Full throttle Electric Supercharger Build Thread

[fenton]

Okay so update time:

I got the new motor controller today, now it doesn't increase power or anything but it does one KEY thing.

The new motor controller has an additional sensor the reads inline between the charger and the throttle body. Once a negative pressure is detected which differs from atmospheric it kicks on the supercharger a bit(not sure how much but it doesn't even drop the charge past 28v).

This little bit makes me SOOOO happy, it hardly drains any power and the car is nice and zippy through the torque dip now as it is allowing the engine to not work as hard to suck past the stock intake and the charger.

Its a very nice gesture and Rob said it would undoubtedly give a little boost over stock without the charger as it maintains just above the atmospheric baseline and you can feel it.

The torque dip isn't a massive void like it feels stock or even with the charger. NOW I'm not saying "WOW torque dip gone", but the car just feels zippier.

Its kinda like that partial throttle boost you guys are talking about except on a smaller scale..... either way we are making progress on something that is already proving itself to be a serious competitor. Just look at this compared to the innovative, avo or fullblown kits that have been posted this week, they are all making about 200 hp.

There is lots of new developments happening and Rob is busy as a bee in his workshop testing out some new stuff! Its nice to know that i am not 100% a Guinea pig and he really does his due diligence when putting stuff out to market!

[Toma]

Originally Posted by fenton

Okay so update time:

I got the new motor controller today, now it doesn't increase power or anything but it does one KEY thing.

The new motor controller has an additional sensor the reads inline between the charger and the throttle body. Once a negative pressure is detected which differs from atmospheric it kicks on the supercharger a bit(not sure how much but it doesn't even drop the charge past 28v).

This little bit makes me SOOOO happy, it hardly drains any power and the car is nice and zippy through the torque dip now as it is allowing the engine to not work as hard to suck past the stock intake and the charger.

Its a very nice gesture and Rob said it would undoubtedly give a little boost over stock without the charger as it maintains just above the atmospheric baseline and you can feel it.

The torque dip isn't a massive void like it feels stock or even with the charger. NOW I'm not saying "WOW torque dip gone", but the car just feels zippier.

Its kinda like that partial throttle boost you guys are talking about except on a smaller scale..... either way we are making progress on something that is already proving itself to be a serious competitor. Just look at this compared to the innovative, avo or fullblown kits that have been posted this week, they are all making about 200 hp.

There is lots of new developments happening and Rob is busy as a bee in his workshop testing out some new stuff! Its nice to know that i am not 100% a Guinea pig and he really does his due diligence when putting stuff out to market!

Man, that is a wicked idea! Very nice.

[sw20kosh]

This is all very exciting and all and the thought of a twin charge setup has crossed my mind a few times

But i would dare say that you can't directly compare these to always on systems because it doesn't have the capability (yet) to be used for long periods of high "uptime" performance driving. This could be canyon runs or lap times around a road course. So for dyno runs it looks close to a twin screw or a small turbo (avo) at WOT. (The fullblown kit btw normally makes 300 whp at 8-9 psi).

It allows for fast enough charging and acceleration for street driving and drag racing and for most that's more than enough. There is definitely a market for this type of person as 90% of the people who want more power dont track their car. However I would be careful with making bold blanket statements such as "this is better than innovate/vortech/avo".

Rob did tell me that this paired with a kers system would be capable of operating in a high performance road course situation. That would be awesome.

[carbonBLUE]

Originally Posted by fenton

Okay so update time:

I got the new motor controller today, now it doesn't increase power or anything but it does one KEY thing.

The new motor controller has an additional sensor the reads inline between the charger and the throttle body. Once a negative pressure is detected which differs from atmospheric it kicks on the supercharger a bit(not sure how much but it doesn't even drop the charge past 28v).

This little bit makes me SOOOO happy, it hardly drains any power and the car is nice and zippy through the torque dip now as it is allowing the engine to not work as hard to suck past the stock intake and the charger.

Its a very nice gesture and Rob said it would undoubtedly give a little boost over stock without the charger as it maintains just above the atmospheric baseline and you can feel it.

The torque dip isn't a massive void like it feels stock or even with the charger. NOW I'm not saying "WOW torque dip gone", but the car just feels zippier.

Its kinda like that partial throttle boost you guys are talking about except on a smaller scale..... either way we are making progress on something that is already proving itself to be a serious competitor. Just look at this compared to the innovative, avo or fullblown kits that have been posted this week, they are all making about 200 hp.

There is lots of new developments happening and Rob is busy as a bee in his workshop testing out some new stuff! Its nice to know that i am not 100% a Guinea pig and he really does his due diligence when putting stuff out to market!

Originally Posted by sw20kosh

This is all very exciting and all and the thought of a twin charge setup has crossed my mind a few times

But i would dare say that you can't directly compare these to always on systems because it doesn't have the capability (yet) to be used for long periods of high "uptime" performance driving. This could be canyon runs or lap times around a road course. So for dyno runs it looks close to a twin screw or a small turbo (avo) at WOT. (The fullblown kit btw normally makes 300 whp at 8-9 psi).

It allows for fast enough charging and acceleration for street driving and drag racing and for most that's more than enough. There is definitely a market for this type of person as 90% of the people who want more power dont track their car. However I would be careful with making bold blanket statements such as "this is better than innovate/vortech/avo".

Rob did tell me that this paired with a kers system would be capable of operating in a high performance road course situation. That would be awesome.

is the system an AC or DC unit? possible to use a turbo with this system and when the turbo kicks in past 3k-4k rpms the electric supercharger would send a current back to recharge the system? use the motor as a generator instead of a motor food for thought

[ft_sjo]

They're multi-pole brushless motors.. you can drive them with phased DC or AC.. I suspect the former for this application.

[fenton]

Originally Posted by sw20kosh

This is all very exciting and all and the thought of a twin charge setup has crossed my mind a few times

But i would dare say that you can't directly compare these to always on systems because it doesn't have the capability (yet) to be used for long periods of high "uptime" performance driving. This could be canyon runs or lap times around a road course. So for dyno runs it looks close to a twin screw or a small turbo (avo) at WOT. (The fullblown kit btw normally makes 300 whp at 8-9 psi).

It allows for fast enough charging and acceleration for street driving and drag racing and for most that's more than enough. There is definitely a market for this type of person as 90% of the people who want more power dont track their car. However I would be careful with making bold blanket statements such as "this is better than innovate/vortech/avo".

Rob did tell me that this paired with a kers system would be capable of operating in a high performance road course situation. That would be awesome.

I agree 100 percent but the system is going to come in a 1/2 to 1/3 the price of those kits. Plus install can be done in minutes not days.

It's all win for people that want street performance which is why in my first post I said it wasn't meant to compete with full time FI.

That fact that we are almost there in performance for 90 percent of users is very exciting!

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk 4 Beta

[Gixxersixxerman]

My next question is... Is there a time frame on production?? Is this going to be a prototype thing for the next 8 months?? I'd really like to test this at the streets of willow, just to see how long it would last.. As hot as it is lately we only get 4-5 great laps in any way before the tires are greased..

I really like this idea, looks like its a viable option and hope it continues going in the right direction..

[Wild Weasel]

Originally Posted by sw20kosh

This is all very exciting and all and the thought of a twin charge setup has crossed my mind a few times

Pfft. Been there... done that... :happy0180:

Originally Posted by carbonBLUE

the electric supercharger would send a current back to recharge the system? use the motor as a generator instead of a motor food for thought

The only way the blower itself could ever reverse current would be if the airflow could turn the compressor wheel with some degree of force, and I just don't see this as being possible. As mentioned before though... the charge times just aren't an issue for even the most aggressive street driving.

[Robftss]

[QUOTE=Tromatic;1044538]Tune that sucker for max torque as low in the rev range as you can, please.


Well, if you look at Wild Weasels logs, he hit full boost @1700 rpm (with one set up it hit 10 psi!). That car has a GM flash tune and a 2 BAR MAP, so it is possible.

[nonicname]

fenton, any chance you can find someone with a fully stock FRS so you can race from a stand and measure how much of a difference it is?
after tuning of course.

[fenton]

Originally Posted by nonicname

fenton, any chance you can find someone with a fully stock FRS so you can race from a stand and measure how much of a difference it is?
after tuning of course.

Measuring from a stand doesn't do AS much good because it rely's on shifting and launch.

I know what you are saying but a roll from 2nd or 1st even takes alot more of the variables.

Ill see what i can do i don't know anybody that is stock currently.

[s2d4]

Anyone looked into protescap miniature brushless DC motors?

Handles up to 100,000 rpm....
The one I saw was 40mA at 48 volts and 85000rpm for 30 minutes..

Another thing is instead of using DOL, although crude, why not use a banked setup of throttle positions to allow a soft starter application?
That way, you can control the wear on the motors, bearings and however it links/couples to the compressor turbine.
Of course the best setup would still be using tps/rpm/map controller but that ain't so bad for a DIY job.

[sw20kosh]

Originally Posted by Wild Weasel

Pfft. Been there... done that... :happy0180:

And would you ever do it again? Was it a win win situation or a headache of complexity and tuning?

I was thinking/dreaming of using it on the road course with my twin screw but not with a WOT switch as it would deplete too quickly but with a thumb switch on the steering wheel to give it some extra power when necessary like after a hairpin that drops revs to 3-4k or down a straight away. It would be an electrical NOS system lol.

Now the last thing to consider is weight. Has anyone determined the exact weight of the whole system?

[mid_life_crisis]

[quote=Robftss;1045146]

Originally Posted by Tromatic

Tune that sucker for max torque as low in the rev range as you can, please.


Well, if you look at Wild Weasels logs, he hit full boost @1700 rpm (with one set up it hit 10 psi!). That car has a GM flash tune and a 2 BAR MAP, so it is possible.

That was running in series with his main blower. They seemed to work in a way that was synergistic. That is, together they were better than the sum of the individual blowers, if I recall correctly.