Why doesnt Toyota make its own motor for the FT-86?? - Page 2 - Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community

ichitaka05 · 10-23-2009, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OldSkoolToys

haha, you're right, I did misread.

My friend has an STi with a damn good exhaust on it, and it does sound very badass.

I still prefer the screaming of my 4A-GE at 7000RPM over that though.

It's so hard to decide which one has good exhaust notes.
Low end Boxer Engine sound so good... but at the same time 4a-GE's high Rev track run sound so good too... Rotary engine make good sound in high Rev, while VQ engine's low exhaust note is sexy too... Damn it, all the JDM engine make good sounds

OldSkoolToys · 10-23-2009, 07:11 PM

No one can convince me otherwise, that the 4A doesn't just sound like pure sex.

In the second touge showdown, Spirit's retuned their MRS (with a 2ZZ I believe) and in that video you can hear the engine much better, hence why I would desperately love to see a re-designed ZZ engine in the FT86. Those engines sound amazing as well.

White Comet · 10-23-2009, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ichitaka05

It's so hard to decide which one has good exhaust notes.
Low end Boxer Engine sound so good... but at the same time 4a-GE's high Rev track run sound so good too... Rotary engine make good sound in high Rev, while VQ engine's low exhaust note is sexy too... Damn it, all the JDM engine make good sounds

I used to own a 350Z, and as great as the VQ is, it only sounds good from the outside. It sounds ugly, like a coffee grinder, from the inside. I want the car I'm driving to sound good from the inside

7shades · 10-23-2009, 07:40 PM

Money.

Toyota fully capitalising on their investment in FHI.

I can foresee my FT86 lasting less than a year before I relocate the boxer garbage to the scrap pile where it belongs, and replacing it with something more appropriate. I have a number of options but I guess I'll have to wait until I see some chassis dimensions before I can see what will fit.

ichitaka05 · 10-23-2009, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OldSkoolToys

No one can convince me otherwise, that the 4A doesn't just sound like pure sex.

In the second touge showdown, Spirit's retuned their MRS (with a 2ZZ I believe) and in that video you can hear the engine much better, hence why I would desperately love to see a re-designed ZZ engine in the FT86. Those engines sound amazing as well.

IIRC didn't the Spirit MRS came back again and beat Tsuchiya-san's AE86? At the same time that MRS got stolen too. lol Also the person who set up that MR-S has his own shop.

But back to the exhaust sound, I think it's up to personal. Some love 4A engine, some love EJ, some love B13, some love VQ and me, I just love all the good tuned JDM engines.

White Comet · 10-23-2009, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 7shades

Money.

Toyota fully capitalising on their investment in FHI.

I can foresee my FT86 lasting less than a year before I relocate the boxer garbage to the scrap pile where it belongs, and replacing it with something more appropriate. I have a number of options but I guess I'll have to wait until I see some chassis dimensions before I can see what will fit.

I have nothing against the Toyota engines and really no experience with them to say how they stack up against Subie's, but the boxer most definitely is not junk.

ichitaka05 · 10-23-2009, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 7shades

Money.

Toyota fully capitalising on their investment in FHI.

I can foresee my FT86 lasting less than a year before I relocate the boxer garbage to the scrap pile where it belongs, and replacing it with something more appropriate. I have a number of options but I guess I'll have to wait until I see some chassis dimensions before I can see what will fit.

Yes, FHI Boxer engine is so crappy that Subaru 2.5-liter Turbo Boxer Engine won 'best engine' in the 2.0-2.5 litre category in both the 2006 and 2008 International Engine of the Year awards.

DanZilla · 10-23-2009, 07:59 PM

that tsuchiya video is alot of fun to watch

7shades · 10-23-2009, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ichitaka05

Yes, FHI Boxer engine is so crappy that Subaru 2.5-liter Turbo Boxer Engine won 'best engine' in the 2.0-2.5 litre category in both the 2006 and 2008 International Engine of the Year awards.

Coupled with an AWD configuration and appropriate chassis, it does its job quite well. However compared to any number of dedicated FR drivelines I think it will fall short.
You have to remember the way the FT will be driven... Flat stick, pegged to redline and very abrupt shifts... The boxer does not like these things. The boxer prefers a more linear throttle application... Which is why it works so well in a 'forgiving' AWD configuration.

White Comet · 10-23-2009, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 7shades

Coupled with an AWD configuration and appropriate chassis, it does its job quite well. However compared to any number of dedicated FR drivelines I think it will fall short.
You have to remember the way the FT will be driven... Flat stick, pegged to redline and very abrupt shifts... The boxer does not like these things. The boxer prefers a more linear throttle application... Which is why it works so well in a 'forgiving' AWD configuration.

Shifting idiosyncracies are a result of the tranny, not the engine. We already know his car is not going to use the wrx's glass 5 speed (thank god), so that's not an issue. And your concerns about revving high need to be kept in check until we know the engine internal. Remember, the jdm sti likes to rev high, and if this car is to make 200 ponies (albeit unconfirmed), it too will be built with tolerances to rev high.

Oh, and an AWD drivetrain is LESS forgiving than a 2WD one, not more.

scape · 10-23-2009, 08:25 PM

5 cylinder i5 in the realm of 2.5 - 3L, now that has an interesting engine sound; the wrx's sound like trucks to me, pretty badass but totally surprising at the same time

1984 · 10-23-2009, 08:26 PM

I think its difficult to judge what a Subaru flat 4 likes and doesn't like and is not good for a RWD configuration especially when no one has driven a production Subaru flat 4 that was developed specifically for a RWD platform. The way a Subaru flat 4 "feels" in a WRX for example has just as much to do with the AWD drivetrain as it does the engine. With the hype this car is generating, I highly doubt Toyota/Subaru is just going to plug in an engine that they have not extensively tested and made sure the overall feel and balance of the car is not right.

cyde01 · 10-23-2009, 08:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OldSkoolToys

haha, you're right, I did misread.

My friend has an STi with a damn good exhaust on it, and it does sound very badass.

I still prefer the screaming of my 4A-GE at 7000RPM over that though.

haha i recall you posting in club4ag that boxer "pancake motors have fartlike exhaust sounds."

i don't mean to offend any subie fans by posting that, i do realize that the ej is a very capable motor and it's advantages in this layout are well documented. but really, with all the development work that went into adding D-4S to the ej, you would think they could've done the same with the zz engine. i guess acquiring a stake in FHI and the short length/low center of gravity advantages were just too tempting?

White Comet · 10-23-2009, 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scape

5 cylinder i5 in the realm of 2.5 - 3L, now that has an interesting engine sound; the wrx's sound like trucks to me, pretty badass but totally surprising at the same time

I think they sound like cruiser bikes, myself

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
FT-86 Concept to be unveiled at Toyota Metapolis on 10/23 ahead of Tokyo Motor Show!	Hachiroku	Scion FR-S / Toyota 86 GT86 General Forum	8	12-16-2011 12:19 AM
Live pics and videos of Toyota FT-86 from Tokyo Motor Show (compilation)!	Hachiroku	FR-S & 86 Photos, Videos, Wallpapers, Gallery Forum	67	10-31-2011 09:09 PM

10-23-2009, 07:40 PM	#18
7shades Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Drives: JZX100, AE71(gze) Location: Cairns, Australia Posts: 18 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Money. Toyota fully capitalising on their investment in FHI. I can foresee my FT86 lasting less than a year before I relocate the boxer garbage to the scrap pile where it belongs, and replacing it with something more appropriate. I have a number of options but I guess I'll have to wait until I see some chassis dimensions before I can see what will fit.

10-23-2009, 07:59 PM	#22
DanZilla Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Drives: 05 New Formula Red Honda S2000 Location: Georgetown, DC Posts: 274 Thanks: 0 Thanked 14 Times in 14 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	that tsuchiya video is alot of fun to watch

10-23-2009, 08:25 PM	#25
scape Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Drives: yaris Location: sc Posts: 144 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 3 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	5 cylinder i5 in the realm of 2.5 - 3L, now that has an interesting engine sound; the wrx's sound like trucks to me, pretty badass but totally surprising at the same time

10-23-2009, 08:26 PM	#26
1984 Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Drives: 02 WRX Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 3 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	I think its difficult to judge what a Subaru flat 4 likes and doesn't like and is not good for a RWD configuration especially when no one has driven a production Subaru flat 4 that was developed specifically for a RWD platform. The way a Subaru flat 4 "feels" in a WRX for example has just as much to do with the AWD drivetrain as it does the engine. With the hype this car is generating, I highly doubt Toyota/Subaru is just going to plug in an engine that they have not extensively tested and made sure the overall feel and balance of the car is not right.

User Name		Remember Me?
Password