BRZ vs BRZ STi

[2fast4you]

Originally Posted by lfawishes

Don't want to start an argument but go look at cars like the sti/evo etc.. stopping cold from 70-0, 100-0 and see how they stop better than many ferraris and porsches.

It proves my point, doesn't it? STI/Evo brakes are small compared to Ferrari and some Porsches.

I don't subscribe to this, I track my car and I luckily stopped my 100 mile a day commute. Big brakes indeed do help for regular driving, especially vs. subarus generally poor brakes, and do add safety and improved stopping distances.

It depends on what you drive, but generally, and with all things being equal, BBK will not stop quicker than stock. I have a difficult time finding the link, but StopTech has a few white papers that give an in-depth explanation why. That said, I can tell you from my own testing using Carbotech AX6 brake pads, Motul RBF600, and SS lines my tC has the same 60-0 stopping distance with stock brakes as it does with my current Wilwood BBK.

[serialk11r]

So to the person who said you'd need 300hp to sell >30k, Honda S2000? Maybe it was a bit overpriced but if it was say 30k msrp that would be a killer deal.

On that note, if they use lighter valves (maybe hollow stem?), slightly bored out, slightly longer rods (probably needs a smaller stroke and crank to make this work), to give this car say 240hp stock with better response due to lower rotating mass, and then do a composite (not CF, I wouldn't want to waste so much money, hopefully like GRP or something easy to replace) trunk, quarterpanels, roof, and hood, well engineered spoiler, a true rear diffuser that is not blocked by the muffler and suspension (please make the rear bumper longer for better aerodynamics if you must...function over form!), to cut weight down to say 2600, that would be a pretty strong sell at 30k IMO. Not the brute force of a 370Z or Mustang, but a lot of careful, good engineering.

Oh and I hope they don't do something stupid like bump the final drive up like crazy the way they did on the WRX STI. No one needs gears that short. If they use a higher primary reduction, then the 6th gear better keep at least the same rpms, because I for one do not want to hear a loud engine droning at a mere 60mph (and burning a ton of fuel).

Oh and a slightly lower ride height stock might be a good idea for them, considering how nearly everyone finds the giant wheel gaps hideous. Basically, sell to the public what most enthusiasts want to do to their car anyways, plus a tad bit more power. A car that is what the magazines and overly optimistic people hoped the BRZ could be, but couldn't because of price point.

[switchlanez]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

Basically, sell to the public what most enthusiasts want to do to their car anyways, plus a tad bit more power. A car that is what the magazines and overly optimistic people hoped the BRZ could be, but couldn't because of price point.

[AZP Installs]

The weight of an sti version will not be significantly heavier than the NA version in my opinion.

The larger brakes will be heavier but the calipers will be lighter (AL) v. Steel. So it will be a wash.

Forced induction will be there if it is an sti version. 2.0T putting out 300hp is my bet.

-mike



11+ Years Maintaining, Modifying and Educating TriState Subaru Enthusiasts.
Call directly as We carry almost every manufacturer now, so before you buy parts call us.
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[switchlanez]

Originally Posted by AZP Installs

Forced induction will be there if it is an sti version. 2.0T putting out 300hp is my bet.

In first for the

[Subaruwrxfan]

Subaru reps repeatedly said there will NEVER be a turbo version of this car. Subaru came out with the Impreza "tuned by STI" in Japan about 2 years ago, just had suspension mods, bigger brakes, lighter weight and special colors and rims, still N/A. That's what we're likely to see if they even bother to make an STI version. Brakes will be handled by the aftermarket, not enough reason to buy a new car. Only way I would buy an STI version is if the car had things that the aftermarket can't do, like:
Find a way to squeeze another 30-50hp out of the N/A motor with better internals
Raise the redline to 9k
Carbon Fiber roof

[delongedoug]

Originally Posted by switchlanez

^Rather than trolling why don't you say something intelligible and edumacate me. I've never done extensive research nor bought aftermarket brakes before. My only experience is that the G35 was the heaviest car I ever owned but had the best consistent stopping power I ever felt. So flame my enthusiasm.

Why would you make a claim that bigger brakes make a huge difference for everyday safety if you've never bought aftermarket brakes before? Brazenly making stuff up based on a "bigger brakes = stop faster" theory?

The only time I would consider upgrading the BRZ calipers is if I was actually racing. I mean beyond HPDE duty. Even then, you're up against the mercy of class rules. Pads, fluid, lines and you'll be at the limit and saving $5k.

[switchlanez]

^If you read one of my earlier posts I admitted my intent was to say "better" brakes, not "bigger" brakes. You came back a bit late to the party. Constructive discussion has already settled w/ non-trollers.

I have no interest in an aftermarket BBK. Only interested in what the STI package entails and there's no reason upgraded brakes alone will add $5k to that package.

[OrbitalEllipses]

Originally Posted by AZP Installs

The larger brakes will be heavier but the calipers will be lighter (AL) v. Steel. So it will be a wash.

The weight increase from sliders to fixed brakes is the rotor. For instance, the WRX has (or at least mine does) 290mm front discs with steel 2pot sliders whilst the STI has 328mm discs with aluminum 4pot fixed calipers. The difference between calipers is negligible while the difference between discs is substantial. Big brakes always weigh more. Furthermore, aluminum fixed calipers are not always better than steel fixed calipers. Aluminum calipers sometimes flex under pressure (I believe Nissan had this problem on their AL 4pots units on the Z32TT back in the 90s).

Originally Posted by lfawishes

It depends on what you start with and how high speed of tracks you run I guess. I'll agree good stock brakes with good pads/lines/fluid can be great, but many cars like the wrxs at least till 2006 had just awful brakes that are improved, and many cars are the same. Plus pads/lines/fluid=not cheap.

In 2008 the WRX went back to sliders. Only the 2006/7 models got the fixed 4/2pot units.

For most users an aggressive street pad, higher temp fluid, and lines (arguable) will be enough. Won't stop the BBK bling-bling crowd from buying them though.

[Nardi330]

Detailed speedhunters article on BRZ STI:

http://speedhunters.com/archive/2012...i-concept.aspx

[serialk11r]

Thanks, but that basically shows that it was just a quickly thrown together "concept"...CF panels, modified suspension, STI painted everywhere. If you want that, you can just buy carbon fiber texture 3m film, and lots of STI stickers, and some shocks for pretty little money.

The real one better have some actual stuff.

The problem I see with lightweight body panels is possibly high cost of repair. But if they can give fiberglass all around, that would be pretty cool.

[brufleth]

Originally Posted by lfawishes

Didn't only the tr editions get those brakes? the red calipers. I agree those are plenty for most. I believe most wrx's were equipped with the same as 2004/2005 which are terrible.

2007 WRX has the upgraded brakes. I believe the 06 WRX did too.

[AZP Installs]

Originally Posted by Subaruwrxfan

Subaru reps repeatedly said there will NEVER be a turbo version of this car. Subaru came out with the Impreza "tuned by STI" in Japan about 2 years ago, just had suspension mods, bigger brakes, lighter weight and special colors and rims, still N/A. That's what we're likely to see if they even bother to make an STI version. Brakes will be handled by the aftermarket, not enough reason to buy a new car. Only way I would buy an STI version is if the car had things that the aftermarket can't do, like:
Find a way to squeeze another 30-50hp out of the N/A motor with better internals
Raise the redline to 9k
Carbon Fiber roof

I have pretty good contacts that assure me forced induction is coming....

-mike


11+ Years Maintaining, Modifying and Educating TriState Subaru Enthusiasts.
Call directly as We carry almost every manufacturer now, so before you buy parts call us.
AIM: AZP Installs | E-mail: paisan@azpinstalls.com | 725 Fairfield Ave | Kenilworth, NJ 07033 | 908.248.AZP1 (2971) | T-1 Certified Amsoil Direct Jobber
"Race Tested, Enthusiast Approved!"

[AZP Installs]

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

The weight increase from sliders to fixed brakes is the rotor. For instance, the WRX has (or at least mine does) 290mm front discs with steel 2pot sliders whilst the STI has 328mm discs with aluminum 4pot fixed calipers. The difference between calipers is negligible while the difference between discs is substantial. Big brakes always weigh more. Furthermore, aluminum fixed calipers are not always better than steel fixed calipers. Aluminum calipers sometimes flex under pressure (I believe Nissan had this problem on their AL 4pots units on the Z32TT back in the 90s).



In 2008 the WRX went back to sliders. Only the 2006/7 models got the fixed 4/2pot units.

For most users an aggressive street pad, higher temp fluid, and lines (arguable) will be enough. Won't stop the BBK bling-bling crowd from buying them though.

Agreed. We almost never suggest a bbk to our customers right off the hop. Instead we suggest lines, fluid, and good pads. Most track noobs are not at a level where they need more than that.

-mike


11+ Years Maintaining, Modifying and Educating TriState Subaru Enthusiasts.
Call directly as We carry almost every manufacturer now, so before you buy parts call us.
AIM: AZP Installs | E-mail: paisan@azpinstalls.com | 725 Fairfield Ave | Kenilworth, NJ 07033 | 908.248.AZP1 (2971) | T-1 Certified Amsoil Direct Jobber
"Race Tested, Enthusiast Approved!"