how many miles before first oil change

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by sierra

So it's bad news when your engine oil stays clean after several thousand kms but when it turns black after a few days you can be assured that all is well.

Not really either.

The only way to determine the condition of the oil is via oil analysis.

[bluesubie]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Not really either.

The only way to determine the condition of the oil is via oil analysis.

Yes, and it's worth spending US$30 or AU$40 to debunk some of the common myths.

For our Aussie friends:

http://www.oilcheck.com.au/technical...gine-oils.html

-Dennis

[Suberman]

Originally Posted by sierra

No, you were wrong.

Impossible. Never happens.

I suppose we could disagree about what "darkens" means.

All engine oil changes colour shortly after it goes into service. This is not relevant to oil change intervals.

Heat cycling will darken engine oil. In turbo engines this is very noticeable.

[sierra]

Originally Posted by Suberman

All engine oil changes colour shortly after it goes into service.

You keep saying that and it's nonsense.

[bluesubie]

Originally Posted by sierra

You keep saying that and it's nonsense.

It's not nonsense at all. The colour of my oil changes within a few hundred miles after an oil change. If I changed it when the oil turned black, I would be doing 500-1,000 mile intervals!

And in case you missed it:

... motor oil will start looking dirty a short time after it is put to use.

Just because you haven't noticed oil getting dark/dirty/black after a short time, does not make it nonsense.

-Dennis

[sierra]

Originally Posted by bluesubie

It's not nonsense at all. The colour of my oil changes within a few hundred miles after an oil change. If I changed it when the oil turned black, I would be doing 500-1,000 mile intervals!

And in case you missed it:

Just because you haven't noticed oil getting dark/dirty/black after a short time, does not make it nonsense.

-Dennis

The statement was 'All engine oil changes colour shortly after it goes into service'.
That is simply nonsense because most of my engines have had clear oil for several thousand km's after each oil change.

[bluesubie]

Originally Posted by sierra

The statement was 'All engine oil changes colour shortly after it goes into service'.
That is simply nonsense because most of my engines have had clean oil for several thousand km's after each oil change.

Clean oil or oil that changed colour? I presume you are referring to oil that did not change color since you did not have the oil analysed to know whether it was clean or dirty.

But we seem to be going in circles so I don't know what the point is.

-Dennis

[TheLaughingMan]

This thread is stupid... look if they guy wants to change his oil every time it's not amber and thinks he can do better than the engineers at Subaru/Toyota (you know, the people who MADE the engine) in deciding when it's time to change the oil, then let him. It's his money and car, not yours.

[chas3wba0]

^As he said, you can change your oil whenever you want, but you will be wasting some perfectly good oil... just please take it to get recycled

[Suberman]

Originally Posted by sierra

The statement was 'All engine oil changes colour shortly after it goes into service'.
That is simply nonsense because most of my engines have had clear oil for several thousand km's after each oil change.

Depends on what you mean by "change colour".

Depends to some degree on the oil and additives.

In general, all engine oil darkens with heat cycling. By how much depends on what's in the oil.

The point is colour change or absence thereof is not relevant to deciding when to change it.

You can't tell by looking at the oil whether it is any good or not.

In fact, the true maximum service life of fully synthetic oil is not known. Oil change intervals are set by the manufacturer based on filter holding capacities and the probability of water contamination. The oil itself remains serviceable for very high mileages.

[imanedrn]

Originally Posted by bkblitzed

I did mine around 1500 and I had flakes and the oil was pitch black. So I would do it soon

I have free factory recommended oil changes for the first 2 years through my dealer. They suggested my first should be at 3,000 miles. But what you said, that is why I always do my first one at around 1,000 miles -- on every new car. Conventional wisdom seems to suggest all those flakes can't be good for an engine.

I read an article (Car & Driver, maybe?) in which the author said he does an initial one always at 20 miles then again at 500 miles. That seemed awfully conservative to me, but he seemed to have vast amounts of car knowledge that I do not.

[bluesubie]

Originally Posted by imanedrn

I have free factory recommended oil changes for the first 2 years through my dealer. They suggested my first should be at 3,000 miles. But what you said, that is why I always do my first one at around 1,000 miles -- on every new car. Conventional wisdom seems to suggest all those flakes can't be good for an engine.

I read an article (Car & Driver, maybe?) in which the author said he does an initial one always at 20 miles then again at 500 miles. That seemed awfully conservative to me, but he seemed to have vast amounts of car knowledge that I do not.

Any metal flakes that are in the engine are captured by the oil filter. The sparkly material that most people see in factory fill oil is usually nothing more than assembly lube. Anyone that has added Molybdenum Disulfide to their oil (Liqui Moly MoS2), which is dominant in assembly lube and the factory fill oil, can see what appears to be a sparkly material.

Used oil analyses posted here have shown that there really isn't much difference in how quickly break-in wear metals (measured in parts per million) reduce if you do several oil changes in the first few thousand miles or do only one.

People need to stop thinking that the engine manufacturing process is the same that it was 25 years ago. If Subaru and Idemitsu Lubricants thought that the factory oil (which is a more robust formula than the dealer Idemitsu oil) should be changed at any time prior to 3,750 miles, they would put it in the manual. There are many cars going 5-7,500 miles on factory fill and there is nothing wrong with that.

-Dennis

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by bluesubie

Any metal flakes that are in the engine are captured by the oil filter. The sparkly material that most people see in factory fill oil is usually nothing more than assembly lube. Anyone that has added Molybdenum Disulfide to their oil (Liqui Moly MoS2), which is dominant in assembly lube and the factory fill oil, can see what appears to be a sparkly material.

Used oil analyses posted here have shown that there really isn't much difference in how quickly break-in wear metals (measured in parts per million) reduce if you do several oil changes in the first few thousand miles or do only one.

People need to stop thinking that the engine manufacturing process is the same that it was 25 years ago. If Subaru and Idemitsu Lubricants thought that the factory oil (which is a more robust formula than the dealer Idemitsu oil) should be changed at any time prior to 3,750 miles, they would put it in the manual. There are many cars going 5-7,500 miles on factory fill and there is nothing wrong with that.

-Dennis

Sorry just need to highlight those FACTS for everyone else to read.

[Apex-Wolf]

I have to do mine at 5000 Miles for the warranty at my dealership or they can use it as an excuse if anything happens.