BRZ or Fiesta ST...why is BRZ better?

[Boxer486]

Originally Posted by thill

LOL, I doubt he is a power guy if he is asking about a Fiesta ST and a BRZ. It sounds like he wants something different otherwise he is better off staying in a WRX.

Well, they mentioned 'limited tuning potential'. Obviously that means power as the twins have more tuning potential in every other regard than a Fiesta. Now looking at a Mustang that weighs almost half a ton more depending.

You either know you want a 2700lb RWD coupe or you don't. I really don't get the confusion at all.

[xia]

I find the Fiesta.....cute.

[woode]

Originally Posted by Boxer486

Well, they mentioned 'limited tuning potential'. Obviously that means power as the twins have more tuning potential in every other regard than a Fiesta. Now looking at a Mustang that weighs almost half a ton more depending.

You either know you want a 2700lb RWD coupe or you don't. I really don't get the confusion at all.

I'm with boxer on this one. The BRZ/FRS fills a very defined niche, and for the most part you either are looking for that or you're not. If you're not - there is a good chance you won't be in love with it.

I didn't want a convertible (miata/s2k) but have been looking for something to fill the lightweight RWD coupe role for a while. Only other options were used 90s 240sx, rx7, etc. Along came the BRZ with a pretty nice interior, 2700lbs, RWD w/ limited slip, great platform to build on..

You can compare on paper things like 1/4 mile, 0-60, even lateral g's.. but what you really can't express on paper is how FUN the BRZ/FRS is. Unless your idea of fun is just drag racing.. in which case it's not the car for you obviously. (nothing against drag racing)

[quasi86]

Originally Posted by Sport-Tech

And the "Ignorant Post of the Day" award goes to....

Wow they changed the suspension and the grill and put different seat covers! Huge difference! NOT.

How bout I put it this way... the Fiesta was built as an economy car. The fiest ST is an economy car with an oversized engine and a stiff suspension. Ground breaking stuff indeed!

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[psyclone07]

Brz is better because we are in a BRZ forum!

All jokes aside fiesta st isn't for me. I was cross shopping between the focus st when I picked up the brz. Both nice cars but I don't have the need for 4 doors. RWD was a main factor as well.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by Brzetto

There fixed it for ya and if you didn't troll so much people wouldn't mention you at all. I've seen other people mentioning you, you're the forum troll nobody wants to attract the attention of, get used to being Mr Grain of Salt. You did it to yourself.


Btw the Smart Car isn't really an economy car, it's a fake economy car, it was supposed to get good mpg and look like a mutant golf cart but it only succeeded at the latter. It has a shit crash rating, shit mpg and only a handful of idiots own the piece of shit.

maybe im dumb then so please explain to me why the smart car isnt a sports car. according to your definition, it is by all accounts.

Originally Posted by quasi86

Wow they changed the suspension and the grill and put different seat covers! Huge difference! NOT.

How bout I put it this way... the Fiesta was built as an economy car. The fiest ST is an economy car with an oversized engine and a stiff suspension. Ground breaking stuff indeed!

Sent from my GT-P5113 using Tapatalk

what is groundbreaking about the frs then? i think getting parts to work in conjunction and still having a warranty is going unrecognized while adapting the legacy platform to be a rwd coupe is being treated like the second coming of christ.

[Boxer486]

Originally Posted by fatoni

what is groundbreaking about the frs then? i think getting parts to work in conjunction and still having a warranty is going unrecognized while adapting the legacy platform to be a rwd coupe is being treated like the second coming of christ.

Why'd you buy one then if you feel that way, to troll the forum? You already have three others in your sig that are equally not special in your eyes or am I wrong?

List all the current production cars with the same or better CoG than the twins and their respective prices, then let's talk about that second coming.

Why are Ford, Nissan and others talking about developing direct competitors for nothing more than just a mashed up Legacy?

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by Boxer486

Why'd you buy one then if you feel that way, to troll the forum? You already have three others in your sig that are equally not special in your eyes or am I wrong?

List all the current production cars with the same or better CoG than the twins and their respective prices, then let's talk about that second coming.

Why are Ford, Nissan and others talking about developing direct competitors for nothing more than just a mashed up Legacy?

i bought it because it is a car that checks all the boxes for me. im not vein enough to think that because the brz is the right car for me, the fiesta st isnt a remarkable bit of car. none of the cars i own are objectively special except for maybe the ls430. that thing has by far the most interesting technology behind it.

focusing on cog is great for marketing but its still far from groundbreaking. if you are going to make a case for the frs its in your best interest to steer clear of objective data because when you look at numbers, the frs does poorly.

[Boxer486]

Originally Posted by fatoni

focusing on cog is great for marketing but its still far from groundbreaking. if you are going to make a case for the frs its in your best interest to steer clear of objective data because when you look at numbers, the frs does poorly.

No, CoG does great things for physics. I doubt most people that bought the car even realized what the CoG of the car was when they bought it. They enjoyed the driving feel which is directly related to CoG. Sounds like you did too.

I disagree completely objectively. The twins are very competitive even when under powered by 40-70hp while on Prius tires. Both of which can be fixed much easier than turning a Fiesta into a low CoG RWD coupe. Not to mention its physical dimensions are closer to a current production Miata than a Fiesta, Mustang, GTI, Camaro, etc, etc. That in my mind makes it special as my DD even if it's not my 'fast' car. Despite that, it's the car that begs me to drive it most. The overall balance of factors from fun, comfort and performance are just engaging as heck for a DD. As you say, it ticks my boxes as a DD more than any other atm. If the twins aren't fast enough for you from the factory, open your wallet and start turning wrenches. I think most of us understood that aspect of the cars appeal when we bought it.

Personally I'm not shitting on the fiesta or any muscle car. They are different animals for different tastes and needs. These versus threads to me are like people asking what they should eat for dinner: soup, steak or ice cream. I mean, really? Who can even answer that for someone else? Of course threads like this will just promote fanboys and haters trolling each other.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by Boxer486

No, CoG does great things for physics. I doubt most people that bought the car even realized what the CoG of the car was when they bought it. They enjoyed the driving feel which is directly related to CoG. Sounds like you did too.

I disagree completely objectively. The twins are very competitive even when under powered by 40-70hp while on Prius tires. Both of which can be fixed much easier than turning a Fiesta into a low CoG RWD coupe. Not to mention its physical dimensions are closer to a current production Miata than a Fiesta, Mustang, GTI, Camaro, etc, etc. That in my mind makes it special as my DD even if it's not my 'fast' car. Despite that, it's the car that begs me to drive it most. The overall balance of factors from fun, comfort and performance are just engaging as heck for a DD. As you say, it ticks my boxes as a DD more than any other atm. If the twins aren't fast enough for you from the factory, open your wallet and start turning wrenches. I think most of us understood that aspect of the cars appeal when we bought it.

Personally I'm not shitting on the fiesta or any muscle car. They are different animals for different tastes and needs. These versus threads to me are like people asking what they should eat for dinner: soup, steak or ice cream. I mean, really? Who can even answer that for someone else? Of course threads like this will just promote fanboys and haters trolling each other.

i know that cog is an important piece of data when making a car. i just dont think the cog in the frs is as impressive as its touted to be. what are you comparing the frs to when its coming out on top? what is the basis for the comparison. i use dollars and in that case its a very poor performer. personally i dont care about numbers or parts of the whole.

[Boxer486]

Originally Posted by fatoni

what are you comparing the frs to when its coming out on top? what is the basis for the comparison. i use dollars and in that case its a very poor performer. personally i dont care about numbers or parts of the whole.

Can you clarify what you are saying and asking here? I have no idea what you are trying to say. Can you also answer your own question first too since you brought it up saying it was a poor performer. I think you have the burden of proof at the moment since you made that first claim if you are wanting to go down that rabbit hole.

I find it odd that you are ripping on people that crap on the Fiesta, yet you seem to like doing just that with the twins. A car that you bought and said 'ticks all your boxes'. Excuse me if I find your line of argumentation confusing.

[Brzetto]

Originally Posted by fatoni

maybe im dumb then so please explain to me why the smart car isnt a sports car. according to your definition, it is by all accounts.

what is groundbreaking about the frs then? i think getting parts to work in conjunction and still having a warranty is going unrecognized while adapting the legacy platform to be a rwd coupe is being treated like the second coming of christ.

You said it, I didn't. Although I agree 100% that you are dumb if you thought I ever called that pos a sports car.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by Boxer486

Can you clarify what you are saying and asking here? I have no idea what you are trying to say. Can you also answer your own question first too since you brought it up saying it was a poor performer. I think you have the burden of proof at the moment since you made that first claim if you are wanting to go down that rabbit hole.

I find it odd that you are ripping on people that crap on the Fiesta, yet you seem to like doing just that with the twins. A car that you bought and said 'ticks all your boxes'. Excuse me if I find your line of argumentation confusing.

you said the frs is very competitive. i was just wondering what it is competitive with. im fairly certain its in the slower half of cars in its price range. at around 25k it is slower than things like the mustang (especially since the gt can be had for about 27k), genesis coupe, and wrx. there are probably other competitors but i dont know if there is going to be much in the way of objective data about them.

i dont mean to sound like im ripping the frs. i think its an excellent execution of cheap fun and its balanced out of the box. that doesnt make it fast though. i think its strong suit is subjective and the way the car feels is better than the feel of many faster or more expensive machines. i think people fall in love with the car and write off how slow it is based on its tires but if you look at that motortrend (?) tire review, you will see that despite making the biggest jump in tire improvement, it saw the smallest time reduction compared to the mustang or 1 series. that isnt so much a comparison im trying to draw but evidence that the tire issue isnt going to turn this thing into a rocket.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by Brzetto

You said it, I didn't. Although I agree 100% that you are dumb if you thought I ever called that pos a sports car.

will you just explain why it isnt then because according to your definition, it is a sports car.