TSC VSC

[MACCAA]

Originally Posted by Walla Walla

it was not directed to me... but i live in Quebec City... we have twice the snow of montreal normaly..... and when i want to accelerate to enter the highway, on the snow... i can manage my car trying to slide and keep it straight while accelerating at a normal rate...

with aids at On, car just stop accelerating, lights flash in the dash, then suddenly i oversteer for like one second, and then the gaz seems to cut.... and, sorry, but i don't find this kind of behavior safe...

we also have something here, wich we call in french Dark Ice... the road seems on the asphalt and everything seems safe, but in reality, there is a thin layer of ice... but you can't see it... you just realise it if you give a shot of gaz..... I want to know when i drive if i should be more carefull, and not just thrust driving aids....

and also, i saw a lot of comment saying *if you think you're a hero* and * keep it to the track*... i'm sorry, but i dont remove those aids so i can drive recklessly... not more than someone who has a mustang 2002, or any kind of other RWD that don't have those aids ....

But this is the Australian thread,and we're talking about driver aids relating to our conditions.
Sure you need to turn traction control off in snow,but that ain't what we're
talking about here....
Cheers
len

[Walla Walla]

Originally Posted by MACCAA

But this is the Australian thread,and we're talking about driver aids relating to our conditions.
Sure you need to turn traction control off in snow,but that ain't what we're
talking about here....
Cheers
len

sorry, just saw the thread in New Posts, and never checked form where it was! my bad!

[MACCAA]

Originally Posted by kster

I will note 2 conditions in Brisbane where it is beneficial to leave the TSC off in the rain and on dirt roads.

E.g 1. Highway driving when it buckets down with rain where the drainage is poor on the sides off the road (Bruce highway, Ipswich motorway etc.) which can cause TSC to intrusively activate and cause loss of control.
E.g 2. Dirt roads as per above it can intrusively activate when not required which can cause loss of control.

Sorry,but that's rubbish.
No way does TSC cause "loss of control" in heavy rain or dirt roads.How????
Some of you really need to go on a good Driving course where you can find out how this stuff actually works as opposed to your misguided view of it.
And how does the above make it good to turn it off in all driving?
Like I said,in driver training the biggest problem we encounter is attitude from people who think they're invincible...and there's a fair bit of that involved here.
Cheers
Len

[ziggz501]

the traction control system is intrusive to any driver that would normally react correctly to a loss of traction. that is to say, they counter steer to get the car going the correct direction again. try counter steering with traction control on, and you will see what it is to actually lose control.

[Hawk77FT]

Originally Posted by kster

I will note 2 conditions in Brisbane where it is beneficial to leave the TSC off in the rain and on dirt roads.

E.g 1. Highway driving when it buckets down with rain where the drainage is poor on the sides off the road (Bruce highway, Ipswich motorway etc.) which can cause TSC to intrusively activate and cause loss of control.
E.g 2. Dirt roads as per above it can intrusively activate when not required which can cause loss of control.

Whaaat? Highway driving when it buckets down with rain and TSC is intrusive? Mate, have you heard of "adjust your driving to the road conditions"? When it buckets down (I have encountered this several times in NZ as well as AU) you dont go driving with 100km/h. Is like saying that in a 40km/h zone, the speed bumps are intrusive because, heck I wanna go fast! Not disregarding your driving experience, but on the highway you would have others that would drive slower so there is no point to go crazy in a cats and dogs type rain! So yes, I admit, it would be intrusive and can really cause loss of control ONLY if you drive with more than it is necessary to the road conditions.
Dirt roads, again similar situation! Unless you do a rally stage in a Carlos Sainz or Seb Loeb style then yes, they are intrusive, otherwise for normal driving (keeping it under/up to the speed limit) they should not cause any loss of control mate!

[Captain Snooze]

Originally Posted by ziggz501

the traction control system is intrusive to any driver that would normally react correctly to a loss of traction. that is to say, they counter steer to get the car going the correct direction again. try counter steering with traction control on, and you will see what it is to actually lose control.

huh? loss of traction doesn't mean the car has all of a sudden changed direction. that is a really bizarre thing to say.

[Hawk77FT]

Originally Posted by ziggz501

the traction control system is intrusive to any driver that would normally react correctly to a loss of traction. that is to say, they counter steer to get the car going the correct direction again. try counter steering with traction control on, and you will see what it is to actually lose control.

Mate, what kind of car are YOU driving? Since when the traction control changes the cars direction?

[MACCAA]

Originally Posted by ziggz501

the traction control system is intrusive to any driver that would normally react correctly to a loss of traction. that is to say, they counter steer to get the car going the correct direction again. try counter steering with traction control on, and you will see what it is to actually lose control.

Sounds like the old "when in doubt,power out" school of thought.
Loss of traction resulting in oversteerON'T power out-that's what got you in trouble in the first place!
Correct response is to come off the throttle-and that's what the VSC is mimicing-and counter steer.
Loss of traction is predominately operator error.
Couner steering with traction control on brings the vehicle back into line-that's how it works.......
A lot of the thinking here explains the pictures of cars wrapped around trees on the nightly news....
Cheers
Len

[Surok]

Some people think that their reactions are faster than that of a computer... have fun with that.

[kster]

It's definitely a matter of opinion of whether having TSC is more safer to have on or off.
As same with the argument of whether ABS is safer to have or not with braking conditions in different environments causing variable results in braking in distance although i would prefer to have this feature on during road conditions, but on a track i would prefer to have it turned off.

[eckoflyte]

Originally Posted by kster

I will note 2 conditions in Brisbane where it is beneficial to leave the TSC off in the rain and on dirt roads.

E.g 1. Highway driving when it buckets down with rain where the drainage is poor on the sides off the road (Bruce highway, Ipswich motorway etc.) which can cause TSC to intrusively activate and cause loss of control.
E.g 2. Dirt roads as per above it can intrusively activate when not required which can cause loss of control.

Lol

If u believe thats the case, why don't u just switch the aids off when it rains? And leave them on the dry? Are u also arguing that aids can be a hazard to you in the dry?

[Surok]

pretty much, people who think the driving aids like VSC and TCS are crap, turn them off,. but watch me laugh like a kookaburra at 6am when you come on here telling us you wrote the car off into a powerpole.

[kster]

I agree anybody who is inexperienced or not confidient in there ability should not turn off these safety features at all.

[Hawk77FT]

Originally Posted by kster

It's definitely a matter of opinion of whether having TSC is more safer to have on or off.

Then why almost ALL cars nowadays have them? Becasue they are a matter of opinion? I guess, Toyota and other car manufacturers have done their job by putting these in our cars. What you do afterwards, whether you wrap your car around a tree or not, is not their business. You cant go back to them and say: I have lost control because I didnt have TRC or VSC in my car.

VSC, which can actuate individual brakes to get you out of a skid/traction loss, is a very handy system for someone less experienced. Not everyone knows how to handle in a sticky situation!