Engine idle chirping (cricket) noise poll.

[JCasteli]

I purchased my Scion at Holman in Mt. Laurel, NJ. I have gone through 3 pumps. As mentioned in previous posts, they referred me to the National Center for Dispute Settlement. Holman didn't even have me speak to the Service Manager, they just immediately referred me to the dispute center explaining that Toyota won't replace them anymore. Now, they call it, "normal.

My arbitration hearing is scheduled for October 8. I have since moved to Kansas, so it will be at a random Toyota dealership. My argument is that how can they conveniently consider it normal after they replaced thousands of these on vehicles and even issued a TSB? Also, it wasn't sold making this sound. No one would be able to sell a new sports car that has a high pitched engine chirp. It no longer performs as it did when purchased. Sound is a part of performance. Manufacturers invest millions in engine and exhaust sounds. Toyota went so far to pump sound into their cabin.

I was told 2 months ago that I could wait for the new part to come out. I had little trust in that actually happening and here we are 2 months later and there either is a new pump that has the same problem or there isn't a new pump at all.

I assume once we reach an agreement I won't be able to disclose the results, but do know it's a case that easily warrants a dispute settlement and Toyota recognizes this if you indeed pursue it.

[Kefuddle]

Hi Hunter (et al),

Originally Posted by HunterGreene

But, if you are running E0, and you are still getting the chirps--makes me think operating temperature may be a bigger factor than people think.

I just wanted to revisit this. As I filled up with 95 again and the crickets have yet again disappeared. Not only that, but also I noticed that low RPM chattering that I think comes from the direct injection unit (could be wrong) is much much more subdued and the car just subjectively seems to be running smoother (which I perceived also last time I filled up with 95). Neither do I detect any lack of performance.

On the subject of Ethanol content in the fuel here in Dubai, I can't find any evidence of that.

But right now, it seems to me that either the quality of 98 fuel here is very low, there is Ethanol in the fuel, Toyota are wrong on the fuel recommendations or the car is just meant to sound like an old Cortina with a slipping fan belt!

[ZZT86]

Originally Posted by DylanFRS

I think he means that with a larger displacement engine they could get the same power output without the complex DI system.

Toyotas D4S system is meant to make the engine more efficient & thus its implementation on their cars & D4D in trucks. I'm all for more power & efficiency n all but to suggest a noisy & really annoying racket clearly coming from the HPFP is normal is not good enough & a possible deterrent to future sales.

Toyota are usually very good with these sort of problems & issues, imo it's only a matter of time before Toyota have a solution for it - I hope :/

[Khazzy]

2k miles later after the 93 w/ethanol fuel I filled up with in Iowa causing crickets, crickets stopped after the next tank of gas (91 w/o ethanol). Win

[ZZT86]

Originally Posted by Kefuddle

Hi Hunter (et al),

I just wanted to revisit this. As I filled up with 95 again and the crickets have yet again disappeared. Not only that, but also I noticed that low RPM chattering that I think comes from the direct injection unit (could be wrong) is much much more subdued and the car just subjectively seems to be running smoother (which I perceived also last time I filled up with 95). Neither do I detect any lack of performance.

On the subject of Ethanol content in the fuel here in Dubai, I can't find any evidence of that.

But right now, it seems to me that either the quality of 98 fuel here is very low, there is Ethanol in the fuel, Toyota are wrong on the fuel recommendations or the car is just meant to sound like an old Cortina with a slipping fan belt!

Our RON98 fuel in Oz is quite strong, Shell VPower for example has been tested to be a minimum of 98, has NO ethanol and still I have the crickets at normal temps & at idle. Have tried other brands of fuel and same result, although I have never tried RON95 & it's a lot cheaper ! I will give the stuff a try & see what comes of it, the car has knock sensors, it should work just fine.

[sierra]

Originally Posted by ZZT86

Our RON98 fuel in Oz is quite strong, Shell VPower for example has been tested to be a minimum of 98, has NO ethanol and still I have the crickets at normal temps & at idle. Have tried other brands of fuel and same result, although I have never tried RON95 & it's a lot cheaper ! I will give the stuff a try & see what comes of it, the car has knock sensors, it should work just fine.

You are the first to get the crickets in Oz that I have seen.
Are you absolutely sure it contains no ethanol?

[ZZT86]

VPower has no ethanol, it's the only fuel that I use & have used since Optimax was released all those years ago. My neighbour has just got himself an 86 GTS mt, I will consult him to see what he thinks of his but I'm fairly certain it's widespread - my technical advisor @ Toyota is aware of the problem & believes it's common by design default :/

[sierra]

Originally Posted by ZZT86

VPower has no ethanol, it's the only fuel that I use & have used since Optimax was released all those years ago. My neighbour has just got himself an 86 GTS mt, I will consult him to see what he thinks of his but I'm fairly certain it's widespread - my technical advisor @ Toyota is aware of the problem & believes it's common by design default :/

It might be widespread in the US but I have never heard anyone even mention it here before.
I just did a search on our GT86 forum and found nothing.

[Team_Kengai]

is it possible to put sound deadening materiel around the area or part to make the noise at least more tolerable ??? just a thought ..

[sierra]

Originally Posted by Team_Kengai

is it possible to put sound deadening materiel around the area or part to make the noise at least more tolerable ??? just a thought ..

Just add a little 2T as has been posted many times.
It should be gone instantly.

[ZZT86]

Im fairly certain I've read ppl in oz complaining about it, I'm also 100% certain that the racket from under the bonnet which comes on after only a few minutes of idling IS this problem of the HPFP as it's coming from the vicinity of the pump (so the engine fires & runs quietly at first then the clatter), what's more my tech advisor at the dealer (who I have known for almost 20yrs) is also aware of it !

Ethanol specifically is not the cause of this issue, it's something else, most likely pump design. Essentially it sounds like a diesel truck - I hate that, it's not acceptable. It's a good thing that I have the Perrin un-resonated exhaust otherwise I'd really be pissed ! As it is, I can live with it, the car certainly runs well, like the clappers even

[sierra]

Originally Posted by ZZT86

Im fairly certain I've read ppl in oz complaining about it, I'm also 100% certain that the racket from under the bonnet which comes on after only a few minutes of idling IS this problem of the HPFP as it's coming from the vicinity of the pump (so the engine fires & runs quietly at first then the clatter), what's more my tech advisor at the dealer (who I have known for almost 20yrs) is also aware of it !

Ethanol specifically is not the cause of this issue, it's something else, most likely pump design. Essentially it sounds like a diesel truck - I hate that, it's not acceptable. It's a good thing that I have the Perrin un-resonated exhaust otherwise I'd really be pissed ! As it is, I can live with it, the car certainly runs well, like the clappers even

If you listen to the many video clips of the crickets you will realise it's not the clatter that comes from the HPFP which they all have.
The clatter is normal for direct injection, the crickets are not.

No ethanol, no crickets. You don't have crickets.

[ZZT86]

So what you are saying is that it's normal for the DI to suddenly become real noisy & at normal operating temp ? When I stop the car for 10-15 & then re-start the racket isn't there, then after a few minutes it's back. The HPFP is mechanically driven & is always running :/ I have followed & heard those clips, my car sounds the same !

[Mikem53]

Originally Posted by ZZT86

So what you are saying is that it's normal for the DI to suddenly become real noisy & at normal operating temp ? When I stop the car for 10-15 & then re-start the racket isn't there, then after a few minutes it's back. The HPFP is mechanically driven & is always running :/ I have followed & heard those clips, my car sounds the same !

Yes.. That's normal.. The port injectors are used at idle first, then the DI kicks on and the noise/clatter starts.. That noise is normal and similar of all pumps producing 3000psi.
It's the high pitch chirping noise that the pump sometimes makes randomly and it's not the normal racket a HPFP normally makes.