Toyota and BMW Partner for sports car and EV technology

[SeattleJeremy]

BMW 6 Series platform Toyota Supra. Make it happen guys.

[eriktherod]

Originally Posted by wu_dot_com

i just hope toyota dont shoot them self in the foot again by branding it a Scion. we all know that Scion dont have high-end or quality cars.

Trust me, I never liked the Scion brand itself especially the tC (it's a Honda/Si thing). But I couldn't knock them on reliability and resale value, people have been getting good money on their trade-ins and Scion has been rated pretty highly in reliability in the past years.

That being said, the Toyota brand is pretty boring now. Even the Toyota engineers and execs have admitted it (look at the Wheels magazine feature) and trying to do something about it. The only 'Toyota' I would even consider is the new Camry SE black on black leather with the BBS tires and LED fogs. That think looks pretty sick and luxury inside.

Lexus is their high-end brand and that's not going to change anytime soon.

That being said, I've been on the fence on rebadging my FR-S and I think I'm going to do it next month. Even if I can't replace the Scion part on the steering wheel, I'll still do the wheel caps and front/rear emblems along with taking off 'FR-S'.

[wu_dot_com]

Originally Posted by SeattleJeremy

BMW 6 Series platform Toyota Supra. Make it happen guys.

fuk that, bring back the old M1 or 8 series.... now that sh!t is beautiful.

[Skyhound]

Originally Posted by EsoBOFH

this is all about fuel cell tech... which is unfortunate. BMW went down the road of Hydrogen internal combustion for along time, and they seem to be just dropping it now in favour of fuel cell technology.

BMWs work on the hydrogen internal combustion engine gave me hope for the future.. a future where we'd still have the sporty sounding, heart pumping cars that were fast, loud *and* eco friendly.. cars that we could mod with exhausts, intakes etc.. and still be all about the environment.

Sounds like that aint going to happen now.. pretty soon we'll all be stuck behind the wheel of an electric go kart... ugh.

I get where you're coming from, but I don't think it's as bad as you're making it out to be. The Tesla Roadster is a beautiful car and sounds like a jet as you're accelerating.

You call it an electric go kart, I call it one step closer to flying cars.

[Asterisked Accolade]

Originally Posted by Billy2224

sooo after hearing this, i think our next Supra might just be co-developed with BMW. That is super exciting and highly likely.
IF not, i guess we could be expecting another super sports car ontop of the Supra and 86/FRS, which fits Toyota's goal of 3 sports cars in their line up

Why exactly is that highly likely? I understand Toyota may be embracing BMW's sports car talent-- but Toyota had talent enough to make the Supra great on their own before, why does their collaboration equal a likely Supra? I feel like i may be missing something-- or i'm too cynical on the matter.

[madfast]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

HSD would be a bit strange to see in a BMW which usually has some attempt at sporting intentions. If they cooperate on this stuff that would be interesting to see.

i dont think HSD will ever grace a BMW, but i do believe that toyota's early adoption of hybrids has lead them to hoard a bunch of key patents. for example ford has to pay toyota licensing fees of some sort, in order to use their HSD based hybrid system.

off topic: Speaking of hybrids, FHI is producing lithium hybrid supercapacitors, and I have this hunch Subaru might be the first to bring out ultracapacitor based hybrids. Hybrids whose batteries don't wear out after a few years!

well being that toyota owns part of FHI, and the TS030 uses supercapacitors, im sure toyota will be the first...

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by madfast

well being that toyota owns part of FHI, and the TS030 uses supercapacitors, im sure toyota will be the first...

Well, Subaru is shooting for mild hybrids and light weight, so I think they'll be first but whatever.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium-ion_capacitor

The article says FDK's mass produced lithium ultracapacitors are 14 W*h/kg, which is 14*3.6kJ/kg or 50.4 kJ/kg=0.05MJ/kg. This sounds really pathetic, until you consider 10kg is 504kJ. 1/2*1200kg*(30m/s)^2=540kJ. For reference, 30m/s is 67mph. If you try to Ebay ultracapacitors or google some suppliers, the only ones I could find at least were like 5 times worse in terms of energy density. Anyways, enough energy to get from 0 to 60 in a BRZ in something 2/3 the weight of the stock lead acid battery is pretty good, not to mention the huge number of cycles they can survive and being able to be fully discharged and charged in seconds. And these are only the beginning, the newer ones have like 3 times more energy density. I like this kind of technology

[madfast]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

Well, Subaru is shooting for mild hybrids and light weight, so I think they'll be first but whatever.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium-ion_capacitor

The article says FDK's mass produced lithium ultracapacitors are 14 W*h/kg, which is 14*3.6kJ/kg or 50.4 kJ/kg=0.05MJ/kg. This sounds really pathetic, until you consider 10kg is 504kJ. 1/2*1200kg*(30m/s)^2=540kJ. For reference, 30m/s is 67mph. If you try to Ebay ultracapacitors or google some suppliers, the only ones I could find at least were like 5 times worse in terms of energy density. Anyways, enough energy to get from 0 to 60 in a BRZ in something 2/3 the weight of the stock lead acid battery is pretty good, not to mention the huge number of cycles they can survive and being able to be fully discharged and charged in seconds. And these are only the beginning, the newer ones have like 3 times more energy density. I like this kind of technology

mild hybrids? good luck subaru...

imo they are SO far behind in hybrid tech its not funny. unless of course everything is behind the scenes and they somehow come out with revolutionary stuff seemingly outta nowhere... but again, toyota owns like 15% of FHI or something like that. if FHI has such cool tech, toyota may use it for themselves....

[serialk11r]

Mild hybrid is much, much easier to implement than a full hybrid system, Honda's very first mild hybrid car didn't have any issues I think.

[naks]

Thanks for this post! I'm curious to see who else will try and dabble into the cross company automotive partnerships (besides the ones we are already aware of). I can't wait to see what they come up with combining both techs at play.

secretly i'm rootin for a Supra!

[SVTSHC]

Hybrids hybrids hybrids gentlemen. Hybrids.

[sticky]

Wasn't too sure where to put this. Sorry if it's in wrong section but this is some exciting news!

Designer Andreas Fougner's, Supra concept

BMW and Toyota Motor Corp. on Friday said they will develop a sports car together and cooperate in fuel cell technology, powertrain electrification and lightweight technologies.

BMW CEO Norbert Reithofer and Toyota President Akio Toyoda signed an initial agreement at BMW's Munich headquarters to expand long-term strategic collaboration between the two automakers.

"Toyota and the BMW Group share the same strategic vision of sustainable individual future mobility. Together we have a great opportunity to continue leading our industry through this transformation," Reithofer said in a statement.

Toyoda said in the same statement: "Toyota is strong in environment-friendly hybrids and fuel cells. On the other hand, I believe BMW's strength is in developing sports cars. I am excited to think of the cars that will result from this relationship."

In March, BMW and Toyota agreed to collaborate with BMW on lithium-ion battery research in exchange for a steady supply of BMW-made diesel engines starting in 2014.

The companies on Friday said they signed an agreement that allows joint development of a fuel cell system, joint development of architecture and components for a future sports vehicle, collaboration on powertrain electrification and joint research and development on lightweight technologies.

Original article: http://www.autoweek.com/article/2012...NEWS/120629803

Another article: http://smh.drive.com.au/motor-news/b...630-2190i.html

[S2kphile]

If true



I love BMW cars especially my moms 335i. I just wish I could justify spending that kinda money on a car.

[markmatley]

Time to trade in the 135i.....Save my duckies possibly for that beaute car!