OFFICIAL Torque Android app PID/Misc Thread

[Partial Stall]

I'm curious as to what a "normal" timing advance should be like. I've been trying to collect data of different types of gas around my area for the best bang. While at WOT my timing advance goes down to about 10 or so. But for some reason torque says the lowest it's ever gotten is -11.0.

Anyone know what the deal is with timing advance in this car?

Also anyone noticing lean conditions when your foot is OFF the accelator after an acceleration? I notice my AFR goes to like 20 for a bit, or until I put the foot on the gas again. (it always stats between 13-14.5 every other time)

[arghx7]

Originally Posted by Partial Stall

I'm curious as to what a "normal" timing advance should be like. I've been trying to collect data of different types of gas around my area for the best bang. While at WOT my timing advance goes down to about 10 or so.

That's probably at an area that is prone to knocking.

But for some reason torque says the lowest it's ever gotten is -11.0.

That sounds like timing during a cold start to warm up the catalytic converter. Retarding the spark timing is normal--combustion occurs later, so the exhaust temperature heats up and lights off the converter. Usually a direct injected engine will go around -10, or sometimes even more retarded than that. A port injected engine will retard less than that during cold start, unless it has a swirl or tumble control valve.

Basically, when tuning for cold start emissions you want to retard ignition as much as you can without causing misfire.

Anyone know what the deal is with timing advance in this car?

What you've described so far would be considered normal.

Also anyone noticing lean conditions when your foot is OFF the accelator after an acceleration?

That's just fuel cut on deceleration.

I notice my AFR goes to like 20 for a bit, or until I put the foot on the gas again. (it always stats between 13-14.5 every other time)

If it didn't go lean on tip-out, under normal circumstances wouldn't it be wasting fuel?

[reeves]

Originally Posted by Partial Stall

I'm curious as to what a "normal" timing advance should be like. I've been trying to collect data of different types of gas around my area for the best bang. While at WOT my timing advance goes down to about 10 or so. But for some reason torque says the lowest it's ever gotten is -11.0.

Anyone know what the deal is with timing advance in this car?

Also anyone noticing lean conditions when your foot is OFF the accelator after an acceleration? I notice my AFR goes to like 20 for a bit, or until I put the foot on the gas again. (it always stats between 13-14.5 every other time)

I'm no expert either.. but on my previous car, I had a standalone EMS put on it.. The tuner told me it was normal for AFR to go up to 20+ when you let your foot off the gas.. it's suppose to save gas that way. And because you essentially have no load on the engine, being that lean won't hurt the engine.

I don't completely understand the timing on this car either.. I've wondered myself why the timing DROPS under harder acceleration.. I'm assuming it's for safety reasons, since there's more potential for knock under hard acceleration than when you're just cruising on light throttle.

[reeves]

Originally Posted by zoomzoomers

So now I'm noticing that the intake temps vary a lot. I've now seen intake temps in the 90's, and I've even seen it in the 110's, and the engine oil temp reach 215 F. I wasn't even in dumper to dumper traffic. I can't say I yet know what I'm seeing, but I can say that these temps seem to vary by a wide range. I'll keep monitoring.

I never observed my intake temps when I had the stock one on.. but with my CAI, I can get very high intake temps too in stop-n-go traffic.. but those temps drop quickly once I get going. The harder I accelerate (the more air flows through), the quicker they drop!

[jack43]

BTW thanks for all this info with help making sense of the numbers. Keep it coming

[arghx7]

The main spark and target AFR maps have already been posted before...



target AFR:

[zoomzoomers]

Originally Posted by reeves

I never observed my intake temps when I had the stock one on.. but with my CAI, I can get very high intake temps too in stop-n-go traffic.. but those temps drop quickly once I get going. The harder I accelerate (the more air flows through), the quicker they drop!

Yep, I've seen some huge variances in intake air temp. When I'm on the hwy I normally see temps in the 70's to 90's range. In city driving I've seen the temp spike as high as 140's, but that was in Socal with the ambient temps in the high 80's. I'm not sure if I want to see what these temps will look like during the HOT summers here.

[Kodename47]

Originally Posted by reeves

I'm no expert either.. but on my previous car, I had a standalone EMS put on it.. The tuner told me it was normal for AFR to go up to 20+ when you let your foot off the gas.. it's suppose to save gas that way. And because you essentially have no load on the engine, being that lean won't hurt the engine.

That's because when you're off the throttle you're not running lean, there's no fuel being injected at all. There's no combustion going on so all your engine is doing is pumping air through it, which is why your AFR is actually much higher than 20, I guess 20 is just the limitations of the sensor. AFR values are only useful when on the throttle.

[Partial Stall]

Wow. The thing runs pretty rich at higher rpm and load. I guess I'm going to have to get a tune.

[Partial Stall]

Originally Posted by Kodename47

That's because when you're off the throttle you're not running lean, there's no fuel being injected at all. There's no combustion going on so all your engine is doing is pumping air through it, which is why your AFR is actually much higher than 20, I guess 20 is just the limitations of the sensor. AFR values are only useful when on the throttle.

Ummm I'm pretty sure there is ignition all the time. How would the cylinder come back up after the last ignition and fight compression if for no combustion at all.

[Kodename47]

Originally Posted by Partial Stall

Ummm I'm pretty sure there is ignition all the time. How would the cylinder come back up after the last ignition and fight compression if for no combustion at all.

There's definitely not...... the momentum of the engine/gearbox/car keeps it going. The engine won't just stop when there's no throttle. As soon as it needs to add any fuel then it will.

Think about it, combustion = power which you don't need off throttle.

[Partial Stall]

I hear ya, but even at idle there is combustion. Off throttle, say going down hill pretty sure there is still spark and measurable amounts of exhaust

[arghx7]

There's a difference between idle and deceleration fuel cut. Fuel cut is also called an overrun condition.

The spark and fuel turn off, often in stages. Half the cylinders may cut fuel and then all of them. The crank and cam signals are used to judge how to reactivate combustion.

[reeves]

Originally Posted by Partial Stall

I hear ya, but even at idle there is combustion. Off throttle, say going down hill pretty sure there is still spark and measurable amounts of exhaust

I do notice.. when 'coasting' to a stop, if you put the car in NEUTRAL, the AFR remains around ~14. But if you keep the car in gear, the AFR goes up to 20+.. Does that mean you get BETTER MPG's if you keep the car in gear when approaching a stoplight, rather than putting it into neutral?