Learning manual on the 86

[Ashikabi]

Originally Posted by Summerwolf

I just couldn't imagine a scenario where you want to add a step to an already simple process. That is what I'm getting at.

Because the simple process doesn't fully cover all situations. Someone mentioned an off ramp a couple posts up. The only hill I've used my handbrake on is significantly steeper than an off ramp. If adding a step turns a small chance of collision into NO chance of collision it should be used when practical to do so. Why use a manual transmission? You are adding multiple steps to something that an automatic does for you. But we choose to drive a manual cuz it's fun but it has its flaws. Like hill starts. Maybe this wasn't a problem before because if you rolled back into someone and your chrome bumpers touched... nothing happened. Now our cars are wrapped in fragile plastic and faster care needs taken

[mdm]

^^^ this

[Summerwolf]

Originally Posted by Ashikabi

Because the simple process doesn't fully cover all situations. Someone mentioned an off ramp a couple posts up. The only hill I've used my handbrake on is significantly steeper than an off ramp. If adding a step turns a small chance of collision into NO chance of collision it should be used when practical to do so. Why use a manual transmission? You are adding multiple steps to something that an automatic does for you. But we choose to drive a manual cuz it's fun but it has its flaws. Like hill starts. Maybe this wasn't a problem before because if you rolled back into someone and your chrome bumpers touched... nothing happened. Now our cars are wrapped in fragile plastic and faster care needs taken

If you are worried about rolling back in to the car behind you, you have more to worry about while driving normally. Maybe when you're first learning, but that shouldn't be a concern after you are used to driving.

[Ashikabi]

Originally Posted by Summerwolf

If you are worried about rolling back in to the car behind you, you have more to worry about while driving normally. Maybe when you're first learning, but that shouldn't be a concern after you are used to driving.

So now I'm a bad driver? I'll admit I'm not Mario Andretti but I can handle starting from a stop and even on MOST hills without a handbrake. I choose to use it on very steep hills where I'm not confident I won't roll back or stall. Why is this such a problem for you to understand?

[jasonojordan]

I think you are assuming that everywhere in the county as is flat as it is there in st louis mate. There are tons of areas in the us where if nothing else when you are starting from a stop using the hand brake will save on the clutch.

[Summerwolf]

Originally Posted by jasonojordan

I think you are assuming that everywhere in the county as is flat as it is there in st louis mate. There are tons of areas in the us where if nothing else when you are starting from a stop using the hand brake will save on the clutch.

You're assuming I haven't lived anywhere else?


Anyways, one of the "steepest" places I have ever gotten stopped at was an underground parking garage in Chicago.





It isn't a problem for me to understand at all. I just like the debate.

[Summerwolf]

Originally Posted by Ashikabi

So now I'm a bad driver? I'll admit I'm not Mario Andretti but I can handle starting from a stop and even on MOST hills without a handbrake. I choose to use it on very steep hills where I'm not confident I won't roll back or stall. Why is this such a problem for you to understand?

ahhhhh. Makes sense.

[mdm]

Originally Posted by Summerwolf

It isn't a problem for me to understand at all. I just like the debate.

So please remind us why do you think that using handbrake to assist some hill starts is not ok. Because I can't recall you giving a single sensible reason (it wasn't available before 1960 is not sensible). It's not really a debate if you present no arguments.

[Summerwolf]

Originally Posted by mdm

So please remind us why do you think that using handbrake to assist some hill starts is not ok. Because I can't recall you giving a single sensible reason (it wasn't available before 1960 is not sensible). It's not really a debate if you present no arguments.

It is ok to do, just not necessary.


The handbrake thing was simply my curiosity because there are still vehicles (manual passenger trucks spring to mind) with NO handbrake so this technique couldn't be used, period. I also stated it had to be a fairly new technique.... I don't think handbrakes were common in vehicles until at least the 70's.


It isn't taught in any formal drivers training in the US (although manual is hardly taught anymore.) Also, I'm pretty sure if you took a CDL test and used your airbrakes on a hill, they would fail you. It wasn't allowed when I got taught anyways. Maybe that has changed?

[PandaSPUR]

Well.. this escalated quickly

[Ashikabi]

Originally Posted by Summerwolf

It is ok to do, just not necessary.


The handbrake thing was simply my curiosity because there are still vehicles (manual passenger trucks spring to mind) with NO handbrake so this technique couldn't be used, period. I also stated it had to be a fairly new technique.... I don't think handbrakes were common in vehicles until at least the 70's.


It isn't taught in any formal drivers training in the US (although manual is hardly taught anymore.) Also, I'm pretty sure if you took a CDL test and used your airbrakes on a hill, they would fail you. It wasn't allowed when I got taught anyways. Maybe that has changed?

A big truck will take much longer to start rolling back so I'm betting it wouldn't be as useful for them. Does it matter if the technique is 30 years old instead of 80?

[justatroll]

Originally Posted by Summerwolf

It isn't taught in any formal drivers training in the US (although manual is hardly taught anymore.) Also, I'm pretty sure if you took a CDL test and used your airbrakes on a hill, they would fail you. It wasn't allowed when I got taught anyways. Maybe that has changed?

I have read that in Europe if you do not use your "handbrake" on hill starts and at EVERY RED LIGHT you will FAIL your driver's test.

So to say that using your handbrake regularly is "ab"normal, then you have American blinders on....

[Summerwolf]

Originally Posted by Ashikabi

A big truck will take much longer to start rolling back so I'm betting it wouldn't be as useful for them. Does it matter if the technique is 30 years old instead of 80?

Boy that's a load of shit. A big truck will move back MUCH quicker than a normal passenger vehicle, especially loaded.

[Ashikabi]

Originally Posted by justatroll

I have read that in Europe if you do not use your "handbrake" on hill starts and at EVERY RED LIGHT you will FAIL your driver's test.

So to say that using your handbrake regularly is "ab"normal, then you have American blinders on....

That sounds excessive. You have a source? Or can a European chime in?