06-27-2013, 02:51 PM | #99 | |
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06-27-2013, 02:58 PM | #100 | |
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Pimpin. |
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06-27-2013, 03:56 PM | #101 |
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06-27-2013, 04:01 PM | #102 | |
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06-27-2013, 04:03 PM | #103 |
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Isn't that a Festiva?
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06-27-2013, 04:17 PM | #104 |
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06-27-2013, 04:35 PM | #105 |
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I was taking a close look at the Fiesta ST and was cross-shopping it with the BRZ I bought a couple of weeks ago. The Focus ST is heavier and with less power than my lightly modded 2004 WRX and I wanted something lighter and presumably more nimble, so the Fiesta ST really got my attention. With 4 doors and a hatch rear, it made a lot of practical sense. Plus, being in Buffalo I did have some concerns about having a RWD car for the winters here.
But the one thing I worried about is the fact that the Fiesta ST does not have an independent rear suspension - like the Veloster Turbo. My one joy on my commute is the occasional empty onramp. And many here have either expansion joints or medium sized bumps. I feared the Fiesta ST's rear would bounce around unpredictably on these bumps, marring that bit of indulgence. Otherwise, it certainly looks like a car with good mpg, practical rear seats and interior space, and a hoot to drive. As an aside, it cracks me up when people say a "track" test like this is only fair when using stock tires. As if anyone who actually goes to the track only uses stock tires, or if enthusiastic street driving even comes close to reaching a car's limits like on a roadcourse... The actual comments by the driver in this video tell you a lot more than a ~1 sec difference in track time and can hardly be interpreted as favoring one car as significantly superior to the other. |
06-27-2013, 04:48 PM | #106 |
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06-27-2013, 04:50 PM | #107 | |
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06-27-2013, 04:58 PM | #108 | |
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06-27-2013, 05:27 PM | #109 | |
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As for $, I didn't feel there would be that much difference. I got my BRZ premium for about $2k off MSRP, or around $23,500 (this was why I ultimately didn't wait for the release of the Fiesta ST). If I were to get a Fiesta, it would have been very soon after it hit the US market, because my wife would have spent my bonus $ any later than that . So I didn't expect anything less than MSRP, which is now stated to be $21,400. The option package prices aren't listed yet, but I figured it'd be similar to the Focus ST package prices. The ST3 trim with HID lights, Recaro seats and navigation is $4,435, or a total of $25,835 MSRP. These are just approximations, of course, but in my mind there wasn't much of a price difference. |
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06-27-2013, 07:38 PM | #110 | ||
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FWD these days is all about fuel economy and weight, performance models of FWD cars have a lot of fun with the concept, but there's no comparison in terms of the performance advantage of RWD or AWD over FWD when you're comparing similar vehicles. You can soup up a lawnmower and get awesome track times but it's still a lawnmower. There's a reason [insert exotic/muscle/pony car here] doesn't make an FWD. But FWD is great of putting more power (or fuel economy, which has largely started to trump performance with CAFE) in the hands of consumers with skinnier wallets. That's why I bought an SRT-4 for $21k in Germany and not an M3. FWD is what it isn't. There are clear trade-offs. In this case, there's a reason why many more seasoned reviews rave about the twins being superb and balanced automobiles/driver's cars versus being fast cars., and why other reviews have a one-sided "speed is everything" narrative. Same has gone for the Miata and other roadsters before it. There's undeniably been a shift in performance car culture towards speed at the expense of balanced automobiles. |
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06-27-2013, 08:18 PM | #111 |
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This thread in one post:
Fiesta ST is better than the GT86...OMG Tires on GT86 suck...no surprise FWD still sucks...RWD rulez GT86 looks better tho! FWD can be close or equal to RWD when set up right There is no big difference between FWD and RWD on the track or the street But RWD is more fun and feels better! I want a Fiesta (aka the "babyshoe") Last edited by Lonewolf; 06-27-2013 at 09:25 PM. Reason: Added another item |
06-27-2013, 08:44 PM | #112 |
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I'm a believer in RWD if only for the classic driving dynamics/techniques it allows you to use.
FWD can be fast, but it is dynamically inferior. There are many things that can be done to negate that inferiority, but the fact remains that you have to do more with less (turn and go), and that as you accelerate the grip shifts to the non-drive wheels. Now. That doesn't mean that with the particular limitations of a specific chassis fwd won't be faster (look at the Audi TT endurance racers that get converted to FWD because the weight reduction makes the car faster than the AWD system), or that you can't modify to seriously negate the disadvantages (Huge slicks in front, skinny rear tires ala tons of track Civics) but given a blank slate, ground up design made purely for speed, RWD or in some cases, AWD is going to be faster, or at least more consistently fast as it uses it's tires more effectively. You don't see FWD hypercars and you don't see FWD Formula 1 cars. Whether that has much relevance to the current conversation is up for dabate. Given two platforms with all kinds of design compromises between them due to material, packaging, technological, and cost constraints and when it comes to pure speed or driving fun I'd guess the competency of the individual engineering teams is going to have a bigger part than layout choice. I know that I personally love the feeling of driving a RWD car, and even really great FWD cars just don't have the same "feel." That in no way means a FWD car can't be a boatload of fun. I'd personally love to build a stripped out track civic hatchback for grins, just because stupid lightweight stupid grippy, properly setup fwd cars do have their charms and I'd like to learn how to drive fast on ANY platform. Cheers Nathan |
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