BRZ after Cayman S and M3... is it a downgrade? NOW WITH VIDEO!

[SuiSid3l]

Originally Posted by red bread

Not arguing with you specifically. But how would you explain things like Aston Martins which aren't faster than much cheaper cars, or even something like the WRX being quicker to 60 than the STI (due to an extra shift for the STI)? Cars aren't simply the numbers they put down at maximum performance, but the sum of their driving experience.

I'm personally comparing the BRZ to a Cayman because they're both sub 3k pounds, they're both far from over powered and they both have chain driven motors and reasonably low long term maintenance costs (I realize Porsche labor is more than Subaru, but the Cayman, especially the 987.2, has relatively few large ticket repair issues).

I understand that, I never said it never happened. I simply didnt understand why someone would get defensive when it DID outperform a car that costs half as much. It should.

[Steve]

enjoyed the video

but guise cerealously, the 86 is the dollar for dollar drivers car champion of the world

[orthojoe]

BTW, OP, great job on the video. Very impressive.

[Re~Mix]

Originally Posted by Rosso_Corsa

Since getting my BRZ about a month ago, I've been raising some eyebrows among my car enthusiast friends as to why I gave up my M3 for the Subaru and how I feel about it after owning M3, Cayman and 911.

Very well done! Thanks for solidifying my choice to never sell this car.

[Jaylyons1]

I'll have to watch this video in a bit. I was forced to give up my 08 M3 when I purchased our home which was completely disappointing since the M was the first car I have had in a long time that I really didn't want to part with.

Even though the BRZ is down on power(by more than half) it is still a fun car to drive. I do enjoy getting double the gas mileage though. I do think that the BRZ can take a turn just as well if not better than the M3 could (after ditching the stock wheels and tires of course).

I will be purchasing another M again someday but for the now BRZ definitely suits my needs better. The M3 was not only a great performing car but it had tons of extra little features that just made life easier. You never know how much you would miss the little things until they are gone!

[WingsofWar]

great feedback video @Rosso_Corsa

You gotta ask yourself "what do you mean when you say "downgrade"?". What are we grading to begin with? The Machine or the experience?

When we look at cars like the 911 and the M3 and we know, regardless if we drove it or not, that those cars have high marks as a machine and as an engaging experience.

When we talk about the machine, I truly believe that the BRZ is a big downgrade from the 911 and M3, just as i believe that the BRZ is also a downgrade from my previous cars, s14 turbo, rx7 turboII, 300zx turbo, etc..

but i never once thought the BRZ was a downgrade in the totality of the experience you get from any of the cars i mentioned, which is wizardry to me seeing as how we naturally calculate how good a car is going to feel based on performance specs. Its very magical getting that feeling of enjoyment on a car with specs that are not anywhere near boastful.

In the small amount of seat time iv had on the BRZ, its been just as engaging and rewarding as some of the top performance cars iv driven.

Downgrade? ask yourself what are you grading?

-Josh

[Longhorn248]

Great video and something that I've been wondering lately (BRZ vs. Cayman). Unfortunately I haven't had the chance yet to get any seat time in a Cayman.

[SubieNubie]

I enjoyed it as well. Seems as good if not better than some smaller scale car reviews.

[scorcherjf]

Nice video, seems professional! Do you have a camera rig for those panning shots?

Anyway you mention in the video you went to Toronto Motorsports Park but the videos show Mosport (named Canadian Tire Motorsport Park now) =)

[sc0urge]

Great video Rosso! A very humble and down-to-earth outlook on the total package of the BRZ. Loved that you pulled experience from being an M3 and Cayman owner with modest driving experience. I couldn't agree more with your comments on the interior as well-- especially with the steering wheel size (as opposed to the bloated BMW wheels) and the suuuuper outdated clock.

Pretty off-topic but what shoes are those? They seem like pretty comfortable driving shoes while not too looking too ... sporty? Also, did you do a write-up somewhere on that Toronto drive? I'm interested to read about that line up and experience!

[bestwheelbase]

@Rosso_Corsa well done!

[thill]

Very nice review Rosso Corsa! I enjoyed it. I think you really hit on the highlights of the car and why I love mine so much. As you mentioned, comparing the car to a Mazda Miata is not a bad thing

[iLuveKetchup]

While the BRZ had good steering feed back, I feel the steering is way too soft & light. I don't know if that will change with wider tires up front? The whole car (suspension, brakes, etc) felt soft to me (in stock form).

[WolfpackS2k]

Originally Posted by SuiSid3l

Still doesnt answer my question. Your comparing cars in 2 completely different price ranges and arguing why a car with 2x the MSRP has superior performance. If you want a high performance car like that of a Cayman or M3, why in the world are you comparing it to a strictly built tuner car at half the price...

yes a used M3 or Cayman can be bought in some circumstances for around the price range of a new FRS, but like you stated - If your looking to buy a car with a factory warranty.....your not getting one from a car thats 5+ years old.

I understand its a compliment to the BRZ/FRS to compare to cars that cost 2x as much and discussion is good, but you guys spent 2 pages arguing a point that makes no sense.

If your looking to buy an M3 or a Cayman S/R still under factory warranty (IE not in the 26k range)....this is honestly the last place you probably would be looking for valid comparisons in performance.

I'm confused. All I've been saying the whole time is that the BRZ IS a downgrade. That's it.