Just another day at the track... Streets of Willow Springs

[ayau]

Originally Posted by Matt Andrews

mike-

I'll get my video up shortly. We need to get some data on your video. Find a used ipod touch or phone and get harry's lap timer. You do that, I'll spot you an igloo case.

Your times were significantly faster than mine, so I won't I notice is that I am still driving a horsepower line, not a momentum one. I think I see where I am loosing time. (that, and I'm on 4000mi old rs3's.) I would be really curious to swap your 225 RS3s with my 255's and see where the differences are. I wonder if in the summer, the difference is much smaller. I remember in 100 deg heat, even the 255's were getting greasy.

Looking forward to swapping cars at the next event.

Do you think 255 rs3s are too wide for this car? In other words, do you think the 255 rs3s are running at its optimum operating temperature?

[rice_classic]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

I completely agree that a pyrometer is necessary to properly adjust camber for maximum grip, but in the interest of saving $$$, we're adjusting based on wear instead. Is it the fastest setup? No, but we have to try to keep the costs under control.

Mike... Seriously great freakin' lap... I watched it 3 times in a row. Terrific driving.

But can't afford a $110 Pyrometer to go with your $$$$ brake kit or your $700 Aim Solo? I'm not buying that for 1 second!!! In the words of the fat kid from The Sandlot: "You're killin' me Smalls!"

The trick to the pyrometer though is that you can't afford a cool down lap, you need someone to help you take the temps after a hot lap and immediately otherwise the temps "bleed" across the contact patch so thus you will need a 2nd hand and having a 2nd hand isn't always an option.

I bet these tires need more camber not necessarily because of the tire in-and-of themselves but also because of the Mac struts up front which offer no dynamic camber curve (unlike the rear). I wouldn't be surprised after some pyrometer readings that the front requires significantly more negative camber than the rear.

[Matt Andrews]

Originally Posted by ayau

Do you think 255 rs3s are too wide for this car? In other words, do you think the 255 rs3s are running at its optimum operating temperature?

its hard to give a definitive answer without testing other sizes. But, here is my belief: In the summer, with sunny, 100 deg days, the 255 was an advantage as it was dissipating heat. Maybe the extra weight slowed it down, but I bet it is pretty close. In the 40 deg overcast track days of the previous weekend, the car didn't need the heat dissipation. And the lighter 225 was the right ticket. Stretching the 225 probably also helps stiffen the sidewall.

But this is all internet keyboard jockeying until we can run some tests. Not sure when I'm going back out Mike. I'm sending my AST's back for a revalve and damper body length "adjustment". What about you?

matt

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by Matt Andrews

what speed do you exit bus stop?

78ish "clean", 82-83 with 2 off on the exit. Cutting somewhat aggressively... and I think I have room to get faster there. I'm just scared of bending wheels :p

[twincamRob]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

Alignment:
-3.0 camber front
-2.4 camber rear
1/16" total toe-in front
1/16" total toe-in rear

..

What's the reason for toe in on the front?

I always set my cars up either 0 or 1/16"-1/8" total out up front and 1/16"-1/8" total in on the rear. Coming from an S2000 this was the "ideal" setup for street/track and it always felt great (on the S and FR-S) and had good even tire wear.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by twincamRob

What's the reason for toe in on the front?

I always set my cars up either 0 or 1/16"-1/8" total out up front and 1/16"-1/8" total in on the rear. Coming from an S2000 this was the "ideal" setup for street/track and it always felt great (on the S and FR-S) and had good even tire wear.

Just trying something new...

[gmookher]

Originally Posted by twincamRob

What's the reason for toe in on the front?

I always set my cars up either 0 or 1/16"-1/8" total out up front and 1/16"-1/8" total in on the rear. Coming from an S2000 this was the "ideal" setup for street/track and it always felt great (on the S and FR-S) and had good even tire wear.

This has been experimented


Toe in up front will hurt your cornering.
Stop that.
Run no toe or a little out up front
No toe in in the rear unless you're laying down more power than tire

[robispec]

Toe in front yeah everyting on the internet is true gospel!

[twincamRob]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

Just trying something new...

Gotcha. Wasn't sure if there was a reason, like to counter act some bushing 'deflection' or something under braking or something else.

Originally Posted by robispec

Toe in front yeah everyting on the internet is true
gospel!

My internet sarcasm detector is broken, care to elaborate as I'm sure you know a lot more about alignment setups than I do?

[bpracer]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

Alignment:
-3.0 camber front
-2.4 camber rear
1/16" total toe-in front
1/16" total toe-in rear

What kind of caster are you running on the front? That's more front camber than I was expecting, compared to the back, that is.

Stock sway bars? Or, did you disconnect the rear bar? Somebody here was running without the rear bar... as I recall.

SOW looks rougher than I would have expected.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by bpracer

What kind of caster are you running on the front? That's more front camber than I was expecting, compared to the back, that is.

Stock sway bars? Or, did you disconnect the rear bar? Somebody here was running without the rear bar... as I recall.

SOW looks rougher than I would have expected.

I don't remember caster... (I wasn't present when the alignment was done), but IIRC, it's on the lower side of the adjustment range.

Sways are both stock and still connected.

SoWS is very rough. It just eats tires.

[robispec]

Originally Posted by twincamRob

My internet sarcasm detector is broken, care to elaborate as I'm sure you know a lot more about alignment setups than I do?

if i see the alignment being done then i know what the spec is otherwise it is ALL on faith...

[Ro_Ja]

How are you adjusting your rear camber? Do you have rear lateral links?

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by Ro_Ja

How are you adjusting your rear camber? Do you have rear lateral links?

We're not. That's just the result of the ride height change (-1.4"). All of our suspension components are stock, although I think we'll eventually need to get camber arms at some point to dial in the car more.