red light or a stop sign your clutch pedal is pushed in and your going through the motions of downshifting? or are you just putting it into 2nd and then with your clutch in you stop then put it into neutral? Haha I know what you mean I just want to get a more clear understanding of what you do.

I am in gear and clutch out until the revs drop so low that I have to push the clutch in. If rolling for a bit I will then leave it in second until slow enough to shift into first. The once stopped if at a light or just for a minute or two I leave it in first with the clutch in but if going to be prolonged (i.e. a train or construction) then I shift to neutral. My car rarely sees neutral if it is turned on. I know I will now have 100 people saying "But you are ruining your clutch bro" to which I reply that I have traded in my last 4 cars with 200K + miles on each of them and have never replaced a clutch. So based on my own personal experience I am not concerned.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by PureShield

How do you find some of these things?

I am a wizard

[Eighty 6]

[Eighty 6]

Originally Posted by jawn

It's all the same in the dark.

Guys, Guy's why'nt you just listen to Jawn she know's all about trannies.

Vomits...

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by PureShield

If you don't lift off of the clutch pedal after putting it into neutral and just rev match is that all right?

Yeah, that's fine. None of this advice is going to make or break you. We're talking super subtle/technical differences now.

I'd definitely recommend at least rev matching on the way down, if you have passengers, just for the simple result of a smoother ride for them. But all that fancy double clutching shit I described earlier is just for extra fun and style.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Anthony

But all that fancy double clutching shit I described earlier is just for extra fun and style.

Yes. I think a pile of guys are over thinking all this. Just because it looks like a race car does not mean you need to drive around the streets using advanced techniques all the time. If you were driving a Corolla would you be worried about heal and toe, double clutching and rev matching? Probably not (other then Kris of course). A pile of the things that people want to do are really only needed on the track, unless of course you are trying to shave .2 seconds off your commute.
Not for a second saying that these methods are not fun and can not be applied during regular driving but so many new MT guys seem to think they are doing something wrong if they are not doing them.
In the end it is just a car and there is nothing wrong with just driving it as one when on the streets. You will however get your ass handed to you on the track if you don't learn them.

[Anthony]

Yeah, I still can't heel toe well. It sucks.

[86kahl]

Idk what you guys are talking about. I downshift till I'm at 0mph , then teeter totter in first gear till the light changes. I never touch the brakes. Ever. Brakes are the opposite of speed and I'm all about sped. I even removed my inner pads for weight reduction since I wasn't using them anyways.

Heel toe takes a lot of practice to get smooth, try overcompensating with the rev's till you find the sweet spot. It's all in the muscle memory.

[Big D Design]

Let it be known that I had been driving manual trans for over 40 years. I still have 3 manual trans cars in driveway, and there are drivers cars. The FRS is my DD and the others are just my fluff fun machines. I have moved from the Jersey Shore to Northern Florida about 4 years ago.

A lot of how you drive a manual is determined by road surface and traffic. If you have lousy roads... you will not be able to coast very well. If you had traffic with other cars trying to kill you around...... better leave that sucker in gear. In New Jersey the roads for the most part have lots of bumps or lots of traffic. I would hardly find anywhere to coast except when new asphalt has been laid and there wasn't any traffic around me. We all know what it feels like when a new road is paved. It feels so cool to drive a manual car and bring it to redline over and over again in these butter smooth conditions. The car will feel like it was worth all the money you spent on the damn thing.

When I would go to my parents home in Florida for the last 30 years and bring my racecar....... wow!! It was the most amazing thing just rowing thru the gears and not hitting any bumps. Because racecar.

So here is where I say neutral works in butter smooth roads that are not crowded. The FRS has that spring back to neutral like no other car I have driven. The FRS trans IMO is one of the best transmissions I have ever had the pleasure to use. My Roush Mustang trans is nice but you don't have the certain notchy feel that lets you know exactly what gear you are going into. I don't coast as much with the Roush, the noise that crackles when dropping a gear is just way too intoxicating. The exhaust in the Roush seems to me equal to the Jaguar F type. Mostly I drive the Roush to make loud noises and stick myself to the seat with the supercharged acceleration.

Getting back to the roll or no roll. The FRS is so light and so enjoyable in these butter smooth Florida roads that neutral roll is a no-brainer to an experienced driver. The car just keeps rolling and is so light that brake pressure is minimal. I have enough experience to put a FRS back in gear at any speed in a half second or less. I know what gear to use every time. The new Porsche GT3 has neutral coasting now. I'm not sure if you guys are aware of it. the GT3 customers clamored for it and Porsche delivered. Coasting is cool and just like anything in this world..... you have to have the conditions and experience to do it safely. Happy Holidays to all. Peace