Delicious Tuning - Q&A EcuTeK ProECU Tuning and Maps

[dabocx]

Originally Posted by sales@delicioustuning.com

I believe on a JDL UEL Turbo kit with a gt2863r we broke 400whp dynojet equivalent at 15-16psi on E85. Can't guarantee that since dyno sheets could be on fire right now.

Sincerely,

Zach
Delicious Tuning

Ill bug you all once you get everything settled out.

Stay safe

[Draco-REX]

So I'm a little confused with the different Innovate tunes available. Some of the dyno graphs are whp, some are crank hp. The flex-fuel Stage 1 dyno graph shows a stage 2 build. The Stage 2 tunes don't list mods. etc.

Looking at the Flex-Fuel dyno graph, I have the mods listed, will I see a similar result with just the Stage 1 Flex-Fuel tune?

Also, will the "250whp" tune be made available? I have the mods mentioned in the article as well, so I would be interested in this.

Thanks.

[2ndgenhachi]

All you guys stay safe out there! Please give us the all good once you and your families are safe.

[vaderbloke]

I agree. Safety and families should come first right now. I am also confused by the units for HP on some of the graphs.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

[Dezoris]

I thought I was going to have my tune this weekend, now I have to cancel all my street races in the walmart parking lot!!

Best wishes guys hope you all stay safe.

[AZFA20]

Hope you guys are safe! Was going to see you guys tomorrow for another JDL but after talking to Bill we have decided to cancel the trip till further notice. I didn't realize how close it was to you guys until literally this evening. Crazy videos coming out of there right now

[Calum]

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/...ations-ordered

Our thoughts are with you guys. Stay safe.

[DeliciousTuning]

Originally Posted by Draco-REX

So I'm a little confused with the different Innovate tunes available. Some of the dyno graphs are whp, some are crank hp. The flex-fuel Stage 1 dyno graph shows a stage 2 build. The Stage 2 tunes don't list mods. etc.

Looking at the Flex-Fuel dyno graph, I have the mods listed, will I see a similar result with just the Stage 1 Flex-Fuel tune?

Also, will the "250whp" tune be made available? I have the mods mentioned in the article as well, so I would be interested in this.

Thanks.

The graphs that state "crank HP" are in error. That dyno down at HG prints the charts as such by default, but the readings are indeed at the wheels.

Sincerely,

Delicious Tuning

[Draco-REX]

Originally Posted by sales@delicioustuning.com

The graphs that state "crank HP" are in error. That dyno down at HG prints the charts as such by default, but the readings are indeed at the wheels.

Sincerely,

Zach
Delicious Tuning

Thanks for replying when things are so chaotic out there. I'm still a little fuzzy.

To add some perspective, this is what I have. The car, as it stands, has a header and full exhaust, as well as supporting mods (robispec cooling, flywheel, etc). I also have a pile of parts waiting to go on. All or just some can go on the car for now.

These parts are:
Innovate non-intercooled S/C
ECUTek ProECU cable
70mm Pulley
DW65c pump
FIC 540cc Injectors

I'm trying to figure out what I need to get on the car for the best results. I know I would likely need a custom tune to get the most out of everything I have, but in the near term I'm more interested in your driveability and longevity improvements. So not going whole-hog at first is acceptable if there isn't a tune that can take advantage of the 70mm pulley on corn.

This is what I'm seeing when I look at the list of maps:

Innovate Stage 1 "Complete":
Needed: Stock car w/ Innovate S/C, cable
HP: 195 rwhp

Innovate Stage 1 "E85":
Needed: Stock car w/ Innovate S/C, cable
HP: 305 rwhp

Innovate Stage 1 "Flex Fuel":
Needed: Stock car w/ Innovate S/C and flex fuel kit, cable
HP: ??
HP w/ Headers, full exhaust, and FP: 228 rwhp

Innovate Stage 1 "Tuner":
Needed: Stock car w/ Innovate S/C,cable
HP:195 rwhp

Innovate Stage 2:
Needed: Stock car w/ intercooled Innovate S/C, cable
hp:192 rwhp

Innovate Stage 2 "E85":
Needed: Stock car w/ intercooled Innovate S/C. cable
hp: 305 rwhp


So, I'm still a bit confused..

Why is the Stage 1 "Complete" tune 3 times the cost of the others?

If you got 305 rwhp from the Stage 1 "E85" tune with just a stock vehicle, why is the 250 rwhp you got with robispec notable?

And again, if you got 305 rwhp with just a basic setup, why does the Stage 1 "Flex Fuel" kit require headers, exhaust, and a pump to just get 228 rwhp on corn?

It still seems like your dyno graphs are mixed up or not notated properly, and your tuning packages aren't listing the required mods. I really want to use your tunes because of your focus on continual development for driveability and reliability and your dedication to the Innovate S/C. But as the list of maps stands, it looks like I should go back to a stock exhaust and just install a basic Innovate S/C, which I know is incorrect. So, assuming the 305 rwhp graphs are incorrect and are actually crank hp as the graph states, that puts them around 215 rwhp on your dyno. That makes a bit more sense looking at the other packages.

That puts be back to the "Flex Fuel" map. But will that map automatically take advantage of a header/exhaust to get that level of power without a custom tune? Does it require a fuel pump?

Ultimately, given the parts I have, what's your best recommendation?

Thanks for your time.

[DeliciousTuning]

Originally Posted by Draco-REX

Thanks for replying when things are so chaotic out there. I'm still a little fuzzy.

To add some perspective, this is what I have. The car, as it stands, has a header and full exhaust, as well as supporting mods (robispec cooling, flywheel, etc). I also have a pile of parts waiting to go on. All or just some can go on the car for now.

These parts are:
Innovate non-intercooled S/C
ECUTek ProECU cable
70mm Pulley
DW65c pump
FIC 540cc Injectors

I'm trying to figure out what I need to get on the car for the best results. I know I would likely need a custom tune to get the most out of everything I have, but in the near term I'm more interested in your driveability and longevity improvements. So not going whole-hog at first is acceptable if there isn't a tune that can take advantage of the 70mm pulley on corn.

This is what I'm seeing when I look at the list of maps:

Innovate Stage 1 "Complete":
Needed: Stock car w/ Innovate S/C, cable
HP: 195 rwhp

Innovate Stage 1 "E85":
Needed: Stock car w/ Innovate S/C, cable
HP: 305 rwhp

Innovate Stage 1 "Flex Fuel":
Needed: Stock car w/ Innovate S/C and flex fuel kit, cable
HP: ??
HP w/ Headers, full exhaust, and FP: 228 rwhp

Innovate Stage 1 "Tuner":
Needed: Stock car w/ Innovate S/C,cable
HP:195 rwhp

Innovate Stage 2:
Needed: Stock car w/ intercooled Innovate S/C, cable
hp:192 rwhp

Innovate Stage 2 "E85":
Needed: Stock car w/ intercooled Innovate S/C. cable
hp: 305 rwhp


So, I'm still a bit confused..

Why is the Stage 1 "Complete" tune 3 times the cost of the others?

If you got 305 rwhp from the Stage 1 "E85" tune with just a stock vehicle, why is the 250 rwhp you got with robispec notable?

And again, if you got 305 rwhp with just a basic setup, why does the Stage 1 "Flex Fuel" kit require headers, exhaust, and a pump to just get 228 rwhp on corn?

It still seems like your dyno graphs are mixed up or not notated properly, and your tuning packages aren't listing the required mods. I really want to use your tunes because of your focus on continual development for driveability and reliability and your dedication to the Innovate S/C. But as the list of maps stands, it looks like I should go back to a stock exhaust and just install a basic Innovate S/C, which I know is incorrect. So, assuming the 305 rwhp graphs are incorrect and are actually crank hp as the graph states, that puts them around 215 rwhp on your dyno. That makes a bit more sense looking at the other packages.

That puts be back to the "Flex Fuel" map. But will that map automatically take advantage of a header/exhaust to get that level of power without a custom tune? Does it require a fuel pump?

Ultimately, given the parts I have, what's your best recommendation?

Thanks for your time.

Many of the graphs are old and clearly need to be updated to sort out some confusion. The Stage 1 Complete is expensive because it includes a cable and license as well. That's why it's a "complete" tune vs a "tuner" tune. You can have a pump if you want, but it's not necessary. On this blower, a full exhaust is not even necessary. Robispec happened to have one, and the Borla's tend to hurt more than they help. Ignore the graphs for now so I can explain a little about what you can expect from each tune. Since you are non-intercooled, you're stage 1, done. To extract the most from your car, you WILL need the intercooler to reach 300whp. You do not, however, need those uprated injectors. Our tunes for 300whp assume stock injectors, E85, 70mm pulley, and the intercooled blower. Now the reason the Stage 1 Flexfuel tune looks so gutless and the Stage 1 E85 as well as Stage 2 E85 look godly is because the 300whp runs were shown as Dynojet comparable numbers. Normally, and you can see this from the Stage 1 Flexfuel graph, that particular dyno reads a stock vehicle at around 135whp. What should be important at this point to you for maximum reliability, drivability, and power, is intercooling that sucker. Without an intercooler on E85, you're looking at around 280-285whp as you sit, with it above 300.

In short: Your uprated injectors and exhaust will not help. We don't run out of injectors on our tunes, even at 300whp on E85. The exhaust on this supercharger does next to nothing, especially the Borla setup. A higher end header such as the JDL may help a bit more, and we are actually testing one in the next few weeks, but not too likely. This blower simply doesn't take advantage of headers in the same way that other kits do.

To get the most out of your vehicle I would recommend intercooling your kit. As it sits, on E85, you can expect 280-285whp. With an intercooler, this pushes you past 300whp on a dynojet. We do recommend you switch back to stock injectors if you are going with one of our tunes, as they're the easiest to dial in and proven to be just fine at the power limit of the Innovate blower.

I hope this helps.

Sincerely,


Delicious Tuning

[vaderbloke]

Thanks for this excellent explanation Zach. It also answered all of my questions. Looks like my next purchase may be an Innovate

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

[Draco-REX]

Thank you again for responding, even on a Sunday! It's hard enough to get responses on weekends from companies I'm looking into paying thousands, and you're here answering my questions about a product that costs hundreds.

Originally Posted by sales@delicioustuning.com

Many of the graphs are old and clearly need to be updated to sort out some confusion. The Stage 1 Complete is expensive because it includes a cable and license as well. That's why it's a "complete" tune vs a "tuner" tune. You can have a pump if you want, but it's not necessary. On this blower, a full exhaust is not even necessary. Robispec happened to have one, and the Borla's tend to hurt more than they help. Ignore the graphs for now so I can explain a little about what you can expect from each tune. Since you are non-intercooled, you're stage 1, done. To extract the most from your car, you WILL need the intercooler to reach 300whp. You do not, however, need those uprated injectors. Our tunes for 300whp assume stock injectors, E85, 70mm pulley, and the intercooled blower. Now the reason the Stage 1 Flexfuel tune looks so gutless and the Stage 1 E85 as well as Stage 2 E85 look godly is because the 300whp runs were shown as Dynojet comparable numbers. Normally, and you can see this from the Stage 1 Flexfuel graph, that particular dyno reads a stock vehicle at around 135whp. What should be important at this point to you for maximum reliability, drivability, and power, is intercooling that sucker. Without an intercooler on E85, you're looking at around 280-285whp as you sit, with it above 300.

In short: Your uprated injectors and exhaust will not help. We don't run out of injectors on our tunes, even at 300whp on E85. The exhaust on this supercharger does next to nothing, especially the Borla setup. A higher end header such as the JDL may help a bit more, and we are actually testing one in the next few weeks, but not too likely. This blower simply doesn't take advantage of headers in the same way that other kits do.

To get the most out of your vehicle I would recommend intercooling your kit. As it sits, on E85, you can expect 280-285whp. With an intercooler, this pushes you past 300whp on a dynojet. We do recommend you switch back to stock injectors if you are going with one of our tunes, as they're the easiest to dial in and proven to be just fine at the power limit of the Innovate blower.

I hope this helps.

Sincerely,

Zach
Delicious Tuning

I'm surprised about the intercooler. Last I heard, it was restrictive and heat-soaked quickly. So the thinking was that an E85 tune would make more power without. Apparently, that's not the case. So I'll look into getting one.

The header was the only one available at the time I got it. Everyone else was looking at 6wk+ lead time. How much of a drop in power are you seeing with the Borla EL? If it's just 5 or less I'll keep it.

All of the power adders, except for the exhaust, are not on the car yet. So the injectors aren't an issue.

Your 300 rwhp formula is:
Innovate S/C w/ intercooler
70mm pulley
E85
Stock fuel pump?

Would this tune be Flex Fuel capable? And is it one of the off-the-shelf tunes or a custom tune? If custom, what would you need from me?

Thanks again.

[DeliciousTuning]

Originally Posted by Draco-REX

Thank you again for responding, even on a Sunday! It's hard enough to get responses on weekends from companies I'm looking into paying thousands, and you're here answering my questions about a product that costs hundreds.



I'm surprised about the intercooler. Last I heard, it was restrictive and heat-soaked quickly. So the thinking was that an E85 tune would make more power without. Apparently, that's not the case. So I'll look into getting one.

The header was the only one available at the time I got it. Everyone else was looking at 6wk+ lead time. How much of a drop in power are you seeing with the Borla EL? If it's just 5 or less I'll keep it.

All of the power adders, except for the exhaust, are not on the car yet. So the injectors aren't an issue.

Your 300 rwhp formula is:
Innovate S/C w/ intercooler
70mm pulley
E85
Stock fuel pump?

Would this tune be Flex Fuel capable? And is it one of the off-the-shelf tunes or a custom tune? If custom, what would you need from me?

Thanks again.

Those that are claiming the intercooler is restrictive and heat soaks too quickly likely haven't figured out how to properly tune for it. It's not so much a drop in power so much as you aren't making more with it over a stock manifold and every one we've tested has had an exhaust leak that needed to be fixed. I'd go with JDL EL or UEL or the newly revised PPE setup. Fuel pump can be stock or DW65C, it's whichever you prefer. And yes, this setup is flex fuel capable as long as you have a flexfuel kit. Off the shelf. We have over a thousand hours in the Innovate setup, so much so that bringing it in for custom tuning would seriously not net you anything more and would cost much more.

Sincerely,


Delicious Tuning

[Draco-REX]

Originally Posted by sales@delicioustuning.com

Those that are claiming the intercooler is restrictive and heat soaks too quickly likely haven't figured out how to properly tune for it. It's not so much a drop in power so much as you aren't making more with it over a stock manifold and every one we've tested has had an exhaust leak that needed to be fixed. I'd go with JDL EL or UEL or the newly revised PPE setup. Fuel pump can be stock or DW65C, it's whichever you prefer. And yes, this setup is flex fuel capable as long as you have a flexfuel kit. Off the shelf. We have over a thousand hours in the Innovate setup, so much so that bringing it in for custom tuning would seriously not net you anything more and would cost much more.

Sincerely,

Zach
Delicious Tuning

I'll look into another header, but I'll stick with the Borla for now. The fuel pump thing is interesting. I'll stick with the stock pump if it handles the increased flow without a problem. No need to crack open the tank for no reason.

So, with an IC, 70mm pulley, and Flex Fuel kit, I only need to purchase the Stage 2 E85 tune from your website and I'm knocking on 300 rwhp (DynoJet numbers) and have full flex-fuel capability?

That's fantastic.

I picked up the pump and injectors on a recommendation from another tuner. I'm amazed by how much you are getting out of this engine with so little in fuel modifications. Frankly, hitting close to 300 rwhp on a DynoJet was beyond my hopes when I started assembling these parts. I thought I'd max out around 260.

8 months of delays and other issues, I'm finally going to be able to get this done. I can't wait.