Subaru BRZ Prototype Review by Car and Driver. Calls it a Knockout.

[Geard]

At the end of the day neither groups will see the others point of view as its stands the auto people enjoy that crazy amount of drivers feel they get from flicking a paddle and the manual people love the act of being in control, the speed they shift at the way the clutch is engaged and the tecnique involved in rev matching and heel toeing and the higher amount of "technicality and involvement driving a manual car requires"
So does driving a manual car make the driver much more involved and engaged with the car flat out yes it does. It requires more skill and precision to accomplish the same thing as a auto/dsg car of equivalent nature.:happy0180:

thats my 2cents love it or hate it but it is the truth.

[quik1987]

Originally Posted by SUB-FT86

I'm not against gay people but I am against people who make it seem like you must be gay to drive a automatic/dsg sports car.

Wow this thread has really gone through many topics!!

You take lots of value in what people you don't know think about you, and you're insecure about driving an automatic sports car. We get it.

[SUB-FT86]

Originally Posted by quik1987

You take lots of value in what people you don't know think about you, and you're insecure about driving an automatic sports car. We get it.

Me insecure? You're the one using sexual references to get your point across.

[quik1987]

Originally Posted by SUB-FT86

Why is it that everybody always relate driving a manual to being a manly man??? I know a gay guy who drives manual for a living. And as far as your sexual comment about auto's vs manual's that is the most retarded thing you can put on the internet. I wish you knew the women I have done in so you could ask them about me. I'm pretty sure there are manual drivers out there who get cheated on by there women by guys driving auto's. Trust me..

Just a bit.

[yayforaddison]

How did this even turn into an auto vs manual debate??

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1725

[dominican]

Originally Posted by 82mm 4g63

To play devil's advocate...

I'll take paddle shifters. While you're busy using that 2% of your brain pressing down on the clutch pedal, I'll invest that 2% of my brain in making sure I hit that apex at just the right spot. We're both 100% engaged in our race, only difference is you're tossing some of your concentration out the window where I'm optimizing my driving. In the end we're both satisfied. I'm satisfied that I did everything I could to improve my lap time, you're satisfied that you did more physical work to achieve a lesser goal.
:happy0180:

Driving a MT in traffic isn't "too much," it's more work than it needs to be. I'm not trying to impress girls in school by driving around in super cool MT car, I'm just trying to get to the store to pick up some milk. I don't need any added "feel" for my mindless drive to the store to get my milk. That's why I'm open to the idea of a high performance AT. It's fun when I want it to be, mindless when I don't.

Your post is actually very true. For racing, a paddle shifter is much better than 3 pedals. There's a reason why F1, Rally, and just about every other major race organization has cars with paddle shifters.You're also correct about not having to worry about shifting when getting the milk, and that with a high performance auto, you get all the enjoyment you want when you need it, and can zone out when you don't.

Also, I am not against these automatics as most other people are on this forum, but I can understand where they are coming from. Us MT guys are a dying breed, and we don't like our sports cars having auto slushboxes, it's a slap to our faces.

The thing auto guys don't seem to understand is that having the third pedal is about involvement. Everytime you get in the car is an event, something you have to use all of your limbs for. With respect to the people that have missing limbs, being an intricate part of the car is something that requires more attention than just mashing the gas pedal. Now I can understand that sometimes you just want to go in and drive somewhere without feeling like it's an event, but I can tell you, everytime I get in my car I enjoy it, and I know the same feeling is not present when the car is an automatic.

My girlfriend's dad had a G37S, with the slushbox, and I can report, it was good, very good. The shifts were crisp and quick, the paddle was responsive, the upshifts blipped the gas, it was outrageously good. However, I remember getting in to drive hime around a number of times, and the excitement just wasn't there, I just put it in auto and went about my business. Not having the third pedal to worry about was something that made the car less enjoyable.

Don't worry though, your A/T group is in good company, the head of the M division spells it out very well. He states that manuals are not good for the executive transporting clients around, since abrupt shifting or clutch mistakes can be embarrassing. So there, you can see, even in BMW's M division, you've got good company.

[S13Kuro]

Um, didn't this thread start as "Omg is Subie srs or r dey havinz a laff?"

On that note, has any light been shed on that? Any new info about the article in question?

[suprachica79]

Originally Posted by n2oinferno

I bet your parents didn't get you a graduation present when they found out you were using the incorrect forms of your/you're.

Who gives a shit what someone else's parents buy them? Personally if I had 20 grand it'd go into my son's college fund instead of a new car, but some people just have a ton of money and don't know what to do with it.

P.S. - If anyone reading this is one of those who have tons of money and don't know what to do with it, I'm accepting donations.

Of course, the one time I actually mess that up! I'm normally pretty good with grammar. Oh well.

[MiguelAE86]

Originally Posted by yayforaddison

There is nothing wrong with owning a nice car in school. Not to brag, but I was the kid in school known for driving the turbocharged Porsche
No one knew I paid for it tho because I was probably the only one who's parents didn't have money...

That's the thing. 90% of those cars are bought by the bank of mommy and daddy. I'm helping my dad with the payments of the 'R-S lol

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by yayforaddison

How did this even turn into an auto vs manual debate??

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1725

Always happens on this forum lol...

Personally I think manual is just infinitely cooler than auto and it makes me happy to see a manual car in America where everyone seems to have auto, but it's fine if other people want auto. Personal choice :P

[dominican]

Originally Posted by S13Kuro

Um, didn't this thread start as "Omg is Subie srs or r dey havinz a laff?"

On that note, has any light been shed on that? Any new info about the article in question?

It's been pretty much established that this has very unverified figures, and that it's basically a filler article until the car is released.

[82mm 4g63]

Originally Posted by dominican

Also, I am not against these automatics as most other people are on this forum, but I can understand where they are coming from. Us MT guys are a dying breed, and we don't like our sports cars having auto slushboxes, it's a slap to our faces.

The thing auto guys don't seem to understand is that having the third pedal is about involvement. Everytime you get in the car is an event, something you have to use all of your limbs for. With respect to the people that have missing limbs, being an intricate part of the car is something that requires more attention than just mashing the gas pedal. Now I can understand that sometimes you just want to go in and drive somewhere without feeling like it's an event, but I can tell you, everytime I get in my car I enjoy it, and I know the same feeling is not present when the car is an automatic.

My girlfriend's dad had a G37S, with the slushbox, and I can report, it was good, very good. The shifts were crisp and quick, the paddle was responsive, the upshifts blipped the gas, it was outrageously good. However, I remember getting in to drive hime around a number of times, and the excitement just wasn't there, I just put it in auto and went about my business. Not having the third pedal to worry about was something that made the car less enjoyable.

I have to agree and disagree. While more and more people are buying automatics, the percentage of manual drivers is surely decreasing...but that doesn't mean manufacturers are going to stop making performance cars with MTs. So what if there are fewer MT drivers as long as the MT cars are still there for me to buy?

Another thing I don't get is why we [MT drivers] give a crap about what Joe Schmoe driver is doing with his left foot. If I buy a Corvette and I'm driving around town loving my car and I see another Corvette, I'm not going to start wondering...hm I wonder if that ahole has an automatic or a manual. Truth is, I just don't give a crap what someone else has/drives. Their $, their choice.

There's no argument, an MT is more engaging than any other sort of automated transmission, but so what? It's not like I'm switching from first person to third person in a video game. I'm still in the car, shifting my gears with a paddle, turning my wheels with a steering wheel. Instead of 100% engaged, I'm 99.5% engaged? I can probably accept that. (I've only driven friends paddle shifted cars on short drives.) If I'm really that concerned with being one with my car, I might as well cut out the power steering and power everything else. I should have to feel those gears turning when I roll up my window. Or does that not count?

G37S are boring cars. My uncle has a 87 Grand National with an automatic transmission and every time we take it out we're freaking drunk with excitement. Don't blame the type of transmission a car has, because the car as a whole is boring. Even an MT G37S is boring, more engaging? Yes, but still boring.

To each his/her own. As far as the FRS is concerned, if I get one, it'll be MT only because they've said there won't be any high tech automatic option. So it really leaves just the MT. :happy0180:

[Hawx]

I don't see a great deal of point towards this argument... it's clear no one is changing anyone's minds and everyone has their own opinion and preferences. This is like an argument on youtube.... it's pointless, and annoying. I get that it's a thing of passion MT is more involved, AT is more convenient. Different people and different walks of life. But c'mon really? we all share something in common, we have an interest in these cars. So let's talk about more important things like how Subaru is tooting it's own horn! How dare they the bastards!!!! LOL

@82mm Completely agree!

[velocity]

I have been following this car for a while. I have really liked the concepts from Toyota/Scion. Over the past few weeks, i'm starting to lean towards getting a 370z. This is turning out to be an ugly, under-powered subaru. My RX-8 has "232HP" and 0-60 in 6sec. I'm not going to pay more for a toyota/subaru that has worse performance!! The front looks good, but the tail lights are terrible!!!