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[Hawk77FT]

Originally Posted by Slip

Yeah, it's obvious you are not from Australia. If you were, you would know that my car is clearly not a truck... Dude, stay on forums where you know what you are talking about.

That sound a bit xenophobic matey! Let him be on whatever forum he likes, it is public for everyone. And please no need to be smart about HSV (which is a subsidiary of GM since 1931). You and I both know the crapy cars they make (let's not go there, shall we?).
Also, not criticizing you or anything but just by driving an ute and a commodore does not make you a connoisseur in rear wheel drive cars AT ALL. Different cars have different dynamics, different forces, weight distribution, wheel base, etc.
This car is fun to drive with nannies on, super fun with trc off and megafun with nannies off. Unfortunatelly not all these are suitable for public roads or anyone with a driving licence for that matter.

[Captain Snooze]

Originally Posted by ziggz501

the traction control system is intrusive to any driver that would normally react correctly to a loss of traction. that is to say, they counter steer to get the car going the correct direction again. try counter steering with traction control on, and you will see what it is to actually lose control.

You are confusing over steer with "loss of traction"

[Hawk77FT]

Originally Posted by kster

i don't think alot of australians will get it, as the current state of things even speeding is considered a hoon offence adding to donuts and loss of traction. Where as they should be focusing more on fatigue/alcohol use while driving as speed kills message is very overated and the usual state of things in australia is nannie state so you must keep those on otherwise be labelled as a hoon which is a very wide ranging as anyone with a speeding ticket is a hoon.

Also OT our restrictive Gun laws unable to own a AK47,AR15 sucks only way to get these is by illegal means.

What the heck mate, are you 15 or something?
According to statistics speed, drink-driving and inattention accounted for almost all of the crashes in 2012.

Furthermore, what the heck in the world would you do with an AK47 let alone AR15? Getting ready for zombies attack or something? LOL

[kster]

Mainly Zombies and end of world stuff mate just like that American tv series with those rednecks preparing for the armagedon events that we will be apparenty be facing.

Back on OT speed is definitely a big factor in the road toll but being labelled a hoon for speeding is really out there.

[Captain Snooze]

Originally Posted by kster

Back on OT speed is definitely a big factor in the road toll but being labelled a hoon for speeding is really out there.

The politicians need to be seen doing something. The thing with speed/ing and driving over the alcohol limit is it is easily measured. You are either speeding or you are not. You blew over 0.05 or you did not. How do you easily measure fatigue? Never when I've been pulled over have I had my tyre pressures checked. The politicians don't care about the reality of risk; only it's perception.

Originally Posted by kster

Also OT our restrictive Gun laws unable to own a AK47,AR15 sucks only way to get these is by illegal means.

I'm not really sure how this is relevant to this forum.

[Slip]

Originally Posted by Hawk77FT

That sound a bit xenophobic matey! Let him be on whatever forum he likes, it is public for everyone. And please no need to be smart about HSV (which is a subsidiary of GM since 1931). You and I both know the crapy cars they make (let's not go there, shall we?).
Also, not criticizing you or anything but just by driving an ute and a commodore does not make you a connoisseur in rear wheel drive cars AT ALL. Different cars have different dynamics, different forces, weight distribution, wheel base, etc.
This car is fun to drive with nannies on, super fun with trc off and megafun with nannies off. Unfortunatelly not all these are suitable for public roads or anyone with a driving licence for that matter.

I agree I came over bit strong. It must be the neighbourhood I live in. I see stuff regularly that makes me mad because if the idiotic nature of some of this stuff. I don't mean to suggest if you turn traction control off you are an idiot. I just want to implore people to think before doing it. There is a time and place.

About the HSVs - I know, I know - not trying to pretend they are anything more than.. well, what they are!

I am not the worlds biggest rear-wheel connoisseur. I was just trying to say that if my example of the ute was not up to the responders liking, here was another with more grip. I have driven quite a number of other rear-wheel drive cars, but these were not necessary to include to validate my point.

I agree with your last paragraph above - turning these off makes the fun factor grow exponentially (I don't have my car yet, but a fair assumption I am guessing!), but you said it - suitability is the word. People on this forum are saying ALL of the time is suitable. Its just not. EDIT - Just realised I was reading the wrong post when I wrote this - Sorry!

Again, don't want to be 'that guy' - just don't want to see on the news somebody's ambition has outweighed their talent (stole this from Casey Stoner).

Just stay safe people. It's all I am asking. I hope to one day see some of you on a track day or a skid pan where this argument becomes irrelevant. It's all off then baby!!

Good times to be had.

[Nafe]

Wow, this thread got out of hand...
I have not said it is safer to drive with the nannies off, nor that everyone should turn them off... I just don't usually have them on.
I have never owned a car with them previous to this, and I am not dead. If someone crashes into me, traction control won't stop it....
I am not saying that they don't improve safety, jsut not that they are 100% NECESSARY.
I am not a hoon, nor a hero, I don't drive like an idiot. And I certainly am not a street drifter.
I am really not sue why everyone keeps bring up ABS though?? Is there are reason for that?? This thread is about turning off traction control and VSC... ABS is not something that can be turned off at all... So it has no relevance in this thread.
I wouldn't turn ABS off even if it was an option.
However, I don't see how it is "unsafe" (that is not to say I can't see safety benefits) to drive with traction off...
And to answer questions earlier, I have had advanced driver training and spent a lot of time on track. Do I think this makes me an awesome driver?? No. Do I think I am above average ability?? Well I am not qualified to answer that question.