GEICO denied coverage(autocrossing BRZ)

[extrashaky]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Having said that I would think the insurance policy statements of no coverage for such events is plenty and cancelling the whole thing is a bit extreme.

Point of clarification: They didn't cancel. They decided not to renew. Those are two different things. They would need a reason to cancel (like the customer breaching the contract), since they had already agreed to insure the car up to a specific date. They don't need any reason at all to refuse to renew.

And it's not really that extreme. From the insurer's point of view, here's a customer who raced his car and then filed a claim for damage he says he sustained on the way home from a racing event. It probably happened exactly like he said it did. But that story also sounds exactly like other such stories told by people who sustain damage on the track, then lie and say it happened on the street to get the damage covered. That claim is likely what got them looking at him in the first place, and when they reevaluated his risk profile, the expected value of future claims was too high to justify keeping him as a customer.

[mdm]

Originally Posted by extrashaky

And autocross definitely carries an increased risk over normal driving

Are you saying that things like that don't happen in normal driving?




But more seriously, it would nice if the insurance companies came up with a scheme where you are allowed to participate in certain type of events in exchange for a moderate increase of premiums. But I am afraid that autocross or track day participants are too small a group for the insurers to even bother developing something like that.

[Packofcrows]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Toyota/Subaru call autoX racing when they deny warranty claims. It falls under the "timed event" section of the warranty fine print.


Having said that I would think the insurance policy statements of no coverage for such events is plenty and cancelling the whole thing is a bit extreme.

You're right! Thats what my letter says.

Needs something liek this to be ok.

[White64Goat]

How do you classify an HPDE then?

Guess I know why people tape over their license plates at these events now...............

[extrashaky]

Originally Posted by mdm

Are you saying that things like that don't happen in normal driving?

Don't be ridiculous.

Yes, people sometimes recklessly drive like complete fucking morons on the street, spin out and crash their cars.

The difference is that when it happens on the street, the guy who does it is a complete fucking moron driving recklessly, whereas in autocross it's normal.

If you recklessly drive like a complete fucking douche on the street, and the insurance company finds out because you had a crash or received tickets, they'll likely drop you then, too.

I think it's hilarious that we have companies whose sole purpose is to take on drivers' risk so that they can avoid responsibility when they fuck up, yet somehow the insurance company paying for all this is the bad guy. Maybe we should just do away with insurance companies altogether and watch people bitch and whine when nobody's around to pay for their damage. "What? You mean I have to actually pay for this myself?"

[DAEMANO]

For those who didn't RTFA...

He disclosed to a chummy Geico rep on the phone that he AutoX'd. That rep then forwarded his disclosure to the Geico underwriting department who then refused to renew his coverage because of this disclosure.

TLDR It's unwise to run your mouth to corporations with a vested interest in taking your money (as premiums) and paying as little as possible as claims. Hard lesson learned by what seems to be a nice guy.

[RichardsFRS]

No big shocker here that insurance companies wont cover you when you race. If anyone thinks they should maybe they don't need insurance, or a car

[mdm]

Originally Posted by extrashaky

Yes, people sometimes recklessly drive like complete fucking morons on the street, spin out and crash their cars.

The difference is that when it happens on the street, the guy who does it is a complete fucking moron driving recklessly, whereas in autocross it's normal.

Well, if it is NORMAL in autocross then obviously insurance companies SHOULD drop these people or, as I said, develop a "certain specific forms of racing allowed" policy to cover this. Otherwise, it means that people who don't do autoX will pay for the all that "normal' damage with their increased premiums.



Also, autocross is advertised like this

hazards to spectators, participants and property do not exceed those encountered in normal, legal highway driving. [...]A day of autocrossing is far safer for both car and driver than most people's daily commute to work.

So someone is spinning BS here, either spinouts and crashes are normal on autoX and unusual on street, like you're saying, or 'hazards do not exceed those encountered in normal driving"

[CatScan]

Originally Posted by Packofcrows

Oh wow it's not a jalopnik article!

I got a notice from Progressive for taking my car to the Mazda raceway. It said that car was shown to be used for something other than what was covered under their policy and to call back. I called them and they said not to worry. I should have letter somewhere.

How the heck did they find out you were at a track? Pics of plates and run through some database?

[86geek]

Originally Posted by Packofcrows

Oh wow it's not a jalopnik article!

I got a notice from Progressive for taking my car to the Mazda raceway. It said that car was shown to be used for something other than what was covered under their policy and to call back. I called them and they said not to worry. I should have letter somewhere.

This is good because in a few days I'll be cancelling my GEICO policy since they raised their rates due to losses in the first quarter. I already have a quote with Progressive and will be getting a policy from them. Progressive policy is $421.00 for 6 months, GEICO $510.00! I've had no accidents or traffic tickets.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by CatScan

How the heck did they find out you were at a track? Pics of plates and run through some database?

From the Blog:
1. How did they suddenly find out?
To GEICO’s credit, it turns out this isn’t nearly as creepy as I and others thought, and it is in fact my doing. Back in January I called GEICO to ask about adding $2500 worth of additional coverage to the car to insure a new set of wheels. The representative I was speaking to at the time seemed pretty cool. He asked me what wheels they were, and I told him, and he said, “Oh, wow those are nice. I’ve got XXXX on my car.” He sounded like a car guy. We got to talking while he worked on his machine, and at some point autocross came up. Apparently he forwarded the details of that conversation to GEICO’s underwriting department, and that’s that. I had completely forgotten about this conversation until she told me about it

[extrashaky]

Originally Posted by mdm

Well, if it is NORMAL in autocross then obviously insurance companies SHOULD drop these people or, as I said, develop a "certain specific forms of racing allowed" policy to cover this.

And some insurance companies do have that, as evidenced by the letter posted above. However, the time to deal with that issue is before you race, not when you're being dropped because you didn't bother to get an understanding of your policy.

Originally Posted by mdm

... either spinouts and crashes are normal on autoX and unusual on street, like you're saying...

No, that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that the kind of driving that would be considered reckless on the street is considered normal in autocross. Reckless driving is prohibited on the street because of the increased risk of damage. That kind of driving is considered normal in autocross, even though the risk of damage is increased by driving that way.

Either one increases the risk of claims resulting from this type of driving. None of the accidents in the videos I posted above would have happened had the drivers not been driving aggressively. It's reasonable for an insurance company to consider that risk in determining whether to insure you.

Originally Posted by mdm

Also, autocross is advertised like this

That doesn't necessarily make it true.

Please note that I'm not saying that autocross is inherently dangerous. I'm saying that there is risk associated with any sort of racing, where you push the car and the driver to the limit, that would not be present if you don't race. The insurance company is insuring you based on their understanding of your risk profile. If you do something to increase the risk, you should expect to either pay more or be dropped, at the insurance company's discretion.

[mdm]

Originally Posted by extrashaky

The insurance company is insuring you based on their understanding of your risk profile. If you do something to increase the risk, you should expect to either pay more or be dropped, at the insurance company's discretion.

I think that we agree more than it may appear from our back and forth-s.

[zc06_kisstherain]

tape your license plate