BRZ vs Old 911

[jeepmor]

Do what you want. I bought the FR-S and love it and passed on the Porsche dream. I bought it because if I buy an old Porsche I'm paying more for parts and service. I'm tinkering more, and generally spending a lot of time on the car. And, a front engine RWD car is simply a better basic design. When the back end does give, it's more drastic. As a new 25k miata twin for all intents and purposes, and a hard top, I'll take it.

Rear view is legitimate issue. But the bolt on improvements are nearly endless, already, after only 2 years. There are too many options for the platform to turn away from it in my opinion.

That may be the same opinion of Porsche guys who know that aftermarket, I do not. My ultimate dream cars as a kid were the 959 Porshce and the MK4 Supra.

I see the 86 platform as the new sports car to stay. Much like the 911.

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by jeepmor

Do what you want. I bought the FR-S and love it and passed on the Porsche dream. I bought it because if I buy an old Porsche I'm paying more for parts and service. I'm tinkering more, and generally spending a lot of time on the car.

Agree completely. If you've got a lot of time to work on cars, an old Porsche would be great (and I'd be jealous).

But I work long hours, have a wife/house to take care of, and like to go to the track on the weekends, so reliability is critical. I don't have time to spend chasing down issues on a car. I've seen too many guys at the track with old cars that break down. I realized with what little time I have, I'd rather be on the track driving then under my car wrenching. About all I've got time for these days are changing brake pads and swapping wheels for the track.

Everyone's in a different situation though, and I'm definitely envious of guys who have time to wrench (and drive) their old Porsches.

[WolfpackS2k]

I say get the 911. You have the opportunity to do it now, while some air cooled 911s are still affordable. Strike while the iron is hot! If it doesn't work out you can always come back to a BRZ - that's the luxury of a car that is still in production.

I made the switch to a Cayman and don't regret it one bit. I thoroughly enjoyed my BRZ and thought it was an attractive automobile. But I very rarely parked her in the garage and then just stood around staring at her. I find myself staring at my Porsche all the time after a drive

Also, that 993 on the first page is gorgeous! The 993 will always be the zenith of 911 hierarchy to me.

[synchromesh]

I hate the fact that if the 993 continues to appreciate I just might be priced out. Man, those are really hard to find.


Ulrich Bez for governor! j/k. His book was a pretty good speed read nonetheless!

[WolfpackS2k]

Yeah I would have purchased one if I had the money. Will I ever? At this point who knows.

[spitz]

Ganthrithor -

I have a friend selling a clean blue plate California 1982 911 SC w/ a rebuilt 915 Transmission, and had the head gone through about 20k miles ago. Fuel system also gone through recently, so no starting issues.

Asking price is around $23k. It is a beautiful off-white. Not concours, but very good paint. Interior is mocha colored. PM me if you are interested and I'll facilitate a convo between you two.

Originally Posted by Ganthrithor

I just got a quote from Progressive with parameters as close as possible to the ones I specified when I got the quote for my BRZ. However, even if I went with a specialty, agreed-value policy, I assume the premium should still be lower than it is for the BRZ since the car is worth ten grand less.

The policy I currently have for my BRZ is an agreed-value policy based on the value of my car + mods. IIRC my quote from Progressive was $1800/yr for normal insurance with the same general coverage. Insurance also seems to be expensive in California... the Progressive premium I was quoted here was $400/yr more than the premium I was paying Progressive for the same car + driver in Denver, IIRC. You'd think that between getting real weather and living in a worse neighborhood that the insurance would have cost more in CO, but you'd be wrong. Maybe it's because California is full of nicer cars to hit: particularly this town... I see more nice cars in a ten minute drive down the road here than I used to see in a month driving around Denver. In Denver it was rare to see anything worth over $100k on the roads, here there are Ferrari 250 California's at cars + coffee. The other week in Monterey I saw a 250 GTO just cruising down the highway. NBD: just taking my fifty-million-dollar car down to the shops. California is unreal.

[mad_sb]

Originally Posted by Ganthrithor

Just pulled a quick insurance quote from Progressive's site and discovered that my insurance premium for an SC would be less than half what I'm paying for the BRZ. Granted, I have a better policy for the BRZ from a different provider, but it's still $600/yr less than what Progressive quoted me for the BRZ. I find this pretty funny given that the Porsche has the same power to weight ratio as the BRZ, the same seat count as the BRZ, is notoriously difficult to drive, has no driver aids, and is way more likely to be a writeoff if it's involved in any kind of accident... insurance is not intuitive.

In fact, here's a costs estimate I cooked up. I used the standard 15%/yr depreciation for the BRZ (which I personally think is quite conservative... I bet the BRZ doesn't depreciate quite as quickly as your average car), while leaving the Porsche at zero (which is also conservative... I suspect there would probably be some light appreciation going on). I left a $400/yr maintenance budget for the BRZ to cover wear parts that aren't warrantied... oil changes, pads, etc. The $1,200 per year on the Porsche is based on how much I recall my dad saying it cost to maintain his 993, and obviously only budgets for regular maintenance, not including the possibility of something expensive unexpectedly self-destructing.



The Porsche keeps looking less and less crazy.

On the other hand, I took my BRZ out for a quick blast through the foothills today when I went to get lunch... I do love this car. I'm sure the 911 wouldn't out-perform it (not that I really care: feel matters a lot more to me than performance). I'm not sure the 911 would be a whole lot more fun to drive... it would mostly be a change of character than a different quantity of fun, I think. The 911 would just be a more entertaining place to sit when just cruising around-- better smells and sounds, more mid-range torque, etc-- but the BRZ is just stupidly fun whenever you can wind is up a bit.

I think I'll at least try and go look at + test drive this SC. I almost hope I don't like it, because if I do it's going to be really hard to make a decision.

That is assuming that 911 were nearly brand new... On any vehicle that age your are going to be replacing a LOT of parts to get it up to the point that it only needs $1,200 per year to maintain. IMO anyway. Been there, done that, doing it again right now with a 1990 4runner.

[robwbright]

Originally Posted by Ganthrithor

Just pulled a quick insurance quote from Progressive's site and discovered that my insurance premium for an SC would be less than half what I'm paying for the BRZ. Granted, I have a better policy for the BRZ from a different provider, but it's still $600/yr less than what Progressive quoted me for the BRZ.

Good golly. My BRZ is less than $55/month for full coverage insurance. California rates, apparently.

[stugray]

For the best of both worlds, build yourself a porsche 914-6 GT replica.
Then put the BRZ engine in it.

Then you would have a Porsche, that is midengine, targa, and could eat most 911s for lunch.

[WolfpackS2k]

Except it would also be pretty ugly.

Robwbright, insurance for my Cayman is less than my BRZ.

[stugray]

Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k

Except it would also be pretty ugly.

Robwbright, insurance for my Cayman is less than my BRZ.

yeah... ugly.....

[Apex_BRZ]

That 914 is amazing. Very nice. I would drive that any day.

[Ganthrithor]

If I was older and had a garage of my own where I could keep several cars, I might have a 914 as a fun toy. Trouble is most of them had the 2L flat-fours (no six-sound) and they're utter rust buckets.

They're the first Porsche I ever got to ride in, though! My mom used to have one when I was a tiny kid. I think it was even the same blue as the one in the picture above. She actually gave it away when I was 11 or 12 or something. I still wish she'd hung onto it until I was old enough to learn to drive, but we were living down next to the ocean back then and the salt air was beginning to make the car rust, so she sent it off to live somewhere where it wouldn't fall apart :\

[Atropine]

Originally Posted by Purdue FR-S

^This


I've been having the same argument over cars I want to own. They're older, less reliable, but appreciating in value instead of the other way around. I realize this and then wonder why I'm babying something that continues to fall in value. Recently I've been considering if I could have as much fun (in the FR-S) as I would in a $5k miata, and sock away cash until I can find "the one".

Best of luck and let us know what you end up deciding!

I picked up my Grandfather's 1991 BRG NA Miata and it led me into trading in the BRZ.

I loved the BRZ and I can echo what you said about a 5k Miata being just as much fun or almost as much fun.

I have owned a Boxster S an NA AW-11 MR2 and a S/C AW-11 MR2.

MR is really nice...I plan on keeping my 4Runner as my DD...especially for bad weather. The Miata will remain my toy...and eventually once I have a 3-4 car garage I will look into a 3rd Car...thinking an Old Porsche or maybe Lotus...