Need new bumper, but dealer said paint is hard to match

[ttknf]

Originally Posted by White Shadow

Automotive plastics are baked at 140 - 160 degrees F. Nothing melts at those temps. This should be glaringly obvious to anyone in the business. Well, I guess being in the insurance business doesn't help much with the technical aspects of actually spraying a car.

I'm sorta amused that we have an auto detailer and an insurance guy acting as authorities on painting cars. Maybe if we had a few more guys who have actually painted cars professionally, we could have a great little debate! LOL

I meant baked at the temps you guys were referencing for metal parts(300-400 degrees F), and I did mention force drying with heat. Not all plastics/urethane parts are baked by OEMs, and some body shops have baking booths as well which they used to force dry as I mentioned.

I'm also familiar with the actual process of body work and spraying since I have a lot of hands-on experience doing that as well.

The only one trying to act as authority is yourself since it seems like you're trying to tell everybody else that they're wrong.

[wlfpck]

Originally Posted by David-Fermani.com

Yes, things have changed since you've been away. Today's waterborne paint (base) doesn't require baking fyi.



So please post up this information then as proof....

Especially some that says that bumpers are baked at 400 degrees.

Shops do bake or provide an additional heat source to heat the paint... It helps to cure it. While this may not be true for waterbased, this is true with the urethane paints

Also... it heavily depends on the paint that is being used. While the temperature may need to be at 400 degrees, some amount of heat is used to help the adhesion of the paint after it is sprayed. this is not saying that it is necessary to bake it.

Heat also helps solvents evaporate faster. This can speed things up a bit.

Painting metal versus painting the plastic has its main difference in the fact that when it is on plastic, a flex agent is applied. That way when the plastic flexes (however much it flexes) won't crack the paint.


I went to a specialties shop where they do old classic restorations, airbrushing, etc. They painted my rear bumper from where someone hit my car in a parking lot and left me 2 nice screw dents and scratches.

They were able to paint match and blend it fine. They also used heat lamps. So while they did not "bake" the bumper, they still applied an external heat source.

[wlfpck]

Also... I saw someone mentioned that the there are shops that use a solvent based clear....

I'm not really sure if it's just my misunderstanding or what-not...

but... Clear coats are/should be 2 part urethanes. It is a part A and part B type of thing. It cures from a chemical reaction.

I'm not sure what you mean by solvent based clear but, the clear coats from my understanding are always a 2 part clear coat.

[Yruyur]

This one may have less damage and is only 240 and in white

http://item.mobileweb.ebay.com/viewi...id=07678490075

Sent from my flux capacitor using Taptalk

[White Shadow]

Originally Posted by ttknf

I meant baked at the temps you guys were referencing for metal parts(300-400 degrees F), and I did mention force drying with heat. Not all plastics/urethane parts are baked by OEMs, and some body shops have baking booths as well which they used to force dry as I mentioned.

Until the other guy mentioned something about 400F, I don't think anyone ever mentioned a specific temperature for baking painted parts. I certainly never made that claim.

BTW, I obviously have no way to know what "all" OEMs do when it comes to baking plastic parts, but I'd say that the majority of them absolutely bake them. It's really all about curing more than anything else.

I'm also familiar with the actual process of body work and spraying since I have a lot of hands-on experience doing that as well.

The only one trying to act as authority is yourself since it seems like you're trying to tell everybody else that they're wrong.

Don't look now, but if you're debating my words, then you're also telling me that I'm wrong. Don't be a hypocrite. All I'm saying is that it's almost comical that a guy who cleans & waxes cars and a guy who works for an insurance company are both acting like authorities on painting cars. What we need in this discussion is to hear from more people who have actually painted cars as a profession, that's all.

[White Shadow]

Originally Posted by David-Fermani.com

You did:

Reading comprehension might not be your strong point, so let me clear this up for you: By saying that I "used" to work for a body shop doesn't mean that I don't still do body work or spray cars. It simply means that I don't work for a body shop anymore. Does that help you out at all? Do I need to explain it further?

So, if you are still involved in the body repair trade, but not officially working at a shop, where do you perform your work? Just curious??

Depends on the work I'm doing. 95% of body work can be done right in my own garage at home.

No, I don't think solvent-based painting is obsolete at all. Every body shop, not matter if it’s using water-borne or not is still being cleared with a solvent clear. What is obsolete in many ways is lacquer. FACT.

Hate to break it to you, but LOTS of shops are still painting with solvents. Like I said, water is just now starting to become popular for environmental reasons. Of course its just a matter of time before water becomes the norm, especially as the tree huggers continue fight against solvent spraying.

As for your lacquer comment, I think you need some help. You can't say that something is "obsolete in many ways" because that doesn't make sense. It's either obsolete or it isn't. If something is obsolete, it isn't used anymore. FACT. And here's another fact for you: I have a new Audi that was factory painted with lacquer paint.

I never said anything about bumpers or trim? I’m referring to factory applied paint on vehicle bodies that is baked at levels between 250-300 degrees. Are you doubting this?

You never said anything about bumpers or trim? That's a laugh riot. This entire discussion has been based on bumpers being difficult/impossible to match to the car body.

What’s amusing is the mentality of certain bodymen /painters and why the management choses to keep them back in the shop and not let them converse with the customer. If by what you’ve explained qualifies you an “authority” on the body repair industry then it’s time for me to hang up my hat. If you want to keep throwing mud then by all means go ahead, but I’m going to stay on the path of actual facts.

LOL, do you think that washing & waxing cars somehow makes you an authority of body work or painting? Since you like facts, here's one for you: I have experience painting cars as a profession. You're a car detailer. You have experience washing cars and waxing them.

Now to regurgitate what I already said: The paint makeup used on bumpers at the factory level( 2K Polyurethane ) is totally different then what is used on the metal bodies (1K or melamine). One is activated with heat and the other isn't. One is electrostatically applied and the other isn't. This is just one tiny component as to why paint on trim may not perfectly match the paint on the body. The other is that trim isn't painted at the same location that the bodies are painted at and are painted by OEM suppliers that could be on the other side of the planet from where the vehicle is assembled/painted. There is such a huge acceptable variance for color matching (at the factory level) that there could literally be multiple shades of colors on your car.

I think you need to do some research, especially on the OEMs. Like I said, you seem to be very much out of touch with reality. Here are some more facts for you:

1K topcoats aren't being used very often anymore. Last I heard, it was less than 2%....and that's not in North America.

2K urethane clearcoats are very popular in Germany and even with a few Japanese OEMS. In the U.S., the unions are opposed to them, so you don't see 2K urethane clearcoats very often here.

There are plants in Europe that are using both waterborne clearcoats and even powder clearcoats. I believe BMW is currently using powder clear in one of their factories, but I'd have to look it up to be sure.

The vast majority of "aftermarket" paint used by body shops in the U.S. are 2K urethane clearcoats, athough the base coat can vary.

[BCooke]

Originally Posted by midnitz

Lol, I knew someone would ask that. Well, I was working late that night n when I went to grab my car, I was the only one left in the parking lot. When I got in my car, the windows were all foggy, but I took off anyways because I was really tired. I put it into drive since no one was in front of me (I like said, I was the only one left in the parking lot), but I didn’t notice the lamppost slightly to the front right of me n I didn’t see it because my windows were super foggy. The next thing was I felt the impact. Luckily, I only let go of my brakes half way, so I didn’t do any frame damage. N like I said it’s not that bad, u can hardly see it even from 5- 10 feet away.

Same thing happened to me last night... 2 AM at IHOP and I backed into one of those waist high yellow poles... Needless to say, ruined my day early.
No dents or anything, but I have a few deep scratches and a bunch of smaller ones.

[VSGTS14]

all you need is a good bodyshop. give them the color code. and the bumper. and they will paint. it'll match pretty damn close, as long as they are reputable. they're off their rocker if they want to blend the entire front end...you only need to do this on metal/aluminum parts because the paint adheres and appears differently. bumpers are easy. i've had numerous done by just giving the body shop the pieces, the code, and they called me when they were ready.

[gmookher]

Tell me, after looking at my pics or inspecting the car in person. Unless pure highly trained, no ones been able to find where it was blended and re shot

[Cameronghanson]

DRAMMAAAA

[Turbo95eg6]

Bringing back an old thread, cuz these people here seem to know their shit...

I'm considering getting a clear bra on my SWP bumper/hood after spotting my first rock chip. I know the debate has always been getting the clear bra done, or just repainting the bumper down the road.

This being my first car with pearl paint, I've know it's really hard to paint panels and have it match to factory specs. My question is, will even a Subaru dealership not be able to perfectly match a bumper (or any panel) to the rest of the car? Seems like your local body shop is totally out of the question, I guess I didn't realize how hard it would be to color match. Is it just the case of finding that really experienced shop that would match the thing near factory?

[Apex-Wolf]

Originally Posted by EN2_Squirrel

This is what happened when i hit one of those white barriers while drifting. Yes i messed up but i was doing 90mph upon impact. Should i replace it? Also it is like a chunk of bumper was taken out.

Sent from my SCH-I510 using Tapatalk 2

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17698
^ that
or dish out the money to have a pro fix it.

[spitfire481]

Originally Posted by Turbo95eg6

Bringing back an old thread, cuz these people here seem to know their shit...

I'm considering getting a clear bra on my SWP bumper/hood after spotting my first rock chip. I know the debate has always been getting the clear bra done, or just repainting the bumper down the road.

This being my first car with pearl paint, I've know it's really hard to paint panels and have it match to factory specs. My question is, will even a Subaru dealership not be able to perfectly match a bumper (or any panel) to the rest of the car? Seems like your local body shop is totally out of the question, I guess I didn't realize how hard it would be to color match. Is it just the case of finding that really experienced shop that would match the thing near factory?

tri-stage colors are a total pain to match, especially if you are not blending the adjacent panels. it doesn't matter if you go to a dealership shop, or a lone guy who works out of his garage. it all depends on the paint system used, how well the painter can apply a tri-stage, and how well the painter can tint the paint system being used. i am a painter, and i would never own a pearl white car. take that for what its worth lol.

[Turbo95eg6]

Originally Posted by spitfire481

tri-stage colors are a total pain to match, especially if you are not blending the adjacent panels. it doesn't matter if you go to a dealership shop, or a lone guy who works out of his garage. it all depends on the paint system used, how well the painter can apply a tri-stage, and how well the painter can tint the paint system being used. i am a painter, and i would never own a pearl white car. take that for what its worth lol.

But it just looks so damn awesome lol. Ok, you convinced me to at least get a clear bra… For now.