New internal combustion car sales to be banned in UK in 15 years

[WolfpackS2k]

^^smog from leaded fuel and lack of catalytic converters has nothing to do with the CO2 boogie man. That's a completely different (and valid) argument.

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k

^^smog from leaded fuel and lack of catalytic converters has nothing to do with the CO2 boogie man. That's a completely different (and valid) argument.

It kinda has everything to do with it.

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

It kinda has everything to do with it.

Um, human health (toxic emissions) and CO2 emissions are opposing goals. If cars could run super high compression ratio lean burn with no cats and stratified injection pumping out soot and NOx like diesel trucks, CO2 would be WAY down.

Likewise, if you were allowed to run leaded gasoline, you could also make more efficient engines.

CO2 emissions and greenhouse effect are also not exactly the same thing as you mentioned earlier in the thread. We produce a lot more natural gas in this country now, which reduces CO2 emissions from power plants...but some estimates say methane leakage is cancelling out the GHG reduction.

It's not that hard, there are different types of chemicals humans emit into the air, and they are...different.

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

Um, human health (toxic emissions) and CO2 emissions are opposing goals. If cars could run super high compression ratio lean burn with no cats and stratified injection pumping out soot and NOx like diesel trucks, CO2 would be WAY down.

Likewise, if you were allowed to run leaded gasoline, you could also make more efficient engines.

CO2 emissions and greenhouse effect are also not exactly the same thing as you mentioned earlier in the thread. We produce a lot more natural gas in this country now, which reduces CO2 emissions from power plants...but some estimates say methane leakage is cancelling out the GHG reduction.

It's not that hard, there are different types of chemicals humans emit into the air, and they are...different.

I just meant that catalytic converters convert carbon monoxide into CO2, among other things. It’s better they do than don’t, but that goal of reducing smog kinda gets us to our CO2 issues.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k

^^smog from leaded fuel and lack of catalytic converters has nothing to do with the CO2 boogie man. That's a completely different (and valid) argument.

They are all part of the overall environmental puzzle and can not be separated out as irrelevant even in the C02 discussion. The reduction of smog was an obvious first step to addressing the whole picture.

[Lantanafrs2]

In 20 yrs the planet will be so hot that it will function as it's own catalytic converter lol

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Lantanafrs2

In 20 yrs the planet will be so hot that it will function as it's own catalytic converter lol

Won't bother me. I will either be dead or senile.

[WolfpackS2k]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

They are all part of the overall environmental puzzle and can not be separated out as irrelevant even in the C02 discussion. The reduction of smog was an obvious first step to addressing the whole picture.

No because they cause entirely different atmospheric interactions. One was a pollutant/toxin by its very definition. Another is an excess (in some peoples' view) of a gas necessary for life on this planet to exist. Would you also lump particulate matter into that grouping as well? And your own exhalations and bowel movements? Since you exhale CO2 as a function of living, and methane from...well, you know

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k

No because they cause entirely different atmospheric interactions. One was a pollutant/toxin by its very definition. Another is an excess (in some peoples' view) of a gas necessary for life on this planet to exist. Would you also lump particulate matter into that grouping as well? And your own exhalations and bowel movements? Since you exhale CO2 as a function of living, and methane from...well, you know

Yes. That is how puzzles work. There are a whole bunch of individual and totally unique pieces that interlock to combine one big picture. You can not just throw away some of the pieces and say they are irrelevant since you can guess what the picture is without them.

[WolfpackS2k]

Glad you see it that way, because by itself CO2 does almost nothing beyond 2 degrees temp change.

So now we can move on to real problems.

[Lantanafrs2]

Thank God buggy manufacturers and horse ranches didn't have online forums when internal combustion began to take off.

[Sasquachulator]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Won't bother me. I will either be dead or senile.

HOW
DARE
YOU!!!

> <

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Lantanafrs2

Thank God buggy manufacturers and horse ranches didn't have online forums when internal combustion began to take off.

[Lantanafrs2]

I think manufacturers want to move away from the complexities of ice (number of moving parts, plating, heat treating etc). I don't think it's all climate motivated. It does make for a nice virtue signal though.