Anybody here getting that greasy "$27k" feeling?

[oneday]

Originally Posted by PAImportTuner

If you like the car as is, right now and will be paying $27+k OTD then I'm going to hold you to that.

There is no "car as is, right now" so that is an asinine statement. Right now it is a swirly-covered test mule filled with a few enthusiast's hopes and dreams.

If it does come with LSD, 6-ST, Recaros, and 4-pots for $25-27K OTD then the FR-S will be at the top of my list when I am ready to buy in late spring 2012....any more than $27K and my focus will definitely shift to finding the right CPO Cayman for $32K.

[tranzformer]

Originally Posted by r4m3n

The Scion iQ is $16K. BASE. Pay $6K more to move up to the FR-S? Ain't gonna happen.

Realistically, I see the FR-S priced at $25k starting.

You do realize the average American buys hp in their car. They don't care about light weight, great handling, low cog...etc. Priced too high and the average buyer won't consider a 180-200hp car.

[PAImportTuner]

Originally Posted by oneday

There is no "car as is, right now" so that is an asinine statement. Right now it is a swirly-covered test mule filled with a few enthusiast's hopes and dreams.

If it does come with LSD, 6-ST, Recaros, and 4-pots for $25-27K OTD then the FR-S will be at the top of my list when I am ready to buy in late spring 2012....any more than $27K and my focus will definitely shift to finding the right CPO Cayman for $32K.

I said that because at this point r4m3n is willing to pay that for what is already confirmed. Recaros and 4 pots are definitely not in the cards in base form if even an option. He's saying $25k starting for this car in base form is a good price, this thread is about 25-27k being the starting price for this car.

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1528

[bofa]

Originally Posted by r4m3n

The Scion iQ is $16K. BASE. Pay $6K more to move up to the FR-S? Ain't gonna happen.

Realistically, I see the FR-S priced at $25k starting.

Uh, wtf does the iQ have to do with this car? And yes, I'd pay 6k more for a RWD sports coupe with twice the horsepower (est) and that doesn't look like a 4-wheeled pimple.

I'd similarly pay 8k more for a Mazdaspeed 3 over a Mazda 2, and 9k more for a Mustang over a Fiesta.

[PAImportTuner]

Originally Posted by bofa

Uh, wtf does the iQ have to do with this car? And yes, I'd pay 6k more for a RWD sports coupe with twice the horsepower (est) and that doesn't look like a 4-wheeled pimple.

I'd similarly pay 8k more for a Mazdaspeed 3 over a Mazda 2, and 9k more for a Mustang over a Fiesta.

He meant like "only 6k more", as if it should be 9k more instead, because to him at $25k it's the deal of the century. He should also consider that the tC is only 3k more than IQ. I'd rather buy that.

Just re-read it and look at other posts of his that support the sarcasm.

[bofa]

sheesh... neither his logic nor his sarcasm makes sense to me...

[PAImportTuner]

Originally Posted by bofa

sheesh... neither his logic nor his sarcasm makes sense to me...

[n2oinferno]

I remember Toyota saying mid 20s, but honestly I think I'd be more willing at 21 or 22. Oh man PA, after seeing your 800+ writeup I just laughed. That's a bit more than I pay on my mortgage. I'm glad I'm not young with insane insurance rates anymore.

Really though, low 20s is the place to be and ridiculously competitive for the market. Option it out if you want to give the kids all the goodies they want and jack your price up that way. That's about how all Scions work. You start getting into upper 20s, and no thanks, I'll buy a Genesis Coupe when the refresh model (rumored 2013) comes out, or a Mustang GT on X Plan.

[RRnold]

The latest from Moto...

"Again no 'offiical' price tag has been mentioned yet, only a 'target' at various stages of rumors and speculations (even leaking from respective firms at various points) of $18,000, $22,000, $25,000 and latest being $20,000... so again, we have to wait and see until its finally at the dealers. No one stated officially that Subaru will be more or less costly than Toyota.

As for Scion/Toyota and Subaru Public Relations (PR), there have been a lot of delays both from corporate incidents like product recall blow up, merger of Subaru, and few dozen other things during the development of this car, and even greatest natural disaster to affect its origin of operations, Japan, in history. Add to this, various media, and guys like us making speculations and rumors, leaks when things are still under development, and the sheer speed of information over internet, all add to inconsistencies, misunderstandings, and confusion... That's the nature of the world we all live.

So take things with a grain of salt as they say, and let the product mature, and in the meantime, make use of internet and all the speed and reach, and make friendly suggestions before things are final. I'm sure somebody's reading and if enough people concur, the planners of the very products may make changes based on that... "

[bofa]

Originally Posted by RRnold

The latest from Moto...

"Again no 'offiical' price tag has been mentioned yet, only a 'target' at various stages of rumors and speculations (even leaking from respective firms at various points) of $18,000, $22,000, $25,000 and latest being $20,000... so again, we have to wait and see until its finally at the dealers. No one stated officially that Subaru will be more or less costly than Toyota.

As for Scion/Toyota and Subaru Public Relations (PR), there have been a lot of delays both from corporate incidents like product recall blow up, merger of Subaru, and few dozen other things during the development of this car, and even greatest natural disaster to affect its origin of operations, Japan, in history. Add to this, various media, and guys like us making speculations and rumors, leaks when things are still under development, and the sheer speed of information over internet, all add to inconsistencies, misunderstandings, and confusion... That's the nature of the world we all live.

So take things with a grain of salt as they say, and let the product mature, and in the meantime, make use of internet and all the speed and reach, and make friendly suggestions before things are final. I'm sure somebody's reading and if enough people concur, the planners of the very products may make changes based on that... "

Hah - just caught that too. Now we're talkin

[rifleshooter]

Originally Posted by tranzformer

Speaking only for NA, Scion's most expensive car is the tC and runs $18,995 with the manual. Throw in an extra $1000 for the auto. Scion prides itself on its budget offerings. Now for us, we all understand the difference of this FT86/FR-S project over just any other car. However, average Joe and Betty probably won't. So sure, the FR-S should be a bit more expensive than the $19k tC, but how much? $3-4k seems like a fair starting point but even then average Joe and Betty could argue that is a lot to pay extra over the tC. For us, as enthusiasts I think we would happily fork over that extra $3-4k if it provides a great feeling behind the wheel, a great engine, nice interior...bla bla bla everything we have been talking about. But if you start asking for $6-8k over the tC ($25-27k) I think you will not only lose average Joe and Betty but also us the enthusiasts. Scion/Toyota really need to get this in the low to mid $20k range. Low 20s if the car is very basic would be acceptable. Toyota/Subaru should know that if they did their market research and read the forums. No one will pay +$27k for a Scion. Well maybe no one is too harsh since there would probably be a fanboy or two out there who would. But let's just say no one with common sense would.

This.

What Tranzformer said.

I frankly could not have put this any better myself. I am paying off $30k worth of FJ Cruiser as I am passing through grad school, and it is like passing a pea-sized kidney stone. I don't want to do that again.

Yes, the dollar is losing its value quicker than a box of lint at a Naval Commissioning ceremony, but I just could not bear to take out a near-decade-long loan in order to purchase a car with such limited capabilities. $27k WOULD have me considering a used purchase of a much nicer brand of car.

Since I mostly wrench myself, I can fix whatever breaks, hence my ability to hold onto my '94 Bimmer 325Is (E36) Coupe for 5 years. I could buy a Boxster or a 3 year old Cayenne for that kind of cash - heck, I even found a slew of old 911s for decent prices. I just can't stomach paying nearly $30 large for a car that was supposed to replicate the old-school RWD Corollas or Celicas of the 1970s and '80s.

[rifleshooter]

Originally Posted by PAImportTuner

I want to stay on topic at hand as much as possible because it's a very important one. One that TMC needs to see and thoroughly look at from all perspectives and ideas, before dropping a price. The price can very well kill the car to the point of not even considering it.

I'm a gun guy.

A VERY similar challenge happened in the gun market recently - a superb company called Magpul designed a revolutionary improvement on the assault rifle called the Masada. This rifle had bunches of features soldiers and shooters were begging for. Magpul claimed they'd be able to produce the rifle for public sale at lower than $1500.

EVERYONE in the gun community was STOKED about this deal. So much so, that Bushmaster bought the rights to the rifle, and proceeded to test and tune and tweak it themselves. They took several years, but finally came out with the rifle, renamed the Adaptive Combat Rifle... at $2700 - $3100.

People in the gun world were so pissed off that they raged about it for weeks or months in the forums. Lathering, seething hatred was expressed for both Bushmaster and, for some reason, Magpul!

Bushmaster did itself NO FAVORS when they put the ACR out at a price nearly 2x higher than the original figure, and God Knows they could have priced it lower, but they decided to rape the market simply because they could.

I sold off my only Bushmaster rifle and won't be buying another. Toyota, are you listening? If you decide to beat customers over the head with a high price on this little car, be prepared for your "re-invigoration" to be not-that-re-invigorating. Ideally, this car should start at just under $20k, and finish no higher than $23k.

[r4m3n]

Originally Posted by PAImportTuner

He meant like "only 6k more", as if it should be 9k more instead, because to him at $25k it's the deal of the century. He should also consider that the tC is only 3k more than IQ. I'd rather buy that.

Just re-read it and look at other posts of his that support the sarcasm.

I'm saying that the iQ is priced way more than it should be. So I wouldn't expect Scion to price the FR-S below $25k, if the tC can fill the 19-24k slot.

[Matador]

Originally Posted by rifleshooter

Ideally, this car should start at just under $20k, and finish no higher than $23k.

First of all, fat chance. Second of all, is that really what a ~200hp, supposedly lightweight, economical to operate, rwd sports coupe is worth?
I don't think so. I also think it's unfair to ask for such a low price point. I think around $21-$23k is a reasonable average MSRP for this car. Obviously, yeah, I'd be stoked if it could be had for $20k, but c'mon, the TC costs that. Put a little perspective on what you are paying for.