BRZ vs FRS - The Debate

[TAP Auto Parts]

Wow you guys really took my dont take things to seriously advice.

We are all here because we love the 86, no need for name calling.

[Rayme]

Originally Posted by jmaryt

no,but i think you are! "numbnuts!"
don't use the lord's name in vain!
it's bad "karma" just sayin'

I like you, you're old and you don't give a f*ck.

I'm slowly going your way lol

[Obioban]

Buying this car in this automatic strikes me as entirely missing the point of what the car is all about.

The FRZ/BRZ/86 is SLOW. It's a sports car because it creates an involving driving experience. Getting the manual has nothing to do with being a couple of tenths quicker, and everything to do with a more involved experience. Getting the car with an automatic completely defeats the point of owning the car, imo.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by Obioban

Buying this car in this automatic strikes me as entirely missing the point of what the car is all about.

The FRZ/BRZ/86 is SLOW. It's a sports car because it creates an involving driving experience. Getting the manual has nothing to do with being a couple of tenths quicker, and everything to do with a more involved experience. Getting the car with an automatic completely defeats the point of owning the car, imo.

if the auto entirely misses the point are you saying that the whole point of this car is shifting? i was under the impression that its the handling that this car is about, which is not changed by the transmission.

[Obioban]

Originally Posted by fatoni

if the auto entirely misses the point are you saying that the whole point of this car is shifting? i was under the impression that its the handling that this car is about, which is not changed by the transmission.

Driver involvement is what the car is about, of which handling is ONE aspect. Others include seat position (low to the ground), engine dynamics (low torque high revving power, which incidentally is heavily related to why a manual is key to the experience (low torque means you have to work for it to stay in the power band)), weight, brake feel, steering feel, and... transmission feel.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by Obioban

Driver involvement is what the car is about, of which handling is ONE aspect. Others include seat position (low to the ground), engine dynamics (low torque high revving power, which incidentally is heavily related to why a manual is key to the experience (low torque means you have to work for it to stay in the power band)), weight, brake feel, steering feel, and... transmission feel.

you mentioned many things that sums the point of this car. the auto is only lacking in one of these categories (and even that one is debatable). i dont see how it misses the point entirely if the handling, seating position, engine dynamics, weight, brakes and steering matter because its exactly the same for both manual and autos. i think a big plus of the auto is that you get to keep your hands on the steering wheel. with your hand on the shifter, steering feel is compromised.

im not saying i want an auto, im just saying that there is nothing wrong with it.

[einzlr]

Originally Posted by fatoni

you mentioned many things that sums the point of this car. the auto is only lacking in one of these categories (and even that one is debatable). i dont see how it misses the point entirely if the handling, seating position, engine dynamics, weight, brakes and steering matter because its exactly the same for both manual and autos. i think a big plus of the auto is that you get to keep your hands on the steering wheel. with your hand on the shifter, steering feel is compromised.

im not saying i want an auto, im just saying that there is nothing wrong with it.

Well, normally you'd move your hand back to the steering wheel between shifts.

Except maybe in stop-and-go traffic, in which case steering feel becomes all but irrelevant. Rush hour ftl

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by einzlr

Well, normally you'd move your hand back to the steering wheel between shifts.

Except maybe in stop-and-go traffic, in which case steering feel becomes all but irrelevant. Rush hour ftl

either way there is more time with one hand on the shifter in a manual than in an auto. i dont think a good auto takes much from the driving experience. the only argument people make is that its taking control from the driver and giving it to a computer but i dont see people complaining about fuel injection, abs, synchros, variable timing, power steering, rev limiters etc. its a slippery slope of an argument and people are just trying to push their opinions on to others. i try to keep my personal preference out of these debates

[slowbrz]

simply put , manual enhances the driving experience; not required to have fun

[dem00n]

Originally Posted by fatoni

either way there is more time with one hand on the shifter in a manual than in an auto. i dont think a good auto takes much from the driving experience. the only argument people make is that its taking control from the driver and giving it to a computer but i dont see people complaining about fuel injection, abs, synchros, variable timing, power steering, rev limiters etc. its a slippery slope of an argument and people are just trying to push their opinions on to others. i try to keep my personal preference out of these debates

Manual and Auto are both great for this car, there is absolutely no wrong with either the FRS or BRZ. Only after modifications can ruin the car...as with any car of course.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by dem00n

Manual and Auto are both great for this car, there is absolutely no wrong with either the FRS or BRZ. Only after modifications can ruin the car...as with any car of course.

did you go to the death tribute show? paul masvidal is the shit

[dem00n]

Originally Posted by fatoni

did you go to the death tribute show? paul masvidal is the shit

Sadly no, i was too young to even seem them live when Chuck was alive.

Though i'm sure they will do another one eventually.

[einzlr]

Originally Posted by fatoni

either way there is more time with one hand on the shifter in a manual than in an auto. i dont think a good auto takes much from the driving experience. the only argument people make is that its taking control from the driver and giving it to a computer but i dont see people complaining about fuel injection, abs, synchros, variable timing, power steering, rev limiters etc. its a slippery slope of an argument and people are just trying to push their opinions on to others. i try to keep my personal preference out of these debates

Well, hehe, I would gladly do without some of those things you list.

What sets the transmission type apart from those features is that there's a choice (not with all cars, of course). And it's undeniable that there's a huge emotional element to working a MT. IOW for some people missing that *does* take a lot from the driving experience, no matter how good the AT option might be.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by dem00n

Sadly no, i was too young to even seem them live when Chuck was alive.

Though i'm sure they will do another one eventually.

haha how old are you? this was like 6 months ago

Originally Posted by einzlr

Well, hehe, I would gladly do without some of those things you list.

What sets the transmission type apart from those features is that there's a choice (not with all cars, of course). And it's undeniable that there's a huge emotional element to working a MT. IOW for some people missing that *does* take a lot from the driving experience, no matter how good the AT option might be.

i get that but you cant say that the manual misses the point of this car because some people miss the auto. i am one of those people but opinions arent transferable from person to person