Tires 2016?

[wparsons]

Originally Posted by Sleepless

AD08 being faster?

Definitely slower, they're barely comparable to an RS3 v2.

Originally Posted by rallysrt

a single fast lap is all the re-71r is good for though. I'd strongly recommend against using them for a track day tire

Not entirely true... they hold up great for time attack format (warm up lap, 3 hot laps, cool down lap). They won't give you 20 minutes of hot laps without overheating, but if you're running that format you're probably not in the market for an RE71R anyway. You'd be much happier with a durable R compound like an NT01, RA1, etc. Not the fastest possible tires, but they'll last a long time and be super predictable through longer sessions.

[Sleepless]

I realized I forgot to add the R to AD08R above. So, I just want to confirm that for track days, the RE71R is faster and as consistent as the AD08R. The AD08R has been my favorite "street" tire so far. The last RE11s were definitely slower and the Z2 Star Spec seem between the RE11s and the AD08R. When the Z2SS wear out, I want to go with the AD08R or the RE71R.

Thx

[Biggins]

Originally Posted by Sleepless

I realized I forgot to add the R to AD08R above. So, I just want to confirm that for track days, the RE71R is faster and as consistent as the AD08R. The AD08R has been my favorite "street" tire so far. The last RE11s were definitely slower and the Z2 Star Spec seem between the RE11s and the AD08R. When the Z2SS wear out, I want to go with the AD08R or the RE71R.

I'd stick with the AD08R if I were in your scenario or even move up to an R-comp like the NT01 or Toyo. I'm only an autocrosser now, but the AD08R is easily my favorite street tire too. The RE71R has much better grip, but I've found it to get too hot too fast when running any more than 2-3 autocross runs back-to-back. I can imagine it would get too hot on track if you were running long sessions. I'm sure it would be a great track tire, but I suspect the AD08R will last longer and only be slightly slower on the first lap or two...

[wparsons]

Originally Posted by Sleepless

I realized I forgot to add the R to AD08R above. So, I just want to confirm that for track days, the RE71R is faster and as consistent as the AD08R. The AD08R has been my favorite "street" tire so far. The last RE11s were definitely slower and the Z2 Star Spec seem between the RE11s and the AD08R. When the Z2SS wear out, I want to go with the AD08R or the RE71R.

Thx

Are you competing, or just lapping for fun? If you're just lapping for fun, don't get the RE71R's. I would suggest RS3's. They're cheap, have good grip and last decently. Last time I picked up tires the price difference between RS3's and ZIISS was $450 for a set, with the RS3's being $810 taxes in/mounted.

*edit - those prices are Canadian, before the dollar tanked.

[Sleepless]

Originally Posted by wparsons

Are you competing, or just lapping for fun? If you're just lapping for fun, don't get the RE71R's.

Lapping for fun == competing When was the last time any serious lapper is not competing at some level.

But, to the point, I have several priorities for street track tires :

- Good in the rain on and off the track
- Reasonably quiet off the track. NT01 loudness get old on a multi hour trip to a track
- Grip consistency through out the tire life time and through out a session; even on hot days
- Given the above, best grip possible

Notice that price nor wear are priorities.

So far, the AD08R has been the hands down winner. So, its either going to be the AD08R or the RE71R.

[rallysrt]

I'm surprised you guys are getting 3 decent hot laps out of the re71r. If I don't nail the first lap with these tires, there's no way that I'm getting a good time on lap #2.
My routine all season has been to do a 3/4 of a lap warmup, 1 flat out hot lap, come into the pits to cool down the front tires, then go back out for 1 more hot lap at the end of the session.
The lap times have been great, but for most people it would be more fun to run full sessions chasing down faster cars.

[wparsons]

Originally Posted by Sleepless

Lapping for fun == competing When was the last time any serious lapper is not competing at some level.

But, to the point, I have several priorities for street track tires :

- Good in the rain on and off the track
- Reasonably quiet off the track. NT01 loudness get old on a multi hour trip to a track
- Grip consistency through out the tire life time and through out a session; even on hot days
- Given the above, best grip possible

Notice that price nor wear are priorities.

So far, the AD08R has been the hands down winner. So, its either going to be the AD08R or the RE71R.

The difference between lapping and competing is generally session length. If you want 20 minutes of hot laps, none of the current fastest street tires will hold up to that.

From what I've heard, AD08R's fall off pretty bad in grip after enough heat cycles, long before they're out of tread depth. I know a couple people that found a 0.2G difference in peak grip after a few events, with tons of tread left. The data was compared to other cars on different tires at the same events, so the variable of weather and track surface are effectively removed.

How long do you expect the tires to last? How many lapping days are you running, and how much street driving?

RE71R's will probably not be long enough lasting for most people if they're driving them on the street too. I got about a full summer, with about a dozen track days out of my RS3's (RS3 v2, 225/45/17's), and daily street driving.

Another thing to keep in mind is how the tire feels and responds. The RE71R's are like the RS3's in that they like a bit of slip and have softer sidewalls (need more camber). AD08R's are more like ZII's in that they don't like to slip as much for max grip, and will require less camber with the stiffer sidewalls. You'll get better steering feel from the stiffer sidewalls, but if your driving style likes more slip angle, you'll be disappointed.

Originally Posted by rallysrt

I'm surprised you guys are getting 3 decent hot laps out of the re71r. If I don't nail the first lap with these tires, there's no way that I'm getting a good time on lap #2.
My routine all season has been to do a 3/4 of a lap warmup, 1 flat out hot lap, come into the pits to cool down the front tires, then go back out for 1 more hot lap at the end of the session.
The lap times have been great, but for most people it would be more fun to run full sessions chasing down faster cars.

It sounds like you're running too narrow of tires, have a bad alignment, or are simply over driving the front end. If you're only overheating the fronts, I would lean towards alignment or over driving (or both).

[Sleepless]

Originally Posted by wparsons

The difference between lapping and competing is generally session length. If you want 20 minutes of hot laps, none of the current fastest street tires will hold up to that.

From what I've heard, AD08R's fall off pretty bad in grip after enough heat cycles, long before they're out of tread depth. I know a couple people that found a 0.2G difference in peak grip after a few events, with tons of tread left. The data was compared to other cars on different tires at the same events, so the variable of weather and track surface are effectively removed.

Hmmm, this is pretty much counter to my experience with AD08Rs and fast street tires (RE11, Z2SS).

I've been driving on track for 15 years (20+ events per year) and until last year, I mostly drove on NT01s at the track. I decided to see how the fast street tires would hold up and find them to be just fine. I drive the car at the limit so the tires are not babied by any means. The street tires are about 2 sec slower than the NT01s but since there are no trophies to be won, I like the convenience of not having to swap wheels and I find the lower grip to be both entertaining and educational.

The tires have lasted about 9 track days with no noticeable grip fall off over their life (but I'm not competing so if they fall off by a tenth or two, I would not notice).

I've spoken to others that I've met at the track that drive on the AD08Rs and so far, everyone has had the same experience.

Anyway, looks like I'll just have to try the RE71s to see for myself. Thx

[wparsons]

By the fastest street tires I meant RE71R's and Rival-S. They're both at least a second per lap faster than ZIISS, RS3v2, AD08R, etc.

NT01's shouldn't be any faster than an RS3 or AD08R, unless you're measuring time on the 10th lap, and definitely aren't faster than an RE71R.

[Deep Six]

Hard to believe an RE 71 is only good for one hot lap when we can get an entire 14 hour endurance race done with one set of RE 11's. Are they really that different?

[wparsons]

Originally Posted by Deep Six

Hard to believe an RE 71 is only good for one hot lap when we can get an entire 14 hour endurance race done with one set of RE 11's. Are they really that different?

Short answer, yes. Seconds per lap faster than an RE11.

I've seen a few people get 3 hot laps easily out of them, even on heavyish cars (corvettes).

[BRZZZZZZZZZZ]

Originally Posted by jjaisli

Is there anybody who's run both the RE-71R and the Dunlop Z2 who can offer a general side by side comparison?

I can.

I ran Z2 on my BRZ and have fresh RE71R on my S2000 now. The RE71R have about half the life of the Z2 for both street driving and auto x. The RE71R have softer sidewalls and require higher pressures than the Z2 in my experiences. The RE71R have more grip and less squeal much like a R comp compared to the Z2. The RE71R grease much quicker and don't seem to hold up to heat nearly as well as the Z2.

I will probably continue to use the 71Rs for auto x and get another set of Z2 or something else for lapping for 2016.